using .308 ammo in a 30:06 rifle

Master7thSon · February 2002

I recently aquired a large cache of .308 primed brass

a shooting buddy told me he was pretty sure i could fire 308 in my 30:06 rifle

is this a fact? if so----would there be any downside (other than reduced velocity?)

guess i should state my rifle is a remimgton bolt action. Thanks!

COONASS · February 2002

ONLY IF YOU FIGURE OUT HOW TO PUT A 06BULLET IN A 308 CASING......GOOD LUCK....IT MAY BE THE LENGTH THEN.???????[This message has been edited by COONASS (edited 02-22-2002).]

Master7thSon · February 2002

from what I can determine they use the same bullets

Rafter-S · February 2002

Master7thson-- One of the basic rules of firearms is to NEVER use ammo in a firearm that it is not designed for. Don't even think about it!

Rafter-S · February 2002

Master7thson-- I feel compelled to add a comment to my above post. If you think about it, a cartridge is a "controlled bomb" that explodes 4 inches in front of your nose. It is controlled by the gun's chamber. The chamber is designed for a specific cartridge. Think about it--a controlled bomb exploding right in front of your nose--the next time you pull the trigger. Do you really want to "play around" and experiment with ammo that's not designed for that chamber?I warn you...for your own safety. Don't do it. [This message has been edited by Rafter-S (edited 02-22-2002).]

22WRF · February 2002

Bullet dia is .308 on both but that sharp shoulder .308 an't gonna like it in that 06 chamber. BTW way you might get a ballpeen hammer to help the bolt home.

I Refuse to be a VictimGrumpy old man

talon · February 2002

The best option is to sell the .308 cases, or get a .308 rifle. After having said that there is a device you can put in the neck area of your 30-06 chamber to convert your rifle to .308. I'm not sure if you can do it yourself as headspacing may be affected. I'm not even recommending it, it's just that it's possible.

Master7thSon · February 2002

alllllllllllrighty then

the writings on the wall

Thanks!

Master7thSon · February 2002

Thanks Talon---it sure sounds like a real good excuse to buy another rifle

this is always welcomed news!

jonk · February 2002

There is a chamber insert I have seen to convert any 30-06 to a .308, but I have heard mixed opinions on such inserts.

"...hit your enemy in the belly, and kick him when he is down, and boil his prisoners in oil- if you take any- and torture his women and children. Then people will keep clear of you..." -Admiral of the Fleet Lord Fisher, speaking at the Hague Peace Conference in 1899.

Der Gebirgsjager · February 2002

NO! PLEASE DON'T DO IT! These cartridges headspace on the distance from the face of the bolt to the approx. center of the shoulder. A .308 is grossly out of headspace in a .30-06. I once fired an M1 Garand clip loaded with .308s in an .30-06 Garand. I could not believe how hard the rifle kicked, and did not realize my mistake until I picked up the brass and wondered where the .45-70s came from. As I looked at the small shoulder near the cases' necks and read the headstamp inscriptions it slowly dawned on me what had happened. I was lucky because the Garand is a very stout rifle and, being semi-auto, I believe that a lot of the excess pressure escaped as the bolt unlocked. A regular bolt action might have let go, taking fingers and eyes also. I keep a couple of these on display in my shop (along with other boo-boos by other people) for public entertainment. As for the chamber inserts, they are still available; and you will still occassionally find them advertised in the Shotgun News. They are safe to use, but will occassionally extract and eject with the fired .308 cartridge--so you have to keep your eye out for this problem, or it is possible to inadvertently eject it and then feed a .308 into a .30-06 chamber. If you don't want to swap your .308 ammo for .30-06, or buy a .308 rifle, you might also consider pulling the bullets and reloading them into your .30-06 empties.

Master7thSon · February 2002

Chamber Insert? sounds clever

but I like to get an excuse to buy another rifle anyway.

Herschel · February 2002

Der G., I once witnessed a person fire 7.62 mm in a Garand. It was when the military was making the transition from the M1 to the M14. Ammo for both rifles was available on the military range. One of our young rifle team members fired his 2 rounds and clip of 8 rds with 7.62 (.308 Win.) through a Garand.The first clue we had was when we saw those funny looking cases on the ground. This was on the 200 yard line and his group was small but a little low. I would not have believed the 7.62 would function through an M1 had I not seen it.

Xracer · February 2002

In one word.......DON'T!

treedawg · February 2002

you can still get the inserts to fire 308's in an '06 in shot-gun news. looked at one in the current issue and i think the whole kit is less than $25.00? never had any personal experiance with them, but it looked slick in the ad.

oldfriends · February 2002

Quite a few years ago we were conducting a sniper school. We were doing some training on a KD (known distance) range. Some of the students were firing M1s and some firing M14s. We had ammo cans with 30 ball (30-06) and 7.62 (308) placed on the line. Now you would think that these guys would have known the difference as they were Special Forces. Well, as I was walking the line, I noticed some brass that looked like 45-70. (as stated above.). It took a second to think through what was happening and I called a "cease fire". Some one or several different people were firing 308 in the M1s chambered for 30-06. The brass necks were being fire formed to neckless brass. Now the most amazing thing that was identified here was that they were still getting some impressive scores with this combination. We made appropriate changes to the range procedures, inspected the rifles and continued the KD firing phase of the training.

