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Worry about pilots?
Ampersand
Member Posts: 235 ✭✭✭
I read in the paper this morning that airline pilots who want to carry sidearms will have to undergo psychological testing and a background check. I guess they didn't do this to become an airline pilot? It seems like they trust anyone to get behind the wheel of a jumbo jet with 400 people on board but if the same person wants to carry a defensive pistol they have to be tested. Does this make sense?
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Comments
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
Also the number ONE cause of airliner crashes is "pilot error." You can search with ease on Google and find cases of serious pilot errors like landing at the wrong airport, running out of fuel, etc.
They are only human.
Until the right to carry onboard aircraft is instated (never) I will never be on board another flight. I will never willingly subject myself to putting myself in a place I cannot defend myself, period. I am also positive that no one gives a damn either, at least not people who could make a difference.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
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You just made me a happy flier. Last thing I need on an aircraft is a amateur gun totin type. 30,000 feet is no place to test out a gun magazine theory. The psychology of flying an airplane and critical thinking is NOT the same as deciding to KILL ON PURPOSE at extreme close range. The washout factor to be a pilot is high...to go the next step and be armed is another standard that must be met. Don't even breath "military experience"....no application to the problem. NONE. If you notice nobody discusses the skills, tactics, efforts, methods, and SUCCESS terrorists have. That gets left out for obvious reasons. The sky marshal program even likes to dodge it. Can't say that I blame them. Terrorists do very well.
Humans are a stupid species.....Which is a deadlier weapon? 747 filled with fuel and passengers or Ruger P89?
If you said Ruger P89...You are an idiot.
Anyone who can fly a 747 commercially can handle a pistol...period.
If they can't we shouldn't be on a aircraft with them.
Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
If they can't we shouldn't be on a aircraft with them.
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So based on YOUR logic if I had a heart attack I should expect them to perform open heart surgery and if they can't they shouldn't fly.
If I break into song and the flight deck crew can't do basic four part harmoney they shouldn't fly a plane either. What's so hard about that? If my laptop crashes and the flight deck crew can't do a recovery of it they shouldn't fly a plane. Maybe planes and guns share common traits I'm not aware of. I never saw a pistol that flies. But again I never saw a 747 in a duty holster. I never saw a pistol with landing gear, but then again I never saw a plane with a removeable magazine or rubber grips. What am I missing?
So, as a flier, you would rather someone hijack a plane and crash it into a building rather than someone on board stopping them. If so, then good riddance.
Amateur, he says.... considering the source, you know nothing about me, yet you assume an awful lot.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Unless you have been trained in anti-air piracy you are indeed an amateur. The ONLY source of that so far in our country since the 1970's has been for sky marshals, and now that has been DOWN GRADED TWICE in the past 18 months so they can do fast hires. Maybe you attened their training facility in New Jersey. Please share. Your other source is the training center outside of Tel Aviv. One last option is a firm out of Florida staffed by Israel's that will do it and the cost is $4500 for FIVE days. So which was it? YOUR TURN.
I got the $4500 deal back in the 70's when it was cheaper. Hope you don't think it's all about guns & bullets.
But Darrell, I thought YOU trained the pilots?
Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
As for the rest of us, don't be fooled into believing the feds or anyone of that nature HAVE TO intercede before we are good to go on anything. If anything, they make it harder for us all. Apparently, our "komrade" would like us to believe that if we are not endorsed by the establishment, we aren't good enough for whatever. The collectivist rights view is not welcome here.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Gee you get a kick in the butt and it's about YOUR "rights." What rights? It's a PRIVATE airline and run by the GOVT regulations. you kinda leave that out. Last year I PAID out $30,000+ to a LOCAL gun rights group. Hardly HCI material. I was on two national shows produced by Rosie O and took that organization on HEAD ON on national TV. I hit an audiencve of 52,000 a week when I'm on the air in a PRO second ammendment slant. I have spoken before our state legislators in various committees as a PRO-second ammendment type. Toss in being CEO of a firm that has 13 instructors teaching lethal force and I've personally trained 4,000+ students myself including a LOT of pilots. Last week one student was James Ferguson who was the co-pilot of Rick Nelson's plane that crashed in the mid 1980's. Jim was tossed from the wreckage and survived. I'm hardly HCI material unless you have some real strange standards. Regardless I still don't need some gun rag reading wannabee on a passenger jet with me. Now if you have some credentials on this unique area let us know or until then it's just another "OPINION."
If you don't like the present airline situation stick out your thumb. It might like some sunshine.
I admit I am not a CEO of anything. I am a citizen of the US, and that in itself says everything I need.
You never did answer my question, komrade.
"So, as a flier, you would rather someone hijack a plane and crash it into a building rather than someone on board stopping them?"
If so, then good riddance.
Legal doesn't always mean just. The assumption that we are all nothing short of trigger-happy idiots is a reflection of how you feel about those "not of the same stature", and to tell you the truth, if this is the way you do battle nationally with anti-gunners, we are better off without your help.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So you have NO expertise on the issue. OK..got it. As for your gun logic, it seems you think a mytical "maybe" situation is better than the reality. You ASSUME a gun will work. Go to any airport and find me a Kevlar/Spectra detector. You never thought of that one.
