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Adding a scope base to a 12 Ga
victorj19
Member Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭
Hi,
I would like to add a scope base to a single shot 12ga shotgun. Showed the barrel ot a gusnith anf he said no to drilling and tapping the barrel. I posted a question here about using JB Weld and that turned out to be a non-starter.
I'm now considering using silver solder. What do you think? Would the bluing need to be removed from the barrel and base?
What if I had the base tack welded to barrel?
Thanks,
Jim
I would like to add a scope base to a single shot 12ga shotgun. Showed the barrel ot a gusnith anf he said no to drilling and tapping the barrel. I posted a question here about using JB Weld and that turned out to be a non-starter.
I'm now considering using silver solder. What do you think? Would the bluing need to be removed from the barrel and base?
What if I had the base tack welded to barrel?
Thanks,
Jim
Comments
edit H&R's are tough. Low temp silver solder is still my first choice, propane torch will work. It has both tin and lead plus the silver for more strength. High temp silver requres red heat, not a good plan for chamber area.
I see you are unwilling to give up on this, so, I say silver solder is the route to go. Properly fluxed, it should adhere to the blued barrel.
I will say, though, for the amount of time and money you have dumped into this, you could have went and purchased a gun that was already drilled and tapped, and wouldn't pose a danger from having the chamber/forcingcone area possibly overheated, during your silver soldering operation. But, lest again, it is your face, not mine.
Best
EDIT 1
Beantown,
I do agree with most of what you said, but with the exception, of that, this has been being pondered to a year and a half to two years, after going back and looking up the original post.
Being that an individual has access to a computer, and GUNBROKER.COM auctions, and there are transfer FFL's im most corner's of this country, the ability to find, and access one, is very high. If the gunsmith will not drill and tap it as it has not got enough material to do so, a novice soldering job, would surely weaken it also. BTW, if you have to ask the question of silver soldering, in the manner it has been asked, then in my professional, experienced opinion, it should not be attempted either.
Like I said, just my opinion, and not my face, to be involved.
Best
http://www.amazon.com/Home-Gun-Care-Repair-Ackley/dp/0811720284
You will find in it a topic about silver soldering gun parts.
Basically, You want to sand the top of the barrel then "Tin" it. Then you "tin" the cleaned bottom of the base. Clamp them together, and heat so the two tinned areas adhere. When done correctly you will not even ruin the blueing around the barrel.
JB weld. . .even if that "could" work. . .why? You know right off that bat that its half-as-sed. If you're going to do it, do it right.
For TSR, some people are attached to certain guns for various reasons (ie "it belonged to dad"), and it isn't always a question of cost. Also in some places it can be difficult to get ANY gun, so you have to try to make do with what you've got.
So even if it would be cheaper to sell this gun and buy another pre-tapped for a base that doesn't necessary make that the best option.
EDIT:
TSR: I got you. Didn't realize this guy was sitting on this issue for more than a year.
When I said "it can be difficult to get any gun", yes, internet auction sites and the mail mean any firearm is, at least in theory, available anywhere.
I just mean there are still a few places where access to guns is legally restricted, and "importing" one may still require quite a bit of hoop jumping. that's all.
I do have some experience soldering copper plumbing. If silver solder will work, I planned on finding out how to do it. I had a lot going on and had to drop the project for quite awhile.
The barrel is a H&R, with a XF choke tube and is part of a set with a heavy rifled slug barrel and a 50 Cal muzzleloader barrel. I have other shotguns I can turkey hunt with. I only have about $100 into the barrel and $20 in a steel one piecebase.
I hadn't thought of the heat weakening the chamber. Seems like propane would bee a better choice than the MAPP gas I use for plumbing and other work. What Babun wrote seems doable.
Jim
TSR,
I do have some experience soldering copper plumbing. If silver solder will work, I planned on finding out how to do it. I had a lot going on and had to drop the project for quite awhile.
The barrel is a H&R, with a XF choke tube and is part of a set with a heavy rifled slug barrel and a 50 Cal muzzleloader barrel. I have other shotguns I can turkey hunt with. I only have about $100 into the barrel and $20 in a steel one piecebase.
I hadn't thought of the heat weakening the chamber. Seems like propane would bee a better choice than the MAPP gas I use for plumbing and other work. What Babun wrote seems doable.
Jim
The lead free, mostly tin solder you use for the plumbing work, is NOT silver solder. Silver solder, the type you need for your job, turns liquidous around 850 degrees. The majority of the filler is copper, with about 45% Silver, along with a little zinc, and lead. While not "red heat", it will obviously take more than propane or MAPP gas torch. Although, MAPP gas can do it, you need the reducing flame that Oxygen/Acetylene will give you. The solder you use for plumbing would contaminate the work piece for a further attempt with the right solder, and not get you the results you wished for. It would be like using the J-B WELD.
If you do this, you might want to practice first, on your steel to steel brazing(silver soldering). Perfect it in practice, them move the perfection to your workpiece. When practicing, practice using the least amount of heat you can, and getting it done as quickly as you can.
Best
TSR,
The barrel is a H&R, with a XF choke tube and is part of a set with a heavy rifled slug barrel and a 50 Cal muzzleloader barrel.
Jim
Why not post what model it is and maybe someone can tell you if they have put a scope mount on one.
It could be that the gun smith you took it to just did not want to do it. It could be that the gun is not suitable for a scope and you should just not put one on.
It could be you need some ugly side mount with a pistol scope to make it all work.
quote:Originally posted by victorj19
TSR,
I do have some experience soldering copper plumbing. If silver solder will work, I planned on finding out how to do it. I had a lot going on and had to drop the project for quite awhile.
The barrel is a H&R, with a XF choke tube and is part of a set with a heavy rifled slug barrel and a 50 Cal muzzleloader barrel. I have other shotguns I can turkey hunt with. I only have about $100 into the barrel and $20 in a steel one piecebase.
I hadn't thought of the heat weakening the chamber. Seems like propane would bee a better choice than the MAPP gas I use for plumbing and other work. What Babun wrote seems doable.
Jim
The lead free, mostly tin solder you use for the plumbing work, is NOT silver solder. Silver solder, the type you need for your job, turns liquidous around 850 degrees. The majority of the filler is copper, with about 45% Silver, along with a little zinc, and lead. While not "red heat", it will obviously take more than propane or MAPP gas torch. Although, MAPP gas can do it, you need the reducing flame that Oxygen/Acetylene will give you. The solder you use for plumbing would contaminate the work piece for a further attempt with the right solder, and not get you the results you wished for. It would be like using the J-B WELD.
If you do this, you might want to practice first, on your steel to steel brazing(silver soldering). Perfect it in practice, them move the perfection to your workpiece. When practicing, practice using the least amount of heat you can, and getting it done as quickly as you can.
Best
TSR,
Thank you. You've convinced me that I'm on the wrong path with the soldering, that it isn't as simple as I thought and I don't have the proper equipment/torch.
I'm going to discuss the project with a machinist fried about the possibility of making a mount that will tigthly fit over the chamber to be held in place with 2 set screws on each side to match very small dimples in the barrel and use JB Weld. The top would be drilled and tapped to use use a weaver mount on top. The machined part would extend more than 180 degress around the barrel. Thus, the part can't move vertically and from side to side. The set screws and JB Weld would keep it from moving horizontally in line with the barrel.
An alternative that I mentioned before and no one commented on was to weld the steel mount to the barrel.
What do you see as the drawbacks to the the two alternatives above?
Jim
Babun told you the proper way to "tin" both parts.