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Why antigun laws are so hard to fight.
Shadow83
Member Posts: 171 ✭✭✭
Below is one very good example why anti-gun laws are so difficult to fight and so easy to pass. THESE are the things we must combat if we are to stop and reverse the laws. More see this type of abuse than law abiding responsible gun owners so they remain scared thus jump on the band wagon.
It's idiots like this that mess it up for the rest of us.
quote:ATLANTA - A judge and court reporter were killed and two deputies were wounded in a shooting at the Fulton County Courthouse in downtown Atlanta on Friday. Authorities were hunting for the gunmen.
The judge, later identified as Superior Court Judge Roland Barnes, was shot on the eighth floor of the courthouse, while one of the deputies was shot on a street corner just outside the building, said Officer Alan Osborne with the Atlanta Police Department.
Witnesses said the gunman carjacked a car and authorities were searching for several vehicles reported stolen in the area.
Fulton County Sheriff's Lt. Clarence Huber identified the suspect as 34-year-old Brian Nichols, who was being held on rape charges stemming from an incident in August.
Lt. Gov. Mark Taylor interrupted floor action in the Georgia Senate to announce the shooting. "It appears that Superior Court Judge Roland Barnes has lost his life, along with his court reporter," Taylor told lawmakers.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution newsroom staff was being told that Don O'Briant, a features reporter for the paper, was beaten by the suspect outside the courthouse. Mike King, an editorial board member for the paper, said O'Briant was taken to Grady Hospital.
The hospital reported that it as treating two deputies. It was not immediately known the extent of their injuries.
"I saw one person on the street that they were perfoming CPR on," said court reporter Amy McKee.
District Attorney spokesman Erik Friedly said the shootings started shortly after 9 a.m. on the building's eighth floor.
Witnesses said the suspect carjacked a car and authorities were searching for several vehicles reported stolen in the area.
All the judges in the building were locked in their chambers. The courthouse and other buildings in downtown Atlanta were on lockdown. Traffic in the blocks surrounding the courthouse was backed up as police cruisers flooded the area looking for the suspect.
Judge Barnes recently sentenced former Atlanta Thrashers player Dany Heatley, who pleaded guilty to vehicular homicide in the death of a teammate.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
It's idiots like this that mess it up for the rest of us.
quote:ATLANTA - A judge and court reporter were killed and two deputies were wounded in a shooting at the Fulton County Courthouse in downtown Atlanta on Friday. Authorities were hunting for the gunmen.
The judge, later identified as Superior Court Judge Roland Barnes, was shot on the eighth floor of the courthouse, while one of the deputies was shot on a street corner just outside the building, said Officer Alan Osborne with the Atlanta Police Department.
Witnesses said the gunman carjacked a car and authorities were searching for several vehicles reported stolen in the area.
Fulton County Sheriff's Lt. Clarence Huber identified the suspect as 34-year-old Brian Nichols, who was being held on rape charges stemming from an incident in August.
Lt. Gov. Mark Taylor interrupted floor action in the Georgia Senate to announce the shooting. "It appears that Superior Court Judge Roland Barnes has lost his life, along with his court reporter," Taylor told lawmakers.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution newsroom staff was being told that Don O'Briant, a features reporter for the paper, was beaten by the suspect outside the courthouse. Mike King, an editorial board member for the paper, said O'Briant was taken to Grady Hospital.
The hospital reported that it as treating two deputies. It was not immediately known the extent of their injuries.
"I saw one person on the street that they were perfoming CPR on," said court reporter Amy McKee.
District Attorney spokesman Erik Friedly said the shootings started shortly after 9 a.m. on the building's eighth floor.
Witnesses said the suspect carjacked a car and authorities were searching for several vehicles reported stolen in the area.
All the judges in the building were locked in their chambers. The courthouse and other buildings in downtown Atlanta were on lockdown. Traffic in the blocks surrounding the courthouse was backed up as police cruisers flooded the area looking for the suspect.
