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IMR 4064 308

bsdoylebsdoyle Member Posts: 279 ✭✭
edited March 2006 in Ask the Experts
This is a continuation of my post in regard to my rusty-dusty powder.I tried to put 45 grains in a 308 for 110 gr plinkers and it wont fit. Does this verify that it is bad and the weight and volume is screwed up or is this possible. Speer manual says 49 is compressed dosent say that bout 45 and it wont all fit. Maybe somebody has got some 4064 and see if it will fit in a 308 case. Regardless its goin on the lawn. Thanx for all your help. Steve
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    buddybbuddyb Member Posts: 5,249 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thats the same powder(IMR4064) and charge weight I use in my 308 hunting rounds.I use Sierra 150 grain and the powder completely fills the case so I guess it is a compressed load.I have had no problems and it is a very accurate load in any rifle I have used it in.
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    bsdoylebsdoyle Member Posts: 279 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanx Buddy that seems to answer my question. My powder wont fit in a case. So it would appear that it is bad. Volume and weight dont seem to jive any more. Thanx. Any body else tried it. Steve
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    MobuckMobuck Member Posts: 13,794 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    What brand or type of brass are you using? There's a big difference in inside capacity between brands and even more between commercial and military. A load that fills a winchester case might not fit inside a remington and will overflow from a military spec case.
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    bsdoylebsdoyle Member Posts: 279 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    thanx mobuck but already tried that it wont fit in any. Tried all comm. brass. Rem Win and Fed. Thanx Steve
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    nononsensenononsense Member Posts: 10,928 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Steve,

    In general, the age of a powder does not have a bearing on the size of the grains. Therefore the weight and volume of the powder should remain consistant from new powder to older unless there has been some form of contamination. The fact that your load of 45 gr. of IMR-4064 won't fit has nothing to do with the age of the powder nor does it verify that the powder is 'bad' unless you can determine that there is a contaminant.

    I like a challenge occasionally, so I took several examples of .308 Win. cases and a new can of IMR-4064 as well as an older can (+10 yrs) of the same. Weights were checked on a triple beam balance. I used a 4" drop tube in all examples to maintain some consistancy. The top of the case is considered to be full. None of the examples were vibrated to allow for more settling of the powder.

    Smallest volume by weight of powder:

    7.62 x 51 Nato = 46.1 grains

    Largest volume and most common volume by weight:

    Winchester Palma .308 Match = 48.2 grains

    Nothing real significant can be derived from this simple test, it just generates some information for the sake of discussion.

    If you can't get 45 gr. of IMR-4064 in a standard .308 Win. case, I suggest that there may be something other than the powder that is a distinct variable. Something is different and it isn't the powder at least as far as I can tell.

    Best.
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    bsdoylebsdoyle Member Posts: 279 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanx NONONSENSE. THANX for takin up the challange.I too enjoy one. But heres what my defense is. I took my RCBS scale and put a 55gr bullet in it and by golly it weighs 55gr. Ok so I think Ive got that ruled out. So now I took three rounds and held them under the powder measure that I had set for 45 gr and it ran ovwer of course. So I poured out just enough to make it level and weighed three rounds in three diff man. cases. 2 weighed 43.5 and the other weighed 43. Now unless somebody can tel me diff. It should all fit in there.45 gr of MY 4064 WONT FIT IN A 308 CASE. HELP. Now I am still thinking the powder is bad cause now that I look at it better its red dust when I pour it into the rcbs powder measure and there is a light dust on the little alinumum tray for the scale. But it has also affected the weight to volume ratio. Im no ROCKET SCIENTIST but it takes more volume to get to 45 gr. with this powder so it must be bad. YES???????? Dont ya just love a good discussion. Thanx Steve
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    MobuckMobuck Member Posts: 13,794 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Sometimes you encounter a load that won't fit. I've had it happen even with a 257WBY. I've also had to hold an electric engraving pencil against the side of the case to vibrate it so the charge would fit. It was a completely safe load,too.
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    CS8161CS8161 Member Posts: 13,595 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Possible someone dumped different powder in that can?
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    bsdoylebsdoyle Member Posts: 279 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Could be Chris but it still shouldnt be dusty and rusty lookin. It could have been purchased at an auction ??? But I still dont know bout the dust and rust. I am still curious bout gettn a new can and tryin it Thanx Steve
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    sandwarriorsandwarrior Member Posts: 5,453 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    bsdoyle,

    I'm thinking you answered you own question with the description you give of the powder. Better try a new can. Compare kernels, and see if the ones from the can you have now have fattened up or gotten longer. If so, you either have bad powder or unnamed powder. Neither are good. So, if I were you I would invest in a new can and get some peace of mind for free along with it. -Good luck
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