Life is Tough!It's Tougher if You're Stupid

Iconoclast · February 2002

Master: NEVER, NO, DON'T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!7.62 is a shorter case. A major reason brass was originally selected for cartridge casings and its continued popularity is its elasticity. When the pressure rises from the ignited powder, the case swells to fill the chamber, then contracts slightly, allowing (usually) easy extraction. Shooting undersized ammo in a chamber can easily stress the the brass past its return point, causing it to fracture, resulting in - AT BEST - a major extraction problem. All literature stresses that only the ammunition designed to be fired in a specific chamber be used. Convert if you must, but do not jeopardize yourself, others or your firearm by trying this stunt; it is a disaster waiting to happen!! NEVER, EVER, DO THIS!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

binder · February 2002

There is a chamber device advertised in the shotgun news that will allow yu to fire 308 in a 30-06 , but you have to use a broken shell remover to get it back out. I have never used one , but understand from a friend, that it does work.

binder · February 2002

There is a chamber device advertised in the shotgun news that will allow yu to fire 308 in a 30-06 , but you have to use a broken shell remover to get it back out. I have never used one , but understand from a friend, that it does work.

Der Gebirgsjager · February 2002

Gentlemen--I'm glad that Capt. Kirk is a little late getting to his computer today, and that this thread has been allowed to run past the usual limit of 10 posts; as there is obviously something to learn here. My incident, described above, happened at a rod and gun club range under ideal conditions. The club has very substantial shooting benches made from poured concrete with large, flat tables. I had an M1 and an M1A (M14 clone) both lying on the table with their ammuntion. The ammo was all military FMJ with the annealed, discolored necks and appeared the same except for length. I inadvertently loaded the 7.62mm into the M1 clip and fired away. My group was not so good, and the recoil from the rifle was similar to that of a large African-type magnum. It is interesting to note that the other incidents described here by Herschel and oldfriends happened under very similar circumstances, in that both types of ammo and rifles were available at the location. The lesson I took away from this experience is to only have one rifle and the appropriate ammo on the table or firing line at a time. A final word about the inserts. They were developed by/for the US Navy which had a program for converting M1s to 7.62mm (these are highly prized by collectors and shooters), but thought that they might save a lot of our money with the insert idea. The Navy found in testing that sometimes during rapid fire the insert would extract and eject with the spent cartridge case----and from the above we all know what would happen next. There is a partial, unsatisfactory solution in that they can be permanently retained by roughing the neck of the .30-06 chamber to allow the insert to get a good grip on the chamber walls. This, of course, ruins the .30-06 chamber. The Navy eventually gave up on the whole idea and went with the M14 which they still use today. The remaining inserts were sold to the present vendor who has been selling them for years. Yes, a broken shell extractor is the way to remove them; but much better a rifle specifically designed for the cartridge. Regards, Gentlemen; let's be safe out there.

BlueTic · February 2002

I was waiting for him to say the right words - " Time to buy another rifle". It really is the only way - I mean why screw up the chamber of a perfectly good gun, when you can have 2 for the same reason. (I know - it doesn't work on my wife either)

Master7thSon · February 2002

It seems pretty obvious

I have a clear-cut justifiable reason to buy "JUST ONE MORE" firearm

Thanks to all who have 'made-my-day'! Larry

redcedars · February 2002

Just thinking out loud Saxon, but I can see where you could get an overpressure situation. The rate of burn is controlled by several factors, including temperature and pressure. Gases escaping past the bullet in the throat could lead to less pressure, but when the bullet engages the lands, pressure would rise suddenly and perhaps reach above average levels. The pressure wave might look really steep, giving the "slam" feeling. Even if pressures don't rise above normal, the steep pressure curve could overstress an action.And guys, just for the record, the .308 Winchester is not exactly the same as the .308 NATO. SAMMI sets .308 WIN specs, and the military sets 7.62 NATO specs. There are slight difference in case dimensions, case thickness, and chamber dimnensions. SAMMI max pressure for the .308 WIN is higher than NATO max pressure for the 7.62 NATO. Those shooting old bolts originally designed and proofed for old loads with a max pressure of 40,000 PSI, rechambered for 7.62 NATO or .308 WIN may be shooting what amounts to proof loads (repeatedly!) in a 100 year old gun with an out of dimension chamber. Frankly, I don't recommend it, but if you are determined to do it, proceed with extreme caution. Slug the chamber to learn what you are really working with, and check headspace with the correct guages regularly. Stay alert for signs of overpressure, like a sticking bolt or flowing primers. And never, never, never shoot .308 Winchester in a 30-.06 chamber, or any other round in the wrong dimension chamber. It would be just asking for trouble, even catastrophy. [This message has been edited by redcedars (edited 02-23-2002).]

idsman75 · February 2002

Actually, it isn't a controlled "explosion". It is smokeless powder burning thus creating rapidly expanding gasses which force the projectile down and out of the barrel due to the increase in pressures. The bang comes from the extreme difference in temperature between those gases and the ambient air temperature.

Myra-Lou · February 2003

NO

He Dog · February 2003

Master7th I strongly urge you to buy a new (or fine used .308). You must have a new rifle, that is the only solution![;)]

using .308 ammo in a 30:06 rifle

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