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Shipping to California
tbnez2
Member Posts: 7 ✭✭
Just sold a Garand and found my buyer to be from California. Trying to understand the new (2009) law about shipping rifles there; Garand is one of the "new" (2002) Springfield Armory produced so no C&R. From what I have read so far it looks complicated; I am a non-FFL holder or business. Do I have to apply to send a rifle there?
Comments
Do I have to apply to send a rifle there?
No
Only out of State FFL dealers have to obtain an import number from the CA DOJ. Most Garand's don't have a muzzle device but as stated above removal of flash suppressors on semi-auto center-fire rifles with detachable magazines is the norm in Ca. There isn't constructive possession Ca State law and the new owner would buy an acceptable replacement muzzle device and either keep the old one in a parts box or sell it.
OK enjoy Prison. Better join the Mexican Mafia now.
Please stop spreading misinformation!! First of all this is a State issue not Federal!!
Geez it's bad enough that Californians have to battle the front lines on bad firearm laws and put up with the let's let it fall into the ocean comments combined with the let's not sell to California at all.
But spreading lies with promise of prison is just to much. I had to double check that I was on a gun forum.
Well guess who's next??? As soon as they see this CFLC worked to curb gun sales it's sure to be added to a state(s) near you. However if everybody sold as many as they could to California, the over burdened tax payers may just toss this redundant pork law ridiculousness in the trash.
--Rant over--
To the OP This is from The Ca DOJ http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/cflcoverview.php
About CFLC
As of July 1, 2008, California Penal Code Section 12072(f)(1) PDF logo [PDF 30 kb / 1 pg] prohibits all Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), other than Type 03 or 06 FFLs, from shipping firearms to an FFL in California unless, prior to delivery, the FFL intending to deliver, sell or transfer the firearms obtains a verification approval number from the California Department of Justice (CADOJ) Bureau of Firearms. This includes transfers that occur at gun shows.
The verification approval number, which the Bureau of Firearms provides in a Firearms Shipment Approval letter, confirms that the intended recipient of the firearm shipment is properly licensed and listed in the state's database of persons/entities authorized to receive firearm shipments. If the intended CA FFL recipient is not listed in the state's database, the transaction will result in a Do Not Ship letter, and it is a crime for the intended recipient to receive the firearms (Penal Code Section 12083(c)(1)).
As a courtesy to impacted FFLs, the Bureau of Firearms has established an Internet application that is available to FFLs nationwide 24 hours a day 7 days a week (24/7) to obtain Firearms Shipment Approval letters. All Internet transactions will be handled on a secure server, and the information provided will be used solely for the purposes associated with the administration of the CFLC program. For FFLs that do not have Internet access, the Bureau has established a telephone service that allows nationwide FFL shippers to enroll and obtain Firearms Shipment Approval letters via telephone or facsimile prior to shipping firearms to a California FFL. However, the telephone service availability will be limited to Monday through Friday 8:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Pacific Standard Time.
For additional information regarding this new program, please refer to our CFLC Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs).
Enrolling in CFLC
You must have a valid FFL number to enroll in CFLC. Enrollment is a one-time process. There are several ways you can enroll. You can use the Internet, or mail/fax an enrollment application to the Bureau of Firearms.
To enroll using the CFLC Internet application, use the link in the "Not yet enrolled in CFLC?" section on the CFLC home page. After completing the CFLC enrollment process, you will be able to log in to CFLC to obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval letter. Also an enrollment acknowledgement email message containing your CFLC Logon ID and Password will be sent to the email address entered on the enrollment screen.
To enroll by mail or fax, complete the California Firearms Licensee Check Enrollment Application and return it to the Bureau of Firearms. Once your application is processed, you will receive an enrollment confirmation letter that includes a telephone/fax number you can use to request Firearms Shipment Approval letters via fax or mail.
