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Refinnishing model 1917 parts...
fastcarsgofast
Member Posts: 7,179
I have in my possession and may soon purchase an Eddystone 1917. I would say that the barrel and receiver have about 90% blueing left. However, the butt plate, floor plate, trigger guard, and bolt handle all either some rust and pitting or a very dark brown patina. As far as I can tell the rifle is all original parts. The barrel is marked with an E and dated 10 1917 and all the other major parts are marked with an E as well. The receiver (according to oldguns.net) was made in December 1917. The stock is original military issue.
OK, now the question. If I refinish the patinaed and pitted parts will I destroy the value of the rifle? If I buy it I want to make sure that it will last in my family for generations to come. Also, does anybody know why only these parts would rust and not the entire rifle?
OK, now the question. If I refinish the patinaed and pitted parts will I destroy the value of the rifle? If I buy it I want to make sure that it will last in my family for generations to come. Also, does anybody know why only these parts would rust and not the entire rifle?
Comments
Yes, the M1917 is a really nice, collectible USGI rifle IF
original condition, & that includes arsenal rebuilt rifles. But, a gun that has been neglected or abused has no value other than as a shooter. It can't be restored, & it could easily become a "money pit".
In the antique furniture world, "patina" is a good thing; but, in the gun world, it's just a nice word for "wear", "rust", or "the place where rust was removed with steel wool". Different types of steel are used for just about every rifle part, so they will rust under different conditions. However, those parts most likely to be touched will rust faster due to the oil in our fingers. Also, those parts (like the butt plate) that are close to the concrete floor in the basement will tend to rust quickly. Yes, just about any gunsmith can remove the rust & refinish metal parts, but they will never look "original", or even like arsenal replacements.
The stock is military, but not original. SA=Springfield Armory, AA=Augusta Arsenal, both followed by an inspectors initials; other markings are unknown inspectors marks. I assume that there is no cartouche (as you didn't post photos), but it sound like an arsenal replacement stock to me.
This rifle will never be a family heirloom; give it back if the asking price is > $200.
Neal
reindeer
it could easily become a "money pit".
Ask me about my '66 MGB. [B)]
In general terms, there were approximately 2,200,000 Eddystones produced. I emphasize the 'approximately' so that the nitpickers don't castigate me for a minor variation in numbers.
There are lots of ways to think about older rifles whether they are battle veterans or merely old. Old now becomes a term to attach some relativity to unfortunately. People seem to think that everything is collectible when in truth not much really is. So the resolution to your problem is easy.
"If I refinish the patinaed and pitted parts will I destroy the value of the rifle?"
Refinishing a collectible firearm will always lower its value, so you have to establish if there is any REAL value, not a conjured value, in the first place. In the condition it's in, is it collectible at all? If it is, then leave it alone and find a collector that will give you or the owner the price commanded by the market. If there's no REAL market value, then I think you can exercise some alternatives.
If you have any skills at all, you might be able to take the parts that are rusted or pitted and do some saving all by yourself. Most of this isn't hard but it can get to be tedious depending on the detail required. Shallow pits can sometimes be carefully removed but if they are too deep, a good (careful) media blast will get the rust in the bottom of the pit out. Then you can sand to match the other parts, hot blue the parts and coat them with oil. By careful cleaning (always remove any fingerprints) and very light applications of oil in the future, you can help maintain something like this for your next generations.
Best.
ADDED:
fastcarsgofast,
Your current post might make this a horse of a different color! Let's see what the collectors have to say now that we know it came out of cosmoline.
Best.
Yes, the M1917 is a really nice, collectible USGI rifle IF
original condition, & that includes arsenal rebuilt rifles. But, a gun that has been neglected or abused has no value other than as a shooter. It can't be restored, & it could easily become a "money pit".
In the antique furniture world, "patina" is a good thing; but, in the gun world, it's just a nice word for "wear", "rust", or "the place where rust was removed with steel wool". Different types of steel are used for just about every rifle part, so they will rust under different conditions. However, those parts most likely to be touched will rust faster due to the oil in our fingers. Also, those parts (like the butt plate) that are close to the concrete floor in the basement will tend to rust quickly. Yes, just about any gunsmith can remove the rust & refinish metal parts, but they will never look "original", or even like arsenal replacements.
The stock is military, but not original. SA=Springfield Armory, AA=Augusta Arsenal, both followed by an inspectors initials; other markings are unknown inspectors marks. I assume that there is no cartouche (as you didn't post photos), but it sound like an arsenal replacement stock to me.
This rifle will never be a family heirloom; give it back if the asking price is > $200.
Neal
There are several markings on the stock. Forgive my ignorance but I'm not certain what cartouche you are speaking of. As far as photos I will try to post some later but my camera is only 3.5 mega pixels and doesn't do so well on finer details. I appreciate all the help. The potential seller is asking $400.00 for the rifle. It was still covered in cosmoline when he gave it to me to inspect. He said I could clean her up if I wanted rather I bought it or not. It was quite a thrill to tear down the war horse and upon further inspection it was just dried cosmoline on the floor plate. Unfortunately, that was not the case with the trigger guard, butt plate, and bolt handle. The rest of the bolt is excellent however. I realize that any refinished parts will not match the rest of the rifle but I was more concerned with preserving the metal itself. Oh, and BTW the bore is immaculate!
Edit: Never mind about the photos. As usual I can't seem to get the lighting right to pick up the details. With the flash they get drowned out but without it it's too dark. I can't seem to get the ambient lighting right. Sorry.
If the rifle were mine, I'd try replacing the bad parts, as refinished parts will always show where the rusty/pitted steel is missing. The part that will be most difficult to find (& expensive) is the bolt; the others may not be that bad. But, it's your choice.
While parts for a 1917 are not common, there are still a few dealers out there who have them. Check the auctions & local gun shows. You might want to try: http://www.poppertsgunparts.com/
As for photos, it isn't the pixels that count. I have an old camera that has, maybe, 200 pixels, but it takes great close-ups; that's because the lens will focus down to 1 1/2". If your camera fits in your shirt pocket, it probably can't take decent close-ups. At the least, check the owners manual & see if you have a "macro" mode. Always switch your flash off when photographing guns. I shoot pics on my work bench, directly under twin overhead fluorescents, & hold a small fluorescent shop light just out of camera range for fill lighting.
Neal