Has anyone gone solar?

susie

Snake oil dude came by today from Power Home Solar.  They advertise Generac battery for extended use (power outage) scenario.  Was over $60k.  About fell out of my chair.  Said $45k without Generac battery.  I don't live in a mansion.  Average 3/2 house.   My usage the last twelve months is as follows starting in October 2019:
In KWH,  Nov-620,  Dec-2102,  Jan-2443,  Feb-2361,  Mar-3019,  Apr-1913,  May-1326,  Jun-756,  Jul-932,  Aug-1134,  Sep-1367 and  Oct-1018. 

I'm not interested in it to save on my electric bill.  My highest bill has been in the $250 range.    At a monthly cost of $235 for 30 years I would never recoup my cost in savings off my electric bill.  So, that company is a no-go.  So, I'm looking for other solar options with battery back-up for power outage instances and SHTF scenarios.  Push come to shove I will put in a Generac whole home standby generator.  House is all electric, but I do have two tanks that are available and can be put in use.

hillbille

I'd say your better off to go with the gas generator, LP won't go bad if you have big tank, and in emergency you could use a gas grill tank......

NeoBlackdog

I wouldn't bother with photovoltaics yet (electric) because the panels aren't up to snuff yet and will wear out before you get them paid for.   Solar for heating water, on the other hand, is well worth the investment!!  
You should have a solar hot water company come out and see what they can do for you.  

mogley98

Personally I would also go with the back up automatic standby gen set, whole house. You lose power its up and running worth maybe ten grand from Generac installer depending on conditions.

truthful

I don't have solar, but a neighbor does. He didn't do it for savings, he did it because he felt it was the "correct thing to do." He got a lot of rebates and discounts, and still figures it will take 30 years to break even. We had a bad hail storm last year and everyone had to have new roof shingles. It cost him a significant amount to have the solar panels removed so the shingle job could be done and then replaced. The insurance would not pay for that added cost.

spasmcreeksrun

one of my backup generators is powered by propane....carb doesn't gum up setting like gasoline ..and.....i put 20' jumper battery cables on it to run any vehicle close to  it to start up.....most small generator batteries last about a year .....

SW0320

I agree with the comments on a whole house generator.  We have a Generac one, it is 15 years old and just keeps on running.  It is propane, we have 125 lb propane tank and have never run out of propane even when the generator ran for 8 days straight after a bad storm in our area in 2010.

i do not see the payback for solar unless you are in some place like AZ or CA and also use it for other things like an electric vehicle.

Brookwood

At my current age and family history, making 30 year projections are just fantasy! 

 

Rocky Raab

Most solar is without battery backup, so it is day only. If you produce excess power during the day, it fed into the power lines and the power company paid you for it. At night you revert to the power company. At one time, you paid the standard rate for night power. The power company soon realized that they were paying more than they were getting. So, if you install solar, your nighttime rate shot up to many times the non-solar rate. Instead of cents per Kwh, you paid dollars. Cooking or running the A/C became painful. 
Today, with the federal subsidies to buy it gone, and the confiscatory rates for night power, very few people are installing solar out here. 

Brookwood

Flying Clay Disk said:

Have a work colleague (now retired) who went full-on off grid on his cabin (solar and wind).  He had it "all figured out".  I tried to talk him out of it, but he was determined.  I tried to tell him it will never return the investment.  He did it anyway.

Within 5 years he had replaced most of the stuff at least once, if not twice (batteries, solar panels, turbines, etc).  Just a huge money drain.  And up front all the sales people told him it would all last 25-30 years. 

And here's the real kicker...even for him to dispose of a lot of this stuff cost a bundle of money because much of it is considered Hazmat.  No one ever told him that (no one ever tells anyone that).  So in the end, he couldn't even throw it away without getting out his check book.

Probably one of the biggest scams in recent history, all this renewable energy stuff.  Thanks Obama!

Sounds like some kind of "New GREEN Deal" to me!   Just remember Cash is Green too! 

nmyers

And, used solar homes are difficult to sell.  Buyers know of these horror stories, & don't want the headache.

Neal

diver-rig

I have gone solar.

Out in the corn stubble for the cows, on the fencers, anyway.

Dang batteries in them only last one season though.

bpost

I have zero issues with folks or Companies using solar, wind or any other type of clean energy, more power to them, (pun intended).  I have free natural gas, it saves a TON of money during heating season, cooking and hot water.  My biggest bill is AC, it takes a lot of energy to run AC, there is no viable way with current technology to run AC in a cost effective manner off the grid.  I don't even notice what it costs to cool my home, I want it comfortable at all times in the summer.

Wind dies, solar goes dark at night.  We are not there yet to feed our homes power.

It is like the Zenith flat screen TV that cost 12 grand back in the last century, time and technology will catch up to the point the 12 grand TV is five times larger and cost $400 bucks.

Batteries and distribution are the issue now, they are getting close but not there yet.  Like the horse buggy and whip of years gone by the use of gas or Power Company generated power for our home will be a distant memory.

We ain't there yet.

susie

Thank you all for the advice.  I did the number crunch and it would be a money loser for me.  Snake oil dude threw in at the last minute that what they provide would not be enough to run my HVAC system (heat or cool).   Most that it would generate in peak summer time would be 900ish KWH in a given month.  Not enough in averaging to offset what I would still have to pay the electric company due to my low electric bill.  The scare tactic was that although I average $100 to $150 a month my bill would jump to $400-$500 in the upcoming years and that was factored into my "savings".  If we could predict these things we would all be in the stock market making millions.