Obtaining a Firearms Shipment Verification Approval Letter
To obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval letter 24 hours a day from the CFLC Internet application, Logon to CFLC. You will need the CFLC Logon ID and Password you received during the Internet or mail/fax enrollment process. You will also need the five digit Centralized List (CL) number of the CA FFL to whom you intend to ship firearms.
You can also request a Firearms Shipment Approval letter by calling the telephone number listed on your enrollment verification letter or faxing/mailing a CFLC Firearms Shipment Approval Letter Request Form to the Bureau of Firearms. However, you must have enrolled in CFLC prior to submitting a Firearms Shipment Approval Letter Request Form.
Firearms Shipment Approval letter requests received via phone, fax, or mail will be processed Monday through Friday between 8:00 a.m. and 5:00 p.m. Pacific Standard Time. After processing your request, the Bureau of Firearms will fax you a Firearms Shipment Approval letter containing the verification approval number.
California FFL Holders
California FFL holders (other than Type 03 or 06) must enroll in the California Firearms Licensee Check (CFLC) Program to ship firearms to another California FFL. They must also be listed on the State of California Centralized List as either a dealer, manufacturer, or exempt. Once enrolled in CFLC, California FFLs will be able to obtain Firearms Shipment Approval letters to ship firearms to other FFL holders within the state.
A CA FFL must provide an FFL shipper with his or her five digit Centralized List number so that the shipper can obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval letter from the Bureau of Firearms.
Enrolling in the Centralized List for California Exempted FFL Holders (CLEFFL)
To enroll in the Centralized List for Exempted FFLs (CLEFFL), you must submit a completed Application and 12070 PC Exemption Declaration for the Centralized List of Exempted Federal Firearms Licensees form (BOF07-10) PDF logo [PDF 60 kb / 2 pg], a copy of your valid FFL, a valid Certificate of Eligibility, and the appropriate fee to the California Department of Justice (CADOJ). The Bureau of Firearms will send you a "Centralized List of Exempt Firearms Licensees Notice" to confirm your status.
And from the frequently asked questions page concerning the above.
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/cflcfaqs.php
I am not an FFL but I want to ship a firearm to a California FFL. Do I have to obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval number before shipping a firearm to California?
No. The requirement to obtain a Firearms Shipment Approval number only applies to holders of valid FFLs.
There is even an exemption form for dealers who sell frequently to dealers in California.
Not selling to Californians to teach them a lesson, in hopes of a revolt to change laws is like not going to work until your fellow employee's revolt to change a no firearms at work policy. There you would sit, at home while everyone works the day away hand in hand with your replacement.
1.5 million firearms were sold in California last year. That is paying someones mortgage, if your anti California it certainly isn't yours.
Hey pickenup! Thought I'd check in, I heard it's Alumni month.
OK enjoy Prison. Better join the Mexican Mafia now.
Baaaaaaaaaaaa,Baaaaaaaaa,Baaaaaaaa You know nothing about whats going on with this OP so just STFU.
Thanks for checking in, and setting the record straight. [:D]
Pay no attention to the vacuous poster above.
He just drops in once in a while to
(to borrow a term)
nip at the heels. [;)]
Geez it's bad enough that Californians have to battle the front lines on bad firearm laws
One thing you may want to check before you ship, is IF the receiving FFL will accept it from a NON FFL. Many will not.
Also there is a punitive action for sending firearms to CA without the CA DOJ approval number. Otherwise IT WOULD NOT BE A LAW !
[:(!]
YES it does for a FFL will not accept a firearm unless it has the aproval regardless of source.
If the FFL doesnt know the law then he/she shouldnt have a FFL.
FFLs in my area will not bother to get an aprroval from the CA DOJ. Therefore NO shipments to CA.
Also there is a punitive action for sending firearms to CA without the CA DOJ approval number. Otherwise IT WOULD NOT BE A LAW !
[:(!]
That's fine. Please say thanks to those FFLs for doing what the loser CA politicians could not do - keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens. Senator Feinstein and Ms Pelosi thank them for their assistance. Maybe when no guns come into CA and there are fewer gun owners, all our Senators and Representatives will be antigun and they'll all cast votes in Congress for national gun bans. Smart move.
