Two pre-war Mauser sporting riffles. Need value.

rwb940

I have two Mauser pre-war sporting riffles. Would like help identifying models and value. One riffle with scope has no markings or hallmarks and the scope is an ALDIS BROTHER BIRMINGHAM #71520 YEAR 1916.

The second riffle without scope on top of barrel is stamped H BARELLA-BERLIN. On the side of barrel, #6081, KRUPP-LAUF 8x60. On the side of barrel below 8x60, there is some type of crown followed by S.T.M.G.

If anyone can help identify these markings and associate a value, it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time.

perry shooter

Most likely from same person that had your Drilling shows same type of poor storage condition. Depending on if the barrel was just rechambered or original in that cartridge it may be .318 bore not .323 bullets for 318 are hard to find. . Because of condition and cartridge not a high dollar piece but nice to have both claw mounts and original scope. All of these guns need to have metal separated from the wood and then given a lot of TLC with treatment of Kroil and scrubbing with burlap bag.

rufe-snow

The scope is interesting. It was made for use on British Enfield sniper rifles that were used during W W I. The scope if it's correct, might be worth more then the rifle it's on, to a collector. It's interesting to speculate how it was obtained by a German gunsmith and mounted on a commercial rifle. It's common to see German scopes mounted on Brit rifles, first time I have ever run across a British military scope mounted on a kraut hunting rifle.

The other rifle without the scope appears to be a very good quality post W W I sporter. Because the Germans were forbidden to chamber any rifles for the 7.92 X 57 military cartridge, the 8 X 60 was developed after the First World war to get around this. To bad the scope is missing.

joel_black

The problem with rifles like these is that between WW I and WW II, many military rifles from the former were made into sporters by a huge variety of German gunsmiths. Some were excellent and others not so good. They would have to be examined in person to determine in which category they fall. I have a fairly good collection of these, but would never try to evaluate the quality of work from a picture. Rufe-Snow is correct about the scope, but the work involved in tearing them down to remove the soldered on mount and then fitting it to a proper WW I sniper rifle with the correct mount is beyond ability of most so-called gunsmiths.

Michibay

There is a fellow in Alaska...Michael Petrov...he is an EXPERT on Pre War II German rifles. He has helped me on one of my Heym Rifles made in 1932. Michael can be reached at: mjpetrov@acsalaska.net He also has a web site showing many of his fine rifles...not sure of his web address. Good Luck!!!

nononsense

rwb940,

First, there are no model numbers other than M98 which is the Mauser model as identified by the action.

The St.m.G means the rifle was proved with a Stahlmantelgeschoss or steel jacket bullet, the number is the weight of the bullet in grams.

Rifles marked with only an indication of powder charge and bullet type as shown below date to 1912 or before:

2,67 g GBP
St m G

These marks show 2,67 grams of Gewehr Bl?ttchen Pulver (military flake powder) and Stahl-mantel Geschoss (steel jacketed bullet). Other possible types are "K m G" for Kupfer-mantel Geschoss (copper jacket) and "Bl G" for Blei Geschoss (plain lead bullet).

After 1912 marks were changed to show just bullet type and bullet weight as in:

St m G
12 g

usually accompanied with a crown-over-N or the word Nitro, specifying smokeless powder.

H BARELLA-BERLIN is a gunmaker whom I don't recognize but I don't keep a list of the small shops either as there were hundreds.

KRUPP-LAUF is a type of steel manufactured by Krupp specifically for the firearms industry.

8 x 60 is a cartridge designation for the cartridge chosen to replace the 8 x 57 Mauser military chamber as required by the Treaty of Versailles. In this manner, the average citizen could avoid having the rifle confiscated by having the chamber cut a little deeper for the 60mm cartridge thus eliminating the potential for using the military ammunition.

There are at least 6 'crown over letter' designations all with specific meanings.

Marks showing crowns over the letters B, U, (proof approved); G (rifled barrel), S (smoothbore) and W (choked barrel) span the period from the first German proof law until 1939, but there are other marks usually present that can narrow the date range greatly.

In order to get finer details you will need substantially better pictures taken with something better than a camera phone with better lighting. This will usually require taking the barreled action out of the stock to see the other relevant proof marks.

Best.