Also trained police at 21 feet or less miss 92% of the time. You also assume the person would know WHEN to shoot. It's hard enough for EXPERTS let alone a rank amateur who reads gun magazines. In 9-11 if you look the crews and passengers were BETTER armed than the terrorists. MUCH BETTER. They just didn't know how to use what they had at hand. You also left that out. Any other topics you know nothing about we can discuss?
You still assume all I do is read gun mags and recite the Bill of Rights whenever I feel indignation. I do not require the piece of paper to tell me I am a good shot, and I rely on my skill and good judgment to see me through more problems than I do reckless and unpredictable behavior.
I have taken enough training on my own with firearms to know and be confident of my ability to render a threat harmless, and I have had to put that to the test. Good thing was, I didn't have to fire at the intruder to get him running. All I had to do was brandish the .45 and that was the end of the conflict. No shot fired. Most of the best skills we attain we do so by interest and practice. That is why there are marksmen, computer geniuses, musical prodigies, and mathematics wizards that are still children, not because of their coursework in school, but because they learn it on their own. I was one of them in my youth. It helped that I knew certain people (SWAT team personnel) who took me under their wing. I'd ask you what you think about that, but in all seriousness, I don't care what you think.
Anything else you assume I don't know, the fatal error of any person's thinking is the assumption you know more than the other person. So far, I see you as nothing more than a devil's advocate. The only thing I see you being correct on is the fact that there is no such thing as a "tactical" shotgun. The rest of it is, by its very nature, something I expect from a liberal who likes owning guns, but doesn't trust anyone else with theirs.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
Of course you've been trained where all the control cables, fuel lines, hydralic lines, and such are located. When a terrorist takes a crew member hostage you understand of course you KILL the crew member and then the terrorist(s). You'd have no trouble doing that of course. In fact the Israeli's call crew members and passengers held hostage "bullet sponges."
The Israeli IDF officers on each El Al flight are equipped with .22 Beretta's. Your weapon of choice? Keep in mind they have taken on AK-47 equipped terrorists so armed and WON. No El Al flight has been hijacked since 1969.
The Russian version of our sky marshals carry Makarov's.
The Russians and Israel's use "live fire" no blanks or hollywood plastic bullets excercises where they fire AT each other in various drills with full loads in low light. You've trained that way I'm
sure. Fun eh?
You also understand the closer the target is the higher the miss rate.
If you screw up who pays? I am sure your vast financial holdings will cover any catastrophic losses suffered by crew, passengers and the airlines and whatever is on the ground if you screw up.
Ever get the impression you are in way over your head? Time to quit while you are behind.
I damned sure wouldn't be taking a bazooka on board, nor would I pack a "hand cannon" or any other liberal term that doesn't truly exist, either. You think I'm not aware of the fact that planes are fragile things indeed? Just as a tool must be the right one for the job, the right gun for the situation is imperative.... substituting the wrong one typically doesn't get the job done. My choice.... probably a .25 with low charge loaded HP shells.
So here we go with something else. The plane you are on is hijacked. The flight you are on is a condemned flight, and you are all going to die on board, one way or the other. Bear in mind, the terrorists we are dealing with are martyring themselves so they will be rewarded with virgins and all sorts of other goodies in what they call heaven. If they fail, they get reincarnated into pigs or something like that, and their virgins are denied. With that knowledge, if they are stopped, their trip to martyrdom ends. Someone on board that plane is armed... perhaps several of the passengers are armed. Perhaps they are all armed. They never know who, or how many, but what they do know is that we know what the plan will be... and thus, may not be willing to risk losing martyrdom for a failed attempt at crashing the plane into whatever target they are told to. That is the true power of deterrence. The simple knowledge that they may be killed before reaching their destination and not granted the "promised land" and not given a second chance to fulfill the role.
Now, we are not even permitted stun guns, tear gas, pepper spray, knives, or anything of the likeness, even so far as a swiss army knife, crochet needles, silverware, or nail files. With not even these things at our disposal, everyone on the plane is potentially a sitting duck.
When that occurs, you may be on that plane. I will not. You may die... I will survive. For me, conceding to evil is not an option.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Fragile? How so? Explain in detail. Be specific.
My choice.... probably a .25 with low charge loaded HP shells.
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(tisk tisk) I'll pass on comment.
So here we go with something else. The plane you are on is hijacked.
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BLAH BLAH BLAH....so you try to make up your own reality. You left out the bad guys. You have no clue how such things work. Toss in some dancing girls and an open bar and we can make a party of it as long as you are just making up crapola.
Now, we are not even permitted stun guns, tear gas, pepper spray, knives, or anything of the likeness, even so far as a swiss army knife, crochet needles, silverware, or nail files. With not even these things at our disposal, everyone on the plane is potentially a sitting duck.
Stun guns don't work (ask rodney king) pepper spray isn't any better etc. You have NO clue about improvised weapons. NONE. Stop being a cry baby and try to THINK. Belts, a broken CD, a sock filled with change and keys, the list is endless. You sure don't get a high grade for creativity.So we are back to you having NO expertise in such things. We keep coming around to that.
I will not bother with a response. You didn't bother to answer my question, so I'm not going to argue.
Bullet sponges? That makes me even less inclined to fly. You go on ahead, though.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yes hostages are bullet sponges. At least according to the EXPERTS. I shall fly. Not worried. At least I won't have a gun slinging gun rag reading cowboy on board.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.