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Lebanon explosion

shootuadealshootuadeal Member Posts: 5,304 ✭✭✭✭
in General Discussion

If you haven't seen it yet go check out some of the videos.


First they said it was a fireworks factory and then later they said it was "confiscated high explosive materials.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-middle-east-53656220

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Comments

  • yoshmysteryoshmyster Member Posts: 22,078 ✭✭✭✭

    Here I was expecting another ammo plant went up in smoke.

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  • Sam06Sam06 Member Posts: 21,244 ✭✭✭✭
    I saw that earlier and thought that was a huge explosion.  I looked like a nuke going off.
    RLTW

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  • William81William81 Member Posts: 25,514 ✭✭✭✭
    Wow.....the only word I could come up with.... :s
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  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,702 ✭✭✭✭
    First I thought a fuel-air explosion but it was the moisture compression of the shock wave.

    That has to be one of the larger conventional blasts ever recorded.  Looks larger, but similar to video of the British Grand Slam of late WWII.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
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  • NeoBlackdogNeoBlackdog Member Posts: 17,303 ✭✭✭✭
    Holy cow!  That would'a knocked Allah right off the snackbar!
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  • GrasshopperGrasshopper Member Posts: 17,047 ✭✭✭✭
    Darn looks like Nagasaki, Prime Minister says he will see who is responsible? Really? I think they are dust.
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  • hillbillehillbille Member Posts: 14,463 ✭✭✭✭
    sorta strange, I have been watching fox for the las 45 minutes or so, they have yet to report on this, they just keep going back to either the weather/storm or danged corona virus releif bill..............
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  • BobJudyBobJudy Member Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭✭
    hillbille said:
    sorta strange, I have been watching fox for the las 45 minutes or so, they have yet to report on this, they just keep going back to either the weather/storm or danged corona virus releif bill..............
    It's been on their website for an hour or so under the heading developing story. It says the orange cloud is indicative of a nitrate explosion. Fertilizer accident or bomb? Bob
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  • Rocky RaabRocky Raab Member Posts: 14,510 ✭✭✭✭
    It was a high-order detonation, absolutely not fireworks. And it was only about 0.1% of a nuke.
    I saw three "phases" or events: first a grey smoke cloud indicating a fire. Then a sudden jet of orange smoke, followed immediately by the high-order detonation. The white mushroom was indeed the atmosphere's moisture re- condensing after the shock wave. (Saw that a lot in 'Nam.)
    Whatever the cause, there was WAY too much dangerous material stored WAY too close to a populated area. Typical corrupt practice in the third world, as we've seen before. The death toll is going to be huge.
    I may be a bit crazy - but I didn't drive myself.
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  • shilowarshilowar Member Posts: 38,811 ✭✭✭
    Lebanon's Prime Minister Hassan Diab has said that those responsible for an explosion at a "dangerous" warehouse in Beirut port area that rocked the capital would pay the price.    Hmmmmmmmmmmmm
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  • Butchdog2Butchdog2 Member Posts: 3,834 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020
    Taco shop?
    Now that was some kind of blast. Looks like a Brownsville type mishap.
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  • Butchdog2Butchdog2 Member Posts: 3,834 ✭✭✭✭
    Several videos on Youtube, that was almost a Big Bang theory explosion.
    Either that or what a liberal hang out will look like after a Trump landslide.
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  • bustedkneebustedknee Member Posts: 2,001 ✭✭✭✭
    Oh my!  What an unfortunate accident!

    Wink, wink.
    I can't believe they misspelled "Pork and Beans!"
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  • Horse Plains DrifterHorse Plains Drifter Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 40,256 ***** Forums Admin
    NeoBlackdog said:
    Holy cow!  That would'a knocked Allah right off the snackbar!
     :D  :D
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  • Ditch-RunnerDitch-Runner Member Posts: 25,412 ✭✭✭✭
    WOW
      I have been buying my fireworks at the wrong store .

     serious prayers to for the Innocent and there families  that were in the wrong place at the wrong time
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  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    Story from Beirut came out earlier. That a ship load of Aluminum Nitrate, was confiscated a number of years ago. It was stored in that warehouse. 