Judge Barnes recently sentenced former Atlanta Thrashers player Dany Heatley, who pleaded guilty to vehicular homicide in the death of a teammate.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
Comments
ANY idiot can understand the necessity,the absolute URGENCY of doing so.
WE MUST pass an absolute ban....ON POLICE OFFICERS CARRYING GUNS...since it was a police officier that allowed this perp to take her gun....
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
"Followers of Christ, be armed."
Nah..I don't think so.Using this particular case to try and make a point such as he did is exactly what the Anti-gunners do.Showing no logic at all.....the only propaganda I have heard about gun laws has been right on this board,just above a couple posts...
I give them all no credence at all..even if they carry the day,their reign will be short.
Even given that Shadow is correct..what exactly are WE to "Combat" ?..these were the King's men that were disarmed and shot. They tell US to trust and DEPEND ON THEM...what does this case have to do with US ???
Gunphreak;
Nah..I don't think so. Using this particular case to try and make a point such as he did is exactly what the Anti-gunners do. Showing no logic at all.....the only propaganda I have heard about gun laws has been right on this board,just above a couple posts...This is the EXACT reason we will have no guns one day. Pizzin and moanin is easier than turnin off the TV, gettin yer butt offa the couch and actually doin something. Keep just askin the question, soon the question will be "Where did my guns go?".
quote:Using this particular case to try and make a point such as he did is exactly what the Anti-gunners do.DUH!?!?!?[?]
My point was exactly as gunphreak indicated. Every time some moron like this does something stupid with a gun it pounds the nails down more in the gun rights coffin. The media jumps on it and makes sure that everyone in America knows how dangerous guns are thus creating more fear of guns. And askin the question, "what exactly are WE to "Combat"?" and making no effort to actually understand the problem (just complain about it or attack those who do try) will accomplish nothing other than being a part of the problem. If one person had the answer it would not be a question. But I do know this much, we must "Combat" the FEAR if we are to succeed.
If you don't get it, you never will.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
but that's just me ........
"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke
Give the police authority to go door to door..collecting them.
Get OUT of the corrupt political cesspool..and allow the pols the rope to pass those laws.
On the day that law passes...you get the chance to decide if you really know what it means to be American....or not.
As an anti-gunner..it is beyond me to explain to you how foreign your statement.. quote:It's idiots like this that mess it up for the rest of us. is to an American...at least one who has a sense of what the Founders intended for freedom.
The basic....wrongness ...is so vast that it defies description.
As an anti-gunner..it is beyond me to explain to you how foreign your statement.. So I'm now an anti-gunner?!?!?[:0] Shoot!!! I gotta sell my 14 guns, including the ones that I have owned since I was 12!!! Maybe I should not submit for my FFL?!?! One would almost think that you applaud this bonehead in what he did?!?!? Have you not received your meds from Canada yet?[?]
Since it is obviously above some to comprehend I'll kindly elaborate. We should do what we can to reassure the American people that morons like this jerk are not representative of the vast majority of gun owners. That we abhor his actions and condemn what he did. That people do bad things with guns, and knives, and clubs, and cars, etc; and that there are millions of gun owners in the US who have never used their weapon against another. The only way we will be able to accomplish is to act as we claim to be; rational, sane, respectful non-apocalyptic, law abiding American citizens who have no intention of using any gun (or any other weapon for that matter) against any person who is not threatening ours or our family's lives. Goin off the deep end with a display of anger and/or violent threats and acting all macho accomplishes nothing other than becoming part of the problem, not the solution. If someone is not willing to compromise and respect another's thoughts for what ever reason, it is indicative of a personality which may abuse another's freedoms. There IS a methodology for how things happen. If one is to get what they wish they need to assess the situation and act accordingly in the most productive manner. Anything less will just work against them.
So even if someone yells at you that they want to outlaw all guns and no one has a right to own them, calmly ask them if they would like to discuss their concerns in a productive adult manner. Then THEY are the lunatic to be feared.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
Understanding the Second Amendment is what separates those who are...
