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Gun Rights Forum....

HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
What say you, Gun Owners and Gun Rights Supporters ?
Should the Forum consist of people congratulating themselves on this or that CCW law passed here or there..or the fight to get same..


Or should SOME actually point out what GUN RIGHTS actually mean ..so as to give another side of the problem ?

I have a belief. See...I believe that people without any understanding of what rights ARE..are ripe for the plucking..the plucking I see all around us here in this once free land.
I realize how unpopular this view is..should I say I am sorry ? I AM sorry..sorry that we the people have strayed so far from the path of freedom.

What say you.......?

Comments

  • jaflowersjaflowers Member Posts: 698 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well Highball I believe this forum can be used for both. Eveyone has a little different feeling on what they believe their gun rights to be. You, I and several others on here believe that gun rights by definition are 'no holds bar'. Others are content to accept bits and pieces handed to them by elected officials that have no one's interest at heart except the person who pays the most. The one thing that we all, at least most of us, have in common is a love for this great nation and the hope that it can once again be for FREEDOM!!
  • pickenuppickenup Member Posts: 22,846 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    When we are talking about turning an "inalienable right" into a REVOCABLE "privilege" how is that a step in the right direction? By condoning this practice, we are "admitting" that it....never was, is not now, nor will ever be, an "inalienable" right.

    On the other hand. In the face of 20,000+ gun laws aimed directly AT us (not criminals) US, the gun owners. Finally having one law "allowing" us to "bear arms" concealed, seems to be a (fox, dare I say it?) "compromise" the sheeple are willing to live with.

    Vermont, and for the most part Alaska, are the only two states with the correct "basic" CCW law. If you can legally own a firearm, you can carry it concealed, with NO license of any kind. Until each and every state adopts this same practice, we will continue to be a nation of sheeple.
    ____________

    With what I just stated above, in all good conscience on this issue, I have to admit my own guilt. Flame me if you must.

    While I had little to do with having the current CCW law, that was recently passed in Colorado. Once it WAS passed, I did obtain a CCW. While a Vermont style law is MY choice, I did buckle under to the hand that had been dealt to me in this state. My reason for obtaining a CCW (NOT that it makes it right) is this. Since I AM going to carry a concealed firearm (I have for many many YEARS, law or no law) if I am ever forced to use it, they will NOT be able to CHARGE me with the "unlawfully" carrying of a concealed weapon. Plain and simple.

    I will continue to fight, as I have in the past, for a Vermont/Alaska style carry law.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    There is no one way to approach or deal with "gun rights" because unfortuntely anti-gun liberals have twisted the situation into a knot. There are gun rights laws we gunners should be able to enjoy based on the US and some state constitutions, some laws on the books that help us to enjoy our gun rights, and just the law of nature that the basic right of being able to defend you and yours is a natural right that we should be considered to be born with. In addition, lawful, responsible and honest American citizens, the supposed and true "owners", "bosses", "shareholders", "source of government power", etc, of American government, should enjoy maximum rights with a minimum of restriction because of what I just described about them.

    So there you have one type of gun rights; the type that we should just automatically be able to enjoy. However, the liberals have twisted things so badly that we gunners are forced to duck and weave and try to "untwist" what the liberals have done to us. One way to untwist things, is to get laws passed that at least give us back some of the rights that we have lost. Rights that we should have already have had available to us; but obviously don't or haven't until recently. Now this may sound like a willingness to compromise, but actually it is just a means of at least getting our gun rights back.

    So you have three types of gun rights. The gun rights that we should have had all along, the gun rights we would like to have, and finally, the gun rights that we can realistically expect to recover for ourselves.

    There is no one "gun rights" situation in which to take a stand or frame a discussion or Gunrights forum post.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'll tell you guys what. Ohio's CHL statute was not celebration-worthy. Even if it was all about just a shall issue permit, there are so many perilous features, and voiding resolutions in it, it might as well not even exist.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by gunphreak
    I'll tell you guys what. Ohio's CHL statute was not celebration-worthy. Even if it was all about just a shall issue permit, there are so many perilous features, and voiding resolutions in it, it might as well not even exist.


