9mm bullets loaded in .357SIG

buschmaster

in another thread somebody mentioned Defender brand ammo. I checked out their website and observed:

buschmaster wrote:

their .357SIG is loaded with a 124 grain bullet, which is probably a .355" 9mm bullet and not really constructed for .357SIG power.

okay, to elaborate on that, here's a quote from some article somewhere on the internet:

The 124 +Ps out of the Ruger PC Carbine are super fast for 9mm. They?re on par with .357 Sig velocities we?ve measured out of a full size pistol. But those .357 Sig bullets are designed for the higher velocities. The 9mm bullets are not. If you look at the Gold Dots side by side, you can see a big difference in the shape of the opening at the top.

With the HSTs, the difference is not as noticeable but the opening on the .357 Sig bullet is definitely a little larger.



If the bullet is too fast, there are a few things that can go wrong. The issues we really want to look out for are when they expand too much and too early. This creates drag and leads to under-penetration or the bullet might just break up into pieces.

so there is a difference. if you have 124 grain .357SIG it's loaded with a 9mm bullet which is not designed for those velocities and probably can't handle the power when it hits.

you will have the same problem when you shoot your 9mm +P out of a pistol caliber carbine.

montanajoe

.45 acp and be done,,,

buschmaster

I'd agree with that, but capacity and barrier penetration...

shilowar

I shoot 9mm NATO ( essentially +P, loaded at 10-15% more than standard 9mm) out of my 8.9 Zenith MP5. I bet that approaches .357 Sig velocity, of course that's FMJ. I'd like to see what 127 gr +P+ Rangers run out of the 8.9" barrel and how the JHP handles the flight at 100 yards.

Quick&Dead

I enjoy shooting the .357 Sig out of a Glock 33.

The nice thing is that it takes about a minute to change barrels in the Glock 33 from .357 Sig to either 9mm or .40 S&W allowing one to select the caliber and appropriate ammunition.
8-)

drobs

I always though 357 Sig was just a 40sw necked down to 9mm.

llama

drobs wrote:

I always though 357 Sig was just a 40sw necked down to 9mm.

It is, but the OP is going on over the design of the actual projectile not the diameter of it. I guess the closest point would be to look at the photos - the larger cavity on the 9mm load is obvious.

MIKE WISKEY

there isn't enougth difference in perfformance between the 2 cartridges to make much, if any, difference

Sam06

MIKE WISKEY wrote:

there isn't enougth difference in perfformance between the 2 cartridges to make much, if any, difference

I don't know Mike, there is a heap of difference in velocity and that is why they use different bullets a bullet that works at 1050 fps is going to fail at 1350 fps. The real advantage the 357 SIG has over the 9mm is penetration of barriers like glass and car doors. This is the reason the Highway Patrols in several states field them(NC and TX to name 2).

I have one and when I shoot my dueling tree with it it smacks the "arms" around with authority much more so than 9mm 124gr. When I shoot metal plates they get knocked over hard where the 9mm just kind of makes them fall over.

rufesnow

I've loaded various 38 special bullets in 9 mm for years, And vise versa. 9 mm bullets in 38 special brass. It's no big thing. As the pressure is much higher, for the heavy 38 special bullets in 9 mm brass. The powder charge has to be reduced substantially. Some of the 9 mm bullets will be undersized. But a Lee factory crimp die. Solves that problem. Some 9 mm pistols, can be problematical though. They are optimized for ball ammo. And feeding problems can encountered, with blunted nosed .38 special lead bullets.

Now a days though, with the proliferation of soft body armor. Penetration rather than bullet expansion is the problem, as I see it. Obtaining a bullet that will get through the Kevlar and into the vital organs, is a bear. None are available commercially, either as loaded ammo or components. As far as I know?

MIKE WISKEY

"I don't know Mike, there is a heap of difference in velocity and that is why they use different bullets a bullet that works at 1050 fps is going to fail at 1350 fps".............200 fps isn't much at all, we aren't talking slapping plates or a dueling tree. we are talking bullet expansion in real meat.

buschmaster

I thought a 124 gr 9mm would go faster than 1050 but...

1050 gets 303 ft-lb energy.
1350 gets 502 ft-lb energy.

huge difference.

montanajoe

Switching barrels on my SIG Pro, I can't tell the difference between shooting the .357 sig or the .40 s&w,,,,

I can tell the difference between either of them and the 9mm

buschmaster

shilowar wrote:

I shoot 9mm NATO ( essentially +P, loaded at 10-15% more than standard 9mm) out of my 8.9 Zenith MP5. I bet that approaches .357 Sig velocity, of course that's FMJ. I'd like to see what 127 gr +P+ Rangers run out of the 8.9" barrel and how the JHP handles the flight at 100 yards.

if you got the right ammo it sure can.





notice that 16" doesn't help much. I would add that your 8.9" barrel should get practically the same velocity as the 12" in the above charts. look at some BBTI data and they all do that. velocity is maxxed out by 9" and remains constant after that.

the only things you get with a longer barrel than 9" is controllability with a more carbine-like setup, and probably a lot less flash and noise.

buschmaster

one thing you can do with 9mm bullets loaded in .357SIG is use it in a short barrel (3-3.5") knowing it's not going to reach .357 velocity but still make one helluva 9mm in a small package. even melllow loads should reach 1300. forkin' loud though