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shooting .223 in a AR 5.56
BowGunHunter
Member Posts: 156 ✭✭✭
I've searched this topic and read about the differences in both calibers as far a pressures and what can shoot what in each gun.
Here is my question. I was given alot of ammo. Probably 1000 rounds of .223 and 1000 rounds of 5.56. I don't have either gun but I am looking to buy an AR.
If I understand it, it is ok to shoot .223 in a 5.56 but not ok to shoot 5.56 in a .223.
Is there a gun that handles both better than others? or will they all be about the same? How about accuracy? Will the .223 in a 5.56 be just as accurate or just just acceptable as a plinker? Will I notice any difference?
Thanks for the help.
Here is my question. I was given alot of ammo. Probably 1000 rounds of .223 and 1000 rounds of 5.56. I don't have either gun but I am looking to buy an AR.
If I understand it, it is ok to shoot .223 in a 5.56 but not ok to shoot 5.56 in a .223.
Is there a gun that handles both better than others? or will they all be about the same? How about accuracy? Will the .223 in a 5.56 be just as accurate or just just acceptable as a plinker? Will I notice any difference?
Thanks for the help.
Comments
Also I like 1/9 twist. It will shoot up to 68/69 grain bullets. And mine shoot 50,52,55 grain bullets well enough for prairie dogs.
Have fun.
Colt's can handle anything. An RRA with the Wylde chamber will handle either round safely AND accurately.
Do a SEARCH on "AR" on this forum, & you should find a lot of discussion of this subject.
Neal
EDIT: Rufe-snow makes a good point. Many of us have used both combinations without incident for years. But, I stick to standard loadings & standard rifles. I think if you try to stuff 5.56 NATO rounds into a bolt action .223 match chamber, you might have problems. If you load 68/69 gr bullets to a higher OAL than recommended, you may have functioning problems in some rifles. If you aren't sure of what you are doing, it's best to stick to a load that matches the manufacturers recommendations.
I sincerely believe this business about not shooting 5.56 in .223 chambered rifles. As well as 7.62 X 51 in .308 chambered rifles, or vice versa, is just a lot of gun shop commando BS, or old wives tales. I have yet to see or hear of any commercial rifle in good condition with out a obstructed bore being damaged by doing this, let alone kabooming and injuring the firer.
I'll second that.
quote:Originally posted by rufe-snow
I sincerely believe this business about not shooting 5.56 in .223 chambered rifles. As well as 7.62 X 51 in .308 chambered rifles, or vice versa, is just a lot of gun shop commando BS, or old wives tales. I have yet to see or hear of any commercial rifle in good condition with out a obstructed bore being damaged by doing this, let alone kabooming and injuring the firer.
I'll second that.
I won't.
I did it for years and got away with it too. But, I always noticed the 5.56 rounds had REALLY flat primers when shot through a .223 chamber. And, until it was brought to my attention, what the difference was, (pressure of loaded rounds {of equal dimensions on the outside}).
Understand there are differences when you look at rounds in the 'white' boxes (or black if Federal) gunshop. The ones' that say .223 Rem are de-milled. The ones that say 5.56 are not. They are loaded to about 2000-4000 psi higher than .223 Rem. I have had a number of primers rupture with these. Not a majority, barely even a minority, but an accountable number. What didn't rupture, the primers were all very flat. I know I would back off those rounds if I was reloading. So after much ado, that's what I say now. Don't shoot 5.56 in .223 chambers.
As far as the .308/7.62x51 NATO goes, it's the other way around. .308 is hotter than 7.62x51 so don't shoot the .308 in 7.62 NATO
I haven't seen one single instance of disastrous failure. But, looking for failure is bound to find it. I wouldn't.
I did it for years and got away with it too. But, I always noticed the 5.56 rounds had REALLY flat primers when shot through a .223 chamber. And, until it was brought to my attention, what the difference was, (pressure of loaded rounds {of equal dimensions on the outside}).
Understand there are differences when you look at rounds in the 'white' boxes (or black if Federal) gunshop. The ones' that say .223 Rem are de-milled. The ones that say 5.56 are not. They are loaded to about 2000-4000 psi higher than .223 Rem. I have had a number of primers rupture with these. Not a majority, barely even a minority, but an accountable number. What didn't rupture, the primers were all very flat. I know I would back off those rounds if I was reloading. So after much ado, that's what I say now. Don't shoot 5.56 in .223 chambers.