    I believe that once you establish a right, even if it is only limited to being established in principle, then you have at least got the door open and now you can work at wiggling your way through that door and expand/improve on your rights.

    That is not fair, honest or the way our founders meant for us to have to do in order to get our gun rights, but that is the reality of it now in certain cases.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Perhaps, and one thing is for certain. A CHL permit system does also do one very undesirable thing, that prove its undoing. It is a form of registration, showing the most likely candidates to resist the police state. Hitler used a very similar list, even though his was a bit more exhaustive, and the whole system in general can be subverted quite easily.

    So it really is up to you. If you want to stand and be counted, then it is a victory, however small as it may be, but if you fear the list will serve against you later, then maybe it isn't in your best interest.

    An example... I have one (I got it before I came to the above conclusion, and so, now that I have it, I am bound by its potential consequences) and was pulled over a couple weeks ago. I was in my grandma's car, at the time, and the officer took my license and registration... when he came back, he asked me if I was a CHL holder. I told him I was. He asked me if I was carrying. I told him I wasn't.
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I realize that in state to state things vary. I really don't see the thing with ccw here in KY. We have the right to carry open anywere execpt A bar, bank, post office, goverment of school. While members of my family that have their ccw have been told they can't carry concealed in an establishment that says no ccw. Our laws, and opinion of the attorney general say different for open carry. I am considering the ccw, just don't see the need to pay 100 bucks for training, and certificate just to cover it up.
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    The usual 'suspects' heard from.... I assume that the other 70 or so folks reading this post prefer a simpler forum...one presenting the position that we are truly blessed to only have 20,000 or so gun laws in this country...and perhaps we should do a better job of kissing the rings of those elite condensending to allow us close enough to do so...

    Thanks to those responding. Even Tr...who believes differently then I on certain subjects...and defends his ground well..admits that there may well be more then one way to the ultimate goal.
  • shootstrightshootstright Member Posts: 342 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Highball
    It's about each new generation accepting a little more. After awhile the old farts die off and young new generations will one at a time become lined up the way they want.
    Adolph Hitler said you do not mater we have your children .
    After 3 or 4 more generations it won't make any difference . Just look at what's happening in the schools today. No dads in the home. Singals for mothers , gay teachers teaching alternative life styles . Anti-gun ,anti-hunting, anti-military, anti-big business , ect,ect,ect.
    If you want more of the same , all you must do is keep putting crap for brains liberals in charge of your life.
    JUST KEEP VOTING FOR THE DEMOCRATS AND RINO'S
  • WoundedWolfWoundedWolf Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:The usual 'suspects' heard from.... I assume that the other 70 or so folks reading this post prefer a simpler forum...one presenting the position that we are truly blessed to only have 20,000 or so gun laws in this country...and perhaps we should do a better job of kissing the rings of those elite condensending to allow us close enough to do so...

    Highball, you are a good man, but you have the tact of a bull in a china shop.[:D]

    I started to read this thread when it was first posted, but I could tell that it was going to be a very HEAVY topic, so I set it aside for a while because I have been very busy and distracted lately.

    I have finally gotten the chance to read it in detail, and I just want to say that I am very proud to participate in this forum with all of you GOOD men. There is so much TRUTH in this thread that I have nothing to add.

    -Wolf
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    Wounded Wolf;............[:D][:0]

    No offense taken...[:D] you of course state the obvious...and thanks for the kind words.

    I realized that some would prefer to think about the subject a bit...others would study the answers given.

    Wasn't aiming at the regulars here at all..just the lurkers..hoping to jar them a bit.

    I want people to get passionate about gun rights. Getting mad at me is perhaps the first real emotion some people have had in years..as I rip the blindfolds off their eyes. I also depend on the more 'moderate' amoung you'all to soften my 'harsh'...between us all...perhaps we may win a few more away from the Beast....
  • mrseatlemrseatle Member Posts: 15,806
    edited November -1
    Your words have the ring of truth Highball. There is a greater battle then gun rights going on. And preparation for the battle is more important then the battle itself.
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