Your posts have amply demonstrated you lack a basic understanding of gun rights...exactly as the NRA lacks an understanding of the Constitution.
Despising what that perp did is so basic a human emotion that one should not have to 'prove' it by standing on a stump and screaming about it...and doing so just causes a certain suspicion amoungth sane people....
If the general populace believes that that perp is just a common gun owner..indicative of us all..there is no common ground to have a discussion.
God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??
Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my gun.
Merely owning guns does not make you pro-gun..sorry.So why don't you publish YOUR list and see how much of America follows it? Alienate everyone because they do not fit your stereotype and you might as well start building a pop-gun to play with because soon you WILL be gunless. And when they DO come to get em, believe you me, THEIR guns will be a whole lot bigger than yours.[B)]
quote:If the general populace believes that that perp is just a common gun owner..indicative of us all..there is no common ground to have a discussion.So your preference is to just sit on lists like this pizzin and moanin and wait for the ban? Or maybe you could hurry it along by frightening the opposition more so they work even harder?[xx(] You can wave the 2nd Amendment til you are blue in the face and it accomplishes nothing (other than a blue face) without productive action. The key to success is to realize what you have to work with then using it effectively.
You and others keep knocking the NRA? Do you realize that if it was not for them that many more gun laws would be on the book. They are holding back the flood. Can you?
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
Think about that, for a minute. Anti's offer a solution that includes many of us to simply do nothing, while gun right advocates offer statistics, which to average people are just numbers, anyhow, as their proof as to how YOU need to do something.... The trend is that people are not willing to do something when they could do nothing. That's apathy.
We cannot always assume everyone else is on the same level as we are, on this.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
"Followers of Christ, be armed."
I will NOT wade in the cesspool to attempt to regain my rights.I WILL NOT BEG ON MY KNEES in front of hollow little men,hugely puffed up with their own sense of power..for my rights as a Citizen of America under the Bill of Rights and Constitution.
No sir.
I will NOT support an NRA selling my rights down the river in the spirit of " Compromise "..a word you love.
I will not talk gently to those willing to barter off just a little more freedom to appease the masses ignorant ...or too stupid to know.
As an anti-gun compromiser..your opinion I will listen to..but respect does not come with that listen.You are certainly entitled to turn your back on the freedoms the Founders fought and died for..but those of us with a clear understanding of the Second Amendment feel far differently about the subject.
My belief is that the pols will pass a total gun ban..sooner or later.
Better NOW.....then later.That ban MUST COME without ANY violence on the part of gun owners to hasten it...any violence from legitimate gun owners WILL defeat the purpose of withdrawing.
God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??
Ideals are wonderful and admirable. Ideals are what founded this country. But also in the founding of this country was compromise, accepting that not all people think alike nor value the same thing. Without this there would have been constant fighting and we would all still be eating tea and crumpets. The ideal of America is that not one class or thought may dictate a way of life which infringes upon other's. Everyone must give and take to achieve a social balance. (OMG!!! I used the "S" word!!). This is also in continuous flux.
Gunphreak seems to be hitting the nail on the head. The NRA could preach many statistics 100% supporting safe gun ownership and prove over and over their point, it only takes one incident as the one above to scare the hell outta Joe Citizen and nulify these numbers. We need to figure out some way to combat this if we are to gain ground.
While gun owners feel that they have the right under the 2nd Amendment to own guns to varying degrees (and I personally agree with the general right), the psyche of America has been distancing itself from this over the past years mainly due to fear. Remember that Hitler was able to accomplish what he did principally due to fear. First the German people's fear of poverty, then their fear of government. Fear can control many things as has been evident over the past 4 years in America. Why do you think there have been alerts and the such at regular intervals? Can't let Americans feel TOO secure. Look back when gun ownership was at a height and very acceptable. There was little fear in America. We felt secure and little threatened. Fear can mutate and turn inward very easily.
No matter what we believe, we only have reality to effect change in our lives. This does not mean that we must just hold on for the ride, we can influence our journey's path. Even if we go completely against the current it will eventually redirect our path.