    Aluminum Nitrate can be really dangerous stuff. Why they would just leave it in a warehouse, in a populated urban area. Doesn't make a heck of a lot of sense? Should have hauled it out, to the boondocks.
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  • Toolman286Toolman286 Member Posts: 3,256 ✭✭✭✭
    Why does the town I worked in have a propane supplier with a capacity for 90,000 gal in the middle of a populated area. (Yes, it had been there for years.) Well, thank God that the lightning struck the building & not a tank. While LEOs were diverting traffic & evacuating residents, the volunteer firemen went in close enough to keep the tanks sprayed with water & fight the fire. Volunteers deserve a lot of credit & thanks.
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  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    The Lebanese Prime Minister, announced that there were 2,750 tons of AN in the warehouse. 
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  • hillbillehillbille Member Posts: 14,463 ✭✭✭✭
    sorry just can't work up a lot of concern, as they were never sorry for blowing up our barraks back in 83........... I personally knew quite a few men who didin't make it home from that one, if it wasn't for a slight screw up I would have been there myself
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  • Rocky RaabRocky Raab Member Posts: 14,510 ✭✭✭✭
    AMMONIUM Nitrate. Not aluminum. Websearch the Henderson Nevada fire and explosions. They were the ammonium nitrate suppliers for Thiokol, for the Space Shuttle solid rocket boosters. We worked with upwards of two million pounds of it at a time.  Ironically, it was safer after being mixed into rocket fuel than as a pure chemical. Space Shuttle fuel could not detonate.
    I may be a bit crazy - but I didn't drive myself.
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  • Sam06Sam06 Member Posts: 21,244 ✭✭✭✭
    I just read that it was a 3 KT explosion.  That 2750 tons of AN detonated.

    That is a big explosion.
    RLTW

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  • Wild TurkeyWild Turkey Member Posts: 2,425 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020
    Texas City 1949 --2300 tons exploded
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_City_disaster
    Lots of videos of the disaster on youtube

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  • BobJudyBobJudy Member Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭✭
    It has been in common use since WW1 as a fertilizer. It also has been used in industrial explosives and by terrorists for the same length of time. Heat and contamination makes it unstable and a disaster waiting to happen. Confiscated 6 years ago and stored in a 3rd world warehouse meant it was just a matter of time before this happened. Bob
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  • select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,540 ✭✭✭✭
    Someone ignored the no smoking
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  • Sam06Sam06 Member Posts: 21,244 ✭✭✭✭
    select-fire said:
    Someone ignored the no smoking

    Actually it was started by a guy welding.
    RLTW

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  • WarbirdsWarbirds Member Posts: 16,943 ✭✭✭✭
    https://forums.gunbroker.com/discussion/comment/11205882#Comment_11205882

    I bet he won’t do that again.

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  • ChrisStreettChrisStreett Member Posts: 3,847 ✭✭✭
    I'm sitting here with a very experienced EOD friend playing/re-playing the video, interesting listening to his breakdown and analysis.
    "...dying ain't much of a living boy"-Josey Wales
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  • select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,540 ✭✭✭✭
    Peanuts..Hiroshima was around 13kt... and oddly on its 75th anniversary Lebanon explodes.
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  • allen griggsallen griggs Member Posts: 35,708 ✭✭✭✭
    That's right, FCD.   You have to add fuel oil to ammonium nitrate to make it explode.
    I think we are not being told the whole story on this explosion.     I think we are being lied to.
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  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,702 ✭✭✭✭
    https://forums.gunbroker.com/discussion/comment/11205889#Comment_11205889

    It is an strong oxidizer and needs a fuel source. An explosion that large pretty much requires the fuel to be fairly well mixed, I would think.


    With the grain silos near by, one could consider 6 years of grain dust. If one is looking for an accidental explanation, that is.

    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
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  • BobJudyBobJudy Member Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭✭
    Don McManus said:
    ","bodyRaw":"I thought ammonium nitrate needed to be mixed with fuel oil to be explosive.  If it's that explosive on its own, why do people add fuel oil to it?
    ","format":"wysiwyg","dateInserted":"2020-08-05T13:35:22+00:00","insertUser":{"userID":379345,"name":"Flying Clay Disk","photoUrl":"https:\/\/forums.gunbroker.com\/applications\/dashboard\/design\/images\/defaulticon.png","dateLastActive":"2020-08-05T13:36:52+00:00","label":"✭✭✭✭"},"displayOptions":{"showUserLabel":false,"showCompactUserInfo":true,"showDiscussionLink":false,"showPostLink":false,"showCategoryLink":false,"renderFullContent":false,"expandByDefault":false},"url":"https:\/\/forums.gunbroker.com\/discussion\/comment\/11205889#Comment_11205889","embedType":"quote"}"> https://forums.gunbroker.com/discussion/comment/11205889#Comment_11205889

    It is an strong oxidizer and needs a fuel source. An explosion that large pretty much requires the fuel to be fairly well mixed, I would think.