The OP is NOT an FFL, therefore he doesn't have to bother with the new CA law. It's specifically written to apply to FFLs and to NOT apply to nonFFLs. That's how it's written, that's what it means.
Please say thanks to those FFLs for doing what the loser CA politicians could not do - keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens.
THANK YOU! I could not have dreamed a better outcome. I hope it'll continue. None of you deserve to even to know how to spell a gun or firearm.
I find it hard to believe that dealers find such a mundane task reason to not make a sale. What a great tool for dealers who have no problem spending the 60 seconds on the approval number. I can hear them now...(in best know it all voice) "Yea--ah screw California--ah. Don't send anything there--ah. I wish they would--ah just fall into the ocean--ah." Then go to their desk and obtain 3 numbers in 100 seconds prior to shipping out several firearms.
quote: quote:Originally posted by dfletcher
Please say thanks to those FFLs for doing what the loser CA politicians could not do - keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens.
THANK YOU! I could not have dreamed a better outcome. I hope it'll continue. None of you deserve to even to know how to spell a gun or firearm.
Or assemble sentence's properly.
______________________________________
gun -
gun
1#8194; #8194;/g#652;n/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [guhn] Show IPA noun, verb, gunned, gun#8901;ning.
-noun
1. a weapon consisting of a metal tube, with mechanical attachments, from which projectiles are shot by the force of an explosive; a piece of ordnance.
2. any portable firearm, as a rifle, shotgun, or revolver.
3. a long-barreled cannon having a relatively flat trajectory.
4. any device for shooting something under pressure: a paint gun; a staple gun.
5. Slang. a person whose profession is killing; professional killer: a gangland gun.
6. British. a member of a shooting party.
7. electron gun.
-verb (used with object)
8. to shoot with a gun (often fol. by down): The guards gunned down the fleeing convict.
9. to cause (an engine, vehicle, aircraft, etc.) to increase in speed very quickly by increasing the supply of fuel.
_____________________________
firearm -
fire#8901;arm
#8194; #8194;/#712;fa#618;#601;r#716;#593;rm/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [fahyuhr-ahrm] Show IPA
-noun
a small arms weapon, as a rifle or pistol, from which a projectile is fired by gunpowder.
quote:Originally posted by dfletcher
Please say thanks to those FFLs for doing what the loser CA politicians could not do - keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens.
THANK YOU! I could not have dreamed a better outcome. I hope it'll continue. None of you deserve to even to know how to spell a gun or firearm.
Ahh... yes, dis-arm the people sounds like you voted for BO. This attitude along with the BS anti-2A laws (Kali's and Fed) have stepped on my Constitutional rights.
YES it does for a FFL will not accept a firearm unless it has the aproval regardless of source.
Complete BS.
Another question if I may? I always put caveat "Ensure you may legally own this rifle" into description. Should I be trying to research state laws on specific rifles to ensure buyer's state allows rifle or is that the responsibility of the receiving FFL? I think Garands are fine (no detachable mag so no "assault" label.) However I have a Bushmaster listed now (25'th Anniversary Carbine) and I am getting ready to list an M1A.
Another question if I may? I always put caveat "Ensure you may legally own this rifle" into description. Should I be trying to research state laws on specific rifles to ensure buyer's state allows rifle or is that the responsibility of the receiving FFL? I think Garands are fine (no detachable mag so no "assault" label.) However I have a Bushmaster listed now (25'th Anniversary Carbine) and I am getting ready to list an M1A.
You can stop pretending that you live in a free country.
Hit the books and educate yourself...or stop selling weapons.
The other alternative is...depend upon internet nameless, faceless entities to keep you tit out of the wringer..and smile a lot at Bubba.
Sound harsh ? It is...and one of the penalties for allowing this country to be taken over by tyranny.
