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Ah, for goodness' sake... Here we go again. C&P

chunkstylechunkstyle Member Posts: 2,463 ✭✭✭✭✭
Handgun Law Dealt Blow; Churches Get Exemption

(AP) St. Paul Minnesota churches deserve an exemption from a state law requiring them to either post a sign or verbally inform people that concealed handguns aren't allowed on their property, a judge has ruled.

Hennepin County District Judge LaJune Thomas Lange granted two Twin Cities churches a temporary injunction Friday, the first legal blow to a 2005 law that was passed after an earlier version stumbled in the courts.

"The 2005 Act impermissibly intrudes into the free exercise of religion by arbitrary definitions, which dictate restrictions on the use of church property for worship, childcare, parking and rental space," Lange wrote.

Her ruling applies in Hennepin County until a trial is held. But an attorney for the churches hinted at a forthcoming push to have the order recognized elsewhere, too.

The law allows people at least 21 years old with a clean record, no mental illness and proper training to get a permit to carry a gun. Prior to 2003, local law enforcement authorities had more say over who received a permit.

Property owners that want to keep guns out must give notice individually to people entering their buildings or put up a specifically worded sign.

The 2003 version -- struck down on a technicality -- required businesses, churches and property owners to use both forms of notification if they wanted to ban guns.

The Edina Community Lutheran Church and the Unity Church-Unitarian in St. Paul, which were involved in challenges to the earlier version, said the recently enacted law still interfered with religious beliefs. They said the requirements dictated how they communicate with members, visitors and employees.

"Religious institutions need room to act on their beliefs," said David Lillehaug, one of the attorneys for the churches. "The Legislature has ignored the pleas of religious institutions for some flexibility."

Ignoring the law, the Edina church put up signs that read "Blessed are the peacemakers. Firearms are prohibited in this place of sanctuary."

The judge also freed the churches from having to allow guns in their parking lots or space they rent.

Joe Olson, president of the Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance and a chief proponent of the law, didn't see the ruling as a major setback. But he thinks it will pose logistical problems.

"There's going to be 5,000 chuchres with 5,000 different ways of communicating their own particular message," Olson said. "The Legislaure wanted there to be one uniform way of doing it so there would be clear notice to the permit holders so they could comply. That's all out the window."

(c 2005 The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross."
~Sinclair Lewis, It Can't Happen Here

"Our enemies...never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
~President George W. Bush


  • WoundedWolfWoundedWolf Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    As another thread pointed out, you cannot carry concealed with a CCW in most public buildings anymore either. I believe this is the bridge that will carry these restrictions over to private property as well. First it was public buildings and schools, now it's churchs, next it will be private schools, then any location where children are present, then it will be private businesses at the employer's discretion, until finally there will be no more concealed carry.

    Many places have open carry restrictions too, so soon everywhere will be like Kalifornia where you can only carry a gun in your vehicle or on your person if you are travelling to and from a "legitimate" use (such as hunting or target practice). And it will have to be kept locked in a container separate from the ammunition (as has been Kalifornia law for several years).

    It is a shame that we have moved from a time when people wouldn't carry firearms into a church out of simple respect, to a time when a church has actually pursued legislation to restrict its parishoners' rights to carry a firearm. Perhaps the church leaders should instead be asking themselves why its patrons feel compelled to carry firearms into their church.



    samsm.gif"If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced Patriots to prevent its ruin."
    -Samuel Adams, Patriot/Brewer
  • ComengetitComengetit Member Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Amen, WW.

    "Molon Labe"; ancient Greek for "Come and get them".

    To the brave men in that narrow pass so long ago, freedom was more important than anything; even their lives. May we ever remember that fact should we be issued the same degrading terms.

    "If I find you here Tonight, THEY will find you here in the Morning"
  • shootstrightshootstright Member Posts: 342 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Without a metal detector who would know , it is concealed .

    How about this : Everyone with a carry permit at lest once a week go to a federal building and check your hand gun at the guards post.
    This would be very interesting .

  • ComengetitComengetit Member Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Same building, same time, same city! I love it. Talk about *! ROFLMAO[}:)]

    "The only purpose for a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should have never laid down to begin with."

    "If I find you here Tonight..... THEY will find you here in the Morning"
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hey, this tells people like us which churches are not willing to follow Christ's instructions to be armed in Luke 22:36.

    A litmus test, if you will.

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    Oh, yes...the church pulpits are full of Devils disciples...leading people AWAY from the path of God.

    Teaching folks to take no responsibility for themselves OR their loved ones...

    The ealiest pictures of churches in this country showed people on their way to it...ARMED TO THE you suppose they stacked their weapons outside the door..ripe pickin's for any savage wandering by ? Today there have been several mass shootings in church..and blindly following the misleaders preachings off the pulpit
    aided and abeted these vicious barbarians in their savage acts.
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