    With the grain silos near by, one could consider 6 years of grain dust. If one is looking for an accidental explanation, that is.

    Not sure that it needs to be thoroughly mixed. The two big explosions in 1947 and 2013 here in the U.S. were caused by nearby fires heating the ammonium nitrate over 170 degrees causing it to break down and self oxidize. At that point it accelerates combustion so any fuel nearby becomes explosive, probably including the grain dust. 

    One thing mentioned in the reports is that Hezbollah controls the port. If that is the case, who knows what other explosive material was stored there. Somehow I doubt it was fireworks. Bob
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  • Rocky RaabRocky Raab Member Posts: 14,510 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020
    No, It can go high order on its own.
    It has to be stored in bulk -- check.
    It has to be heated, as in a fire -- check (Lebanon in August certainly helped.)
    It has to have a small initiator explosion -- check, as per the video.
    In order, there were three events: a fire (grey smoke); a small explosion (rapid tower of orange smoke); and an almost immediate very large blast. Orange smoke is almost a fingerprint for an AN explosion, btw.
    I may be a bit crazy - but I didn't drive myself.
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  • Wild TurkeyWild Turkey Member Posts: 2,425 ✭✭✭✭
    Flying Clay Disk said:
    I thought ammonium nitrate needed to be mixed with fuel oil to be explosive.  If it's that explosive on its own, why do people add fuel oil to it?

    Texas City 1949 -- ship loaded with ammonium nitrate explodes.  Article has some good info on explosion conditions and there are lots of videos on YouTube of fire and aftermath
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_City_disaster
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  • jimdeerejimdeere Member, Moderator Posts: 26,292 ******
    Pfft...probably just some peaceful protesters.
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  • select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,540 ✭✭✭✭
    Hey Boss, we have anything else like that around here?
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  • TRAP55TRAP55 Member Posts: 8,294 ✭✭✭
    This is the one that started Haz-Mat standards for the trucking industry.

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  • chmechme Member Posts: 1,471 ✭✭✭✭
    Rocky is correct- the "orange smoke/ red smoke" is nitrogen dioxide gas.  When shooting rock, it is a sign of a less-than-optimum shot.  AN IS a strong oxidizer- get it hot enough, it is liberating O2, which will change a fire into an explosion.  Normally AN is mixed with a fuel- can be diesel, nitromethane, and even coal dust has been used.  But hot AN on its own can find a fuel to react with.  The Henderson NV fire at Pacific Engineering involved ammonium perchlorate- similar chemical- and THAT fire started with welding.  The rapid compression of air creates a visible shock wave from the density of air increasing to that of steel- then air pressure drops, moisture in the air forms instant cloud.  How this mess came to be- no idea- but Lebanon is truly screwed- that one port handled about 90%  of their economy- and it just went away.  As far as comparison to Hiroshima- not even close.  AN, even with an optimum fuel mix, is only about 70% of TNT equivalent.  About 1.9 KT if all the AN reacted.  Hiroshima was about 13 KT.  This is the PEPCON explosion in Henderson- note red smoke, sequential explosions.
    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=pepcon+blast+henderson+nevada&&view=detail&mid=A606055FAFAA25C8EAAAA606055FAFAA25C8EAAA&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dpepcon%2Bblast%2Bhenderson%2Bnevada%26FORM%3DHDRSC3
     
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  • pulsarncpulsarnc Member Posts: 6,569 ✭✭✭✭

    During haz mat training , we are taught the dangers of large amounts of fertilizer . Best thing to do if it is on fire is RUN

    cry Havoc and let slip  the dogs of war..... 
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  • bpostbpost Member Posts: 32,669 ✭✭✭✭
    In summation referring to the conflagration and ensuing detonation of said chemicals and quoting Forest Gump.... "It happens."
    Whoops!
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  • Rocky RaabRocky Raab Member Posts: 14,510 ✭✭✭✭
    I was wrong about the Henderson blast. Thanks chme. It was indeed ammonium perchlorate there - and also what the Space Shuttle rockets used as an oxidizer. Not ammonium nitrate. The other things I mentioned about AN, however, were correct AFAIK.
    (AP is even nastier than AN as far as going kaboom is concerned.)
    I may be a bit crazy - but I didn't drive myself.
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