As far as the .308/7.62x51 NATO goes, it's the other way around. .308 is hotter than 7.62x51 so don't shoot the .308 in 7.62 NATO
I haven't seen one single instance of disastrous failure. But, looking for failure is bound to find it. I wouldn't.
It might have a baring on the type of ammo you have been using also. Years ago when I still owned a original Costa Mesa AR 180, had all kinds of trouble with a bunch of Norma ammo I had bought. Now Norma is famous for their high quality pricey ammo. This lot of military 5.56 was absolute crap, it constantly blew/punctured primers when all other ammo both commercial .223 and military worked just fine in the Armilite.
You can do what you want as far as this matter concerned though. The only bone I have to pick is with these guys on mostly other boards who blow so much smoke about this subject they have convinced a lot of the newbies that their firearms will self destruct if you dare to shoot .223 in a AR type rifle or the same thing in .308, as I mentioned in the previous post.
The 5.56 barrels usually have a 1 in 7 to 1 in 9 twist, to make use of bullets up to 80 grains. The throats are longer. Yes, some 5.56 ammo use the 55 FMJ loads...actually most of it does. However, if a longer bullet of the 69 or 75 grain 5.56, is jammed into the lands upon chambering in a 223 chamber, this will SEVERLY rais the chamber pressures, as the 5.56 is loaded to slightly higher pressures anyway. This is similar to shooting a 45 colt or 44 magnum in a 410 shotgun. It has been done for years, by those without the know. There have been guns blowed up. In no means is it EXPERT advice to shoot any 5.56 in a 223 chamber. I am a little dissappointed with some of the replies on here on that subject.
Best
http://le.atk.com/pdf/223VS556.pdf
question for tsr1965: if a person has a RRA AR15 with a 1 in 9 twist rate would this chamber have the longer throat to accomadate the heavier projectiles?
That would depend on what designation is stamped on the lower reciever...5.56 or 223. However, most RRA's have the Wylde chamber, which can take both 5.56, or 223 and shoot both well. There is another thread on here from the real recent past which describes the chamber dimensions of the various 223, and 5.56 chamber's. This is coppied from a post from our moderator Nononsense on that particular thread:
quote:HOLLIGER ON .223/5.56 CHAMBERS
Here are just a few of the chamber reamers that I have prints for. There are hundreds of .223/5.56 chamber dimensions and I always get a kick out of people arguing over whether a rifle has a .223 or a 5.56 chamber. Just because it has a .223 chamber, does not mean it's the same as another rifle with a .223 chamber. Both reamers may say .223 on them, but they may be very much different. Also, everyone just knows the .223 is smaller than the 5.56, well the 5.56 Target chamber is smaller in about every dimension than the .223 Wylde.
The COAL for the 80 grain SMK is an ESTIMATE based on bullet empirical data and from chamber prints. The actual COAL in your rifle may be different, even though it has that specified chamber. The number is supplied to help identify a chamber if it is unknown or as an aid in selecting the proper chamber reamer (bullet seated further out means you can get more powder in the case).
Chamber / Freebore / Lead Angle / 80SMK OAL/ Comments
5.56 Target .0566 1 deg,13 min 2.465 This was designed by a C. Hildebrandt at Savage. I believe it is used in the savage .223 rifles. I do not have this reamer, but it should work well for HP.
.223 JGS#514 .025 3 deg,10 min 2.435 I believe this is used by Krieger and Mike Bykowski. I use it for slow twist varmint uppers but I think it is a little short, and too steep of a lead for HP.
.223 Wylde .0619 1 deg,15 min 2.475 Designed by Bill Wylde. Shoots everything good, and has slightly generous body dimensions for reliability. Eats anything you put in it.
.223 Holliger .106 1 deg,15 min 2.530 Designed for the 90 JLK. The longer throat allows a little more velocity.
5.56 CLE .025 1 deg,30 min 2.450 Of course we all know Frank's rifles shoot just fine!
5.56 Bushmaster .0250 1 deg,30 min 2.450-
2.475 Info from Bushmaster (thanks!). These are one of the best out-of-the box barrels, and handle up to 80 gr bullets no problemo.
Best.
Best