Neck reaming and neck turning . . .

Alan Rushing

I've limited experience with the processes.

Yes, I know what it's all about, but do not have much practical or comparative experience.

I'd appreciate feedback from experienced folks on what make, model, etc of gear and then the proceedural sequesnce that works best.

Give me the best info for a consistent production if you would.

Mobuck

I turn necks on some 22/250 & 220 Swift cases or when reforming from a larger case to smaller and/or shorter case.

Alan Rushing

Mobuck - I hear that, but which "gear" or tools. I've seen a lot of differing looking bits and rigs for doing the deed. Which do you use ... and why for?

What do you do when, with what and why in that order?

bpost

http://www.kmshooting.com/

62fuelie

I have been using a Forster hand powered unit for years. I use it to true up the exterior of the necks of my .222, .22/250, .243 and .25-'06 cases before the first time I load them. On the higher pressure cartridges (.22/250) I check them for length every 5 loadings and for neck thickness every 10. I've never had to check them at 20. The nice thing about the Forster is that you can mount a reamer an outside turner and trim to length as well.

JustC

I use the K&M tools as referenced by bpost. Ken is an awesome guy to deal with, and will ship to you, BEFORE he receives payment, (or at least for me, he did). His tools are VERY precise and easy to use.

That being said, if you wish to do this for a factory chamber, you are wasting your time. These tools are for match grade chambers and tight necks.

Alan Rushing

Thank you all for the information.

Now I have myself more "homework"! [;)]

Mobuck

I use a Forster hand powered case trimmer with the neck turning attachment. It is a slow process if done right but solves the problem of thick/uneven necks on the 22/250 and 220. I've also used it when making 308 Norma cases from 300 H&H and 257 Wby from 264 Win.
At one time, I had several LEE target type loaders which came with a neck reamer but those are literally collector items now.

zimmden

Neck turning tools: Ball mic, K&M or Sinclair neck turner, neck expander mandrel, Imperial sizing wax, outside deburring tool and a magnifying glass. Procedure: Determine neck thickness desired, Size neck, expand to fit NT mandrel, use Imperial for smooth turning, neck turn in 2 passes if more than .001 cut is needed, chamfer inside neck. Set up neck turner on old or reject brass until proper thickness is set.

JustC

The K&M tool and sinclair neck thickness mic


The finished product

bpost

JustC, I was told it is a good idea to take a "bite" out of the neck shoulder junction when turning necks. It assures the neck will not hang up when chambering in a short (tight) chamber and gave a place for the brass to flow when first firing.

I noticed the neck on the case pictured has been turned but the turning has stopped well short of the junction. Have I been turning the necks wrong?

JustC

No you are prolly doing it right. I try to stay right at/near the junction because I don't "feel" that biting into the shoulder is going to do anything. I would go all the way to the shoulder in a chamber that had a tight neck. This chamber has a no-turn neck, but is much tighter than a factory chamber. This is also a Lapua 6.5x55 case waiting to be fireformed to Ackley Improved. After forming, I take another look at the neck and decide if turning closer to the shoulder is necessary or if the "flow" ironed some of that difference out.

Not to mention, the sizing bushing (redding competition dies) doesn't go all the way to the shoulder junction anyway.


I'll dig out some info later if I get time and see what Ken's directions say.

Rocky Raab

Some tools won't let you turn all the way to the shoulder junction. The case pictured has a ring where the tool "bottomed out" against the shoulder. The argument against going all the way is that the tool will cut too deeply right at the shoulder, to the point of almost cutting the neck off. Firing such a case could leave the neck stuck in the chamber throat.

Some basics: Reaming removes metal from the inside of the neck, but it cuts equally all round. If the neck was thick on one side it will still be that way but will be thinner all around.

Turning removes only the thick spots. In successive passes, it will shave the metal to an even thickness all around. If turned as pictured above (with a small length of unturned neck) there will still be a section of thick and uneven metal. After firing, there will be a "doughnut" or ring of thick metal INSIDE the case at that point. That ring can hinder bullet seating, inhibit gas flow and cause other undesirable things - according to some shooters. Those who worry about such things will ream the turned neck after the first firing to get rid of that doughnut.

Neither turning nor reaming is really necessary unless you have a custom "tight neck" rifle. Factory rifles may actually become LESS accurate and have shorter case life with turned brass because the chamber was already larger than required.

sandwarrior

quote:Originally posted by bpost
http://www.kmshooting.com/


I get goosebumps all over just looking at their catalog[:D][:D]

bpost

quote:Originally posted by sandwarrior
quote:Originally posted by bpost
http://www.kmshooting.com/


I get goosebumps all over just looking at their catalog[:D][:D]


I pretty much went whole hog when I got my stuff from them. I got carbide cutters for removing the doughnut from inside cases, different mandrels and all sorts of toys. I studied what I wanted and called them to place the order. They shipped it all to me in about a week with the invoice enclosed. I cut them a check and sent it to them the next day. Great people, fantastic products.

JustC

you won't be sorry.[;)]

Mobuck

You can develop a "doughnut" at the neck/should juncture which will either inhibit bullet seating or cause that spot to swell to the point of not chambering(only when loading bullets with a bearing surface longer than the neck). The only resolution for this is neck reaming. I don't normally reload a case that many times nor have I found it a problem but it can happen. Extreme care must be used when turning that area so as not to create the hazard of the neck tearing off and sticking in the chamber/leade.
The most likely cartridge I have for the doughnut effect would be my 220 Swift and I don't shoot it that much so most of my cases have only a couple of reloads on them. Plus, it does not shoot well with any bullet over 53 grains so they never reach the doughnut in the neck anyway.

Alan Rushing

The necks seem to become complex quickly. I've got more learning to do.

Thanks for the jump start with the information and suggestions; appreciated.

243winxb

Lyman outside neck turning attachment- Not turning into the shoulder when using bushing dies is not good for accuracy. My Redding Types-S Full Length sizing bushing die does not size all the way to the neck shoulder junction. Some do, some dont. The unsided part of the neck will expand to the chamber after 3 firing, centering the neck in the chamber. If you did not turn fully into the shoulder, the round will not be centered in the chamber. To use the Lyman, the brass must be FL sized before turning in a standard die. Remember the bushing does not size all the way to the shoulder.

243winxb

"A doughnut or ring of thick metal INSIDE the case at that point. That ring can hinder bullet seating, inhibit gas flow and cause other undesirable things - according to some shooters." On a tight neck chamber, it can raise pressure to a dangerous level. Even more if the bullet has a pressure ring, The bullet would have to be seated deep into the case making contact with the donut. "Those who worry about such things will ream the turned neck after the first firing to get rid of that doughnut." Reaming is done first. The reamer will be about .002" smaller in diameter than the bullet diameter. The expander will then push any extra metal to the outside when it can be turned off.

Neither turning nor reaming is really necessary unless you have a custom "tight neck" rifle. Factory rifles may actually become LESS accurate and have shorter case life with turned brass because the chamber was already larger than required. Doing your own testing is the only way to tell. I find factory rifles shoot better with neck turning and full benchrest prep of the brass.

jonk

I do this mainly when reforming brass from one caliber to another; for instance 45/70 to 8mm Siamese, or with particularly thick milsurp cases (Canadian boxer primed 8mm for instance). I got the Lyman tool as I already had their trimmer. I'd give it a B-. It works but it is hard to set up just right, doesn't give particularly consistent results, and is slow; but it DOES thin the necks, and for my issue is fine and was the cheapest way to go.