Only when we know why can we begin to effect change.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
quote:Highball, you ARE part of the problem whether you realize it or not.
I am sorry....I didn't realize I was a Constitution hating,gun hating cretin..seeking to destroy the foundations of this country..all the time,I thought I was upholding the fine tradititons of the Founders.
quote:position which you describe is like cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Perhaps.However...sometimes the patient must get worse..before it gets better.
See..people like you don't believe there is a problem.You either aren't old enough to know when we still had a bit of firearms freedom in this country..or you are actively seeking to limit that freedom.
quote:But you have the right to your position and to "do nothing" no matter what anyone else thinks.
Ahh,my friend...you merely have a belief I 'do nothing'...education being an absolutely vital part of any change or action.
quote:But to pizz and moan about something and do nothing to facilitate change (actually in your case you are accelerating the process you are complaining about) is nothing less than hypocrisy.
Hypocrisy is a charge I totally reject.
You may very well be..as certainly the NRA are hiprocrites.
I make no bones about wishing a total ban on firearms.See..at that moment..Americans WILL NOT give up their guns.
A whole lot of sniveling cowards,unfit to live in a free country...WILL line up to turn in their arms...
quote:Shadow83: But you have the right to your position and to "do nothing" no matter what anyone else thinks.
Ahh,my friend...you merely have a belief I 'do nothing'...education being an absolutely vital part of any change or action. It's MORE than a belief my double talking friend. Read your OWN words:
quote:Highball Posted - 03/14/2005 : 9:12:07 PM: Yes,Shadow.."Do nothing" is PRECISELY what I intend doing..and will try my level best to convince every American I can to do the same.Yes, you ARE part of the problem. Where's JamesRK when you need him!?!?
It is clear you wish to argue only for arguement's sake. There is no respectful give and take here, only you looking for exposed pieces of flesh for you to pick at like a vulture. If I didn't know better I would think that you had PMS.[;)]
Goodnight Mary Ellen [xx(]
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
By " Do Nothing "...I refer to that "Doing Something" that compromisers cherish...which consists of crawling to your "elected officials" on your hands and knees..begging them to obey the Constitution.
You don't consider it begging..because you agree with much of their gun laws....as does the NRA.
My "Doing Nothing" consists of educating people in the ultimate hopelessness of stopping a juggernaut by blowing your breath at it.
You just wind up weak and blue....
we have lost the battle of preserving our rights.Insanity is doing the same thing over and over..expecting different results.Begging empty suits is insanity.
They have won battle after battle..destroying the Constitution.They have not yet won the war.
Ah,yes,Shadow..I see your confusion.
By " Do Nothing "...I refer to that "Doing Something" that compromisers cherish...which consists of crawling to your "elected officials" on your hands and knees..begging them to obey the Constitution.
You don't consider it begging..because you agree with much of their gun laws....as does the NRA.
My "Doing Nothing" consists of educating people in the ultimate hopelessness of stopping a juggernaut by blowing your breath at it.
You just wind up weak and blue....
we have lost the battle of preserving our rights.Insanity is doing the same thing over and over..expecting different results.Begging empty suits is insanity.
They have won battle after battle..destroying the Constitution.They have not yet won the war.
So just why are you here OR even in this country?[?]
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
You and your support of anti-Constitutional laws are the root cause of the explosion of crime..and the resultant ever tightening grip of Socialism and tyranny in this country.
You and the NRA and EVERY PERSON willing to trade freedom for 'security'....a slave is pretty secure,as long as he serves his master well....
I can imagine how frightening it is to actually be brought to the edge of thinking about what freedom REALLY is..instead of the pablum fed you by the Elites every night on the tv news..the president prattling on about "Democracy"..and speading it "worldwide"...
Well..those unwilling to learn from history WILL repeat it..and the greatest country on earth has been sold out.
Not by me,....'bubba'..but by your kind.
Shadow83
I have great love for humanity, it's the people I can't stand.
Until then, I'm sticking with the GOA.