Wow. Seems about 50/50 split as to whether or not I'm going to jail (since I UPS the Garand today).
Another question if I may? I always put caveat "Ensure you may legally own this rifle" into description. Should I be trying to research state laws on specific rifles to ensure buyer's state allows rifle or is that the responsibility of the receiving FFL? I think Garands are fine (no detachable mag so no "assault" label.) However I have a Bushmaster listed now (25'th Anniversary Carbine) and I am getting ready to list an M1A.
Given our new President and Attorney General, I'd say read up. Ideally, people who buy guns should be the responsible party and you as a once in a while seller shouldn't get in hot water. But could it happen - I suppose yes.
The Garand is a no brainer - you're fine. The M1A - if it has the standard slit sided flash hider is a no in CA. We get ours with a muzzle brake, you can see the difference if you check out the Springfield website. The guns are otherwise identical. If someone from CA wants it, just yank off the FH and send it separately, that's perfectly legal as constructive possession does not apply. And don't send any +10 mags.
I have 24+ years working for DOD averaging 8-9 months per year away from home. I'm going to have to pass on accepting blame for "allowing this country to be taken over by tyranny."
I have visited over 30 countries and would choose to live nowhere else but the USA. Not sure of your definition of freedom, perhaps you should take some field trips to Djbouti, Bahrain or Dubai (my most recent ports) to educate yourself on the definition of freedom. Better than hitting the books.
quote:Originally posted by afartinthewind
quote:Originally posted by dfletcher
Please say thanks to those FFLs for doing what the loser CA politicians could not do - keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens.
THANK YOU! I could not have dreamed a better outcome. I hope it'll continue. None of you deserve to even to know how to spell a gun or firearm.
Ahh... yes, dis-arm the people sounds like you voted for BO. This attitude along with the BS anti-2A laws (Kali's and Fed) have stepped on my Constitutional rights.
I think you're not following a couple of things here, one is who you are talking to, and second the point of the post. [:X]
I'd happily discuss it on the other side too, on the C.A. site that is.
Wow. Seems about 50/50 split as to whether or not I'm going to jail (since I UPS the Garand today).
Another question if I may? I always put caveat "Ensure you may legally own this rifle" into description. Should I be trying to research state laws on specific rifles to ensure buyer's state allows rifle or is that the responsibility of the receiving FFL? I think Garands are fine (no detachable mag so no "assault" label.) However I have a Bushmaster listed now (25'th Anniversary Carbine) and I am getting ready to list an M1A.
Adding to your disclaimer a restocking fee, if it ends up the buyers FFL is unable to transfer the firearm. Or no returns due to buyers inability to possess/transfer. The latter being a little harsher as the gun may end up at the Sheriff's dept out of circulation. Either way have it in the description which is part of the deal. Contacting the FFL before you ship could be prudent as well. Quite a few EBR's are transferable in Ca if the flash suppressor and pistol grip are removed prior to shipping.
Starting Member
USA
7 Posts
Posted - 02/26/2009 : 6:19:13 PM
Highball, I was inquiring about a NEW law and seeking the opinion of people familiar with guns and gun laws; hence asking the question on a GunBroker forum. The "nameless, faceless" were but a single source of information for me. Clearly, given the 50-50 response to my question here there is still some confusion as to specific requirements of this law.
I have 24+ years working for DOD averaging 8-9 months per year away from home. I'm going to have to pass on accepting blame for "allowing this country to be taken over by tyranny."
I have visited over 30 countries and would choose to live nowhere else but the USA. Not sure of your definition of freedom, perhaps you should take some field trips to Djbouti, Bahrain or Dubai (my most recent ports) to educate yourself on the definition of freedom. Better than hitting the books
You arrogant sob...I suggest that you go right ahead with your gun selling and buying. The sooner people like you go to jail..the sooner you will understand that the 'freedom you have been fighting for' has eluded you.
Its all going to come down to this....
Pick up your weapon, load, point, shoot, repeat.
Anything else will be the death of you, if not literally !