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gun blowup

pulsarncpulsarnc Member Posts: 6,249 ✭✭✭✭
edited September 2012 in Perry Shooter Competition Shooting and Reloading Forum
Loaded up some reduced loads for my Weatherby Vanguard 30-06 and shot them today .Research and a check of the Acuurate powder website and articles in Handloader By Mike Venturino lead me to try Accurate 5744 powder. Lee 180 grain gas-checked cast bullets and powder charges fron 26 to 30 grains. Mixed brass and CCI#200 large rifle primers.Each charge was individually weighed and dumped into the brass. Been reloading since 1995 and NEVER take shortcuts and always segregate my brass from one side of the bench to the other as I load.Due to my procedure I will not say a double charge is impossible but it is highly unlikely. Started with the 26 grain loads and worked my way thru the ladder. Chronograph readings were within expected ranges and recoil etc was normal .Problem came on the 4th shot of the 29 grain loads . When I recovered my senses I was bleeding from my face and the rifle was in pieces. Scope was on the ground Stock blown apart at the magazine and the action blown apart Bolt welded shut and the receiver ring split down both sides so that you could wiggle the barrel Trip to the ER to get my eye flushed out. 7 or 8 minor cuts on face none needed treatment Cornea of right eye is scratched but no permanent damage THANKS TO GOD FOR HAVING HIS HAND ON MY SHOULDER AND PROTECTING ME! Will post pics tomorrow Anyone have any constructive ideas ? I have pulled some of the remaining loads and the are all within specs I am at a total loss as to the cause ideas ?
cry Havoc and let slip  the dogs of war..... 
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    jonkjonk Member Posts: 10,121
    edited November -1
    First, glad you're basically ok.

    I don't think a double charge would fit in the case- you might try that to see if it fits, just to know.
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    v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Reduced loading densities of very slow powder in large cases rings a bell of detonation.
    Using that reasoning, I wouldn't use a reduced load that hadn't a lot of safe history to it.
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    charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 6,579 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Glad you are ok, sorry about the rifle.

    I doubt that you could get a double charge in the case, 58gr is a lot (you should check to see). If you use a powder measure you might get a light load then a extra heavy one by enough to cause a major pressure problem.

    I charge the loading block full, then do a visual check to make sure the levels look the same before seating bullets. For my 22 Jet I use a marked dowel to check the powder level. I ran 32 pounds of 5744 (the old size kernels) in a 44 Mag S&W and it was my favorite load. I didn't like the new stuff so switched to BlueDot.

    You might never figure out what went wrong. I would not think it was case failure or a primer problem.

    I think that 5744 has the highest nitroglycerin content of any canister powder.
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    tsr1965tsr1965 Member Posts: 8,682 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I will need to see the pictured to make a determination, but my suspicion, is that you dropped a gas check in the barrel, and it acted like an obstruction, upon firing the next round. I have never liked gas checked bullets for this reason, and have seen several revolvers blown apart, