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Duplicate Serial Numbers for Winchester 94s

Texas BearTexas Bear Member Posts: 59 ✭✭
edited November 2013 in Ask the Experts
Some time ago I sent in a request for CFM information for a Winchester 1892. I had mis-read the SN and send the incorrect number. (So it is not one of mine.) When I received the information back it indicated there were possibly two different guns with the same SN, and possibly others with duplicate SNs. Are there verified cased where there are duplicate SNs?
This is what I received from CFM:

Win. 1892, SN 92814
Date in: 5-5-1898
Type: Carbine
Caliber: 44
Date shipped: 5-23-1898
Order: 347

Date in: 11-23-1898
Type: Rifle
Caliber: 38
Barrel: Round
Trigger: Plain
Date shipped: 11-23-1898
Order: 15872

The records are unclear whether there are two with that SN or that the carbine was changed. There is no return notation on the ledger but it doesn't specify a second gun either. There are another two or three on that page with the second record on 11-23-1898.
End of CFM Message. [?]
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Comments

  • 11b6r11b6r Member Posts: 16,584 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    SNs were not required by law until 1968 on rifles. And a serial number is not unique to only one gun in the world (or they would be dozens of digits long.

    If I read what you wrote correctly, those are two different guns- one a carbine, one a rifle.
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  • Texas BearTexas Bear Member Posts: 59 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    The CFM records show the same serial number on a carbine and on a rifle. Thus, either the carbine was sent back to change to a rifle, and 44 to 38, caliber, or two different guns had the same serial number. When I clarified with CFM, they added the bottom note stating some other guns listed showed the same issue. These are both Winchester 92's and Winchester kept detailed records of the production and shipping.
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  • Bert H.Bert H. Member Posts: 11,281 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Yes, there are verified cases in the warehouse ledger records showing duplicate serial numbers for all of the older models. In later years, Winchester hand stamped an "X" on the end of the duplicate serial number. In at least one case, there were three Model 94 Carbines made with the same serial number. The third gun has "XX" on the end of the serial number.

    WACA Historian & Life Member

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  • Bert H.Bert H. Member Posts: 11,281 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by 11b6r
    SNs were not required by law until 1968 on rifles. And a serial number is not unique to only one gun in the world (or they would be dozens of digits long.

    If I read what you wrote correctly, those are two different guns- one a carbine, one a rifle.


    Your comments are of some relevance, but in this case, not relevant to the topic being discussed. Specifically, Winchester did serialize all Model 1892 and 1894 Rifles & Carbine regardless of the legal requirements (or lack thereof).

    WACA Historian & Life Member

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  • Mod1892Mod1892 Member Posts: 120 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hello Texas Bear,

    I would interpret that entry as, the gun was originally built in a carbine configuration with the associated May dates and then returned (not noted) and reconfigured as a rifle configuration in November.

    Michael

    Model 1892 / 61 Collector, Research, Valuation
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  • andrewsw16andrewsw16 Member Posts: 10,728 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    An old man I know has a nice Winchester collection. He liked to specialize in getting both the carbine and the rifle of certain models WITH matching serial numbers. He has several nice matched pairs. So the answer to whether two Winchesters might have the same serial number is a definite, YES. [:D]
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  • MG1890MG1890 Member Posts: 4,460 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by andrewsw16
    An old man I know has a nice Winchester collection. He liked to specialize in getting both the carbine and the rifle of certain models WITH matching serial numbers. He has several nice matched pairs. So the answer to whether two Winchesters might have the same serial number is a definite, YES. [:D]


    Respectfully, you are mistaken. He has no matched serial numbered pairs of vintage Winchesters, sir.
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  • Spider7115Spider7115 Member Posts: 29,704 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by MG1890
    quote:Originally posted by andrewsw16
    An old man I know has a nice Winchester collection. He liked to specialize in getting both the carbine and the rifle of certain models WITH matching serial numbers. He has several nice matched pairs. So the answer to whether two Winchesters might have the same serial number is a definite, YES. [:D]


    Respectfully, you are mistaken. He has no matched serial numbered pairs of vintage Winchesters, sir.

    Maybe he has commemorative sets like these: http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=376680383
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  • MG1890MG1890 Member Posts: 4,460 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
    quote:Originally posted by MG1890
    quote:Originally posted by andrewsw16
    An old man I know has a nice Winchester collection. He liked to specialize in getting both the carbine and the rifle of certain models WITH matching serial numbers. He has several nice matched pairs. So the answer to whether two Winchesters might have the same serial number is a definite, YES. [:D]


    Respectfully, you are mistaken. He has no matched serial numbered pairs of vintage Winchesters, sir.

    Maybe he has commemorative sets like these: http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=376680383


    You are right, could be commemoratives, but not vintage. I didn't mean to offend anybody. Thank you.
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  • andrewsw16andrewsw16 Member Posts: 10,728 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You are quite correct. They are commemoratives. [:)] I should have specified that.
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