I have an 8750/6500 portable generator in Pine Bluff that I will be bringing to the farm.  It will do the job and then some until I can get a stand-by installed.  I can plug it into the camper (sleeps 11) and take care of me and the neighbors).  Reminder, neighbor is #1 and her family.

Brookwood

I have been called a "Space Cadet" a few times and was once an honorary member of "The UFO Pilot Society"  (I even have the T-Shirt) but I enjoy the sunshine from a shady distance now days!   

Nope!  No solar power for me!

nmyers

For those doing a new installation of solar panels, you may want to check with your local fire marshal first.  Many now require "aisles" on the edges & peak of the roof to allow firefighters to ventilate your attic in case of a fire.  And, maybe an electric cutoff switch.

Neal

Mr. Perfect

hillbille said:

I'd say your better off to go with the gas generator, LP won't go bad if you have big tank, and in emergency you could use a gas grill tank......

Yep. Go with a generator that will run on propane.

TANK78Z

I am just now having a 20,000 watt Kohler generator whole house generator installed with a 250 gallon propane tank.
Both wi-fi enabled.
Generacs generators  have had a good rep in the past, but after speaking to several installers of them they seem to be living off their old rep and are a little less reliable nowadays for long term ownership.
The kolhers were highly recommended by all, with agreement on better overall build quality and value for long term ownership.
I have several neighbors that over the last 3-4 years have installed 24 to 32 panel solar with battery storage units, they are very happy with what they are not getting ,  electric bills ,  and enjoying getting a small check for excess energy sold to the public electric utility each month.
 NONE of them expect to save money over the life of the panels and batteries vs monthly electric bills, they are doing it so as to never be without electric no matter what happens to the utilities with storm or other outages.
The biggest difference is the overall cost for solar vs generator, I feel in ten years if the generator needs replacing it still will be cheaper than doing solar now.

Mr. Perfect

The biggest problem with solar or wind power is the means with which to store it. It's really not that viable an alternative. If you watch those shows about folks that live off the grid, they really don't do too well, no matter how many times they proclaim otherwise, and mostly due to the power storage, or lack thereof.

NPR Fl. Vet

I went Solar last Spring mainly to get off the energy grid and hopefully to keep my costs from going sky high . I did some research and went with Sunrun Solar, my monthly power cost is now under $100 with a limited increase of about 2 % per yr ( less than Duke Energy increases) and it didn't cost me a dime to do this , plan to add  a propane Gen set in the future for back up. but seldom see blackouts here . . . . good luck  !

Mercury

I'm about to spend $40k-50k on a huge solar system for my new ranch digs. The local mafia electric company wants $40k+ JUST to run lines 1/2 mile, PLUS "additional" money (they wouldn't say how much) to actually hook it up.

I can install a 20k system for $40k, WITH LiFePO4 batteries that will last for 3,000 to 5,000 cycles (recharges).  That is more than enough to run everything we need, including ac systems 24/7.

Of course, I live here in AZ, where we get 350+ days of sun a year.

I have a few small systems now powering the rvs we have, and a couple other setups, and they work fantastic.

As far as replacing your power company, don't bother. You won't save enough money to make it worthwhile.

BUT, if you are already "off grid" and live in a super sunny place, it is economically feasible. My "power bill" will be approximately $150/month, after the initial investment. That is the "replacement cost" of the batteries every ten years or so.

HUGE advances have been made in solar panels in the last five years. I've tinkered with solar systems for 20+ years, and the output these days is incredible. 300+ watts PER PANEL is not unheard of now!

Just install a backup generator, and be done with it. Don't buy Generac though, as the newer ones are JUNK JUNK JUNK!

Merc

chme

It has been my observation that folks that go "off the grid"- whether solar, solar photovoltaic, wind, hydro or methane fall into one of three categories-
1.  Folks that have cut their electrical power demand to the MiNIMUM.  Do not use electric for heat. A/C, water heating or cooking.  Lighting is LED.  Those that learn to ACTIVELY manage their power use do OK.
2.  Folks that are going to be disappointed.  Not enuff power.  Not consistent power.  Too expensive.  Service life too short.  Requires too much involvement.
3.  Folks that are in really remote areas and have to grow their own power.   If you go into with your eyes wide open- can work.  But there is rarely a Free Lunch that way.  

Good friend several years ago, built a REALLY remote place.  He planned from day 1 to be off grid.  Built his house for that.  Well insulated, heats with wood, solar hot water. Has small scale hydro plant, use electricity for lighting, fridge, small water pump and TV.  Cost him a TON to do it right. 

Go back to the days of the Jacobs Win-Charger (36 volt wind generator) You were only running a handful of lights, a radio and a couple of small appliances.  

mogley98

I have seen ads touting rather substantial payments to convert farm land near three phase poles to solar farms. No investment from the land owner and x dollars an acre income Guaranteed. My land isn't near three phase or I would know more about it.

Brookwood

My Amish neighbors seem to do pretty well living with minimal power needs.  They do work their butts off from sunup to sundown though.  

Mercury

FCD,

 I am moving to the ranch for one reason: QUIET. If I had to listen to a genny run 24/7, I'd just live in town!

Merc

pulsarnc

Mogley, there are several downsides to the big solar farms . Most are set up on 20 to 25 year leases . Almost all require the leasing company to return the site to a pre lease condition. Only problem there is what happen if a year or two before the lease expired the company goes bankrupt ? Then the landowner becomes the responsible party and has to foot the bills . All the solar farms I have seen use galvanized metal framework . Over twenty years a lot of heavy metals leach out into the soil . Just food for thought

chme

Pulsar has a good point.  If you lease use of property, have lease include requirement for a bond to cover cost of land restoration.  If they are bankrupt, the bond has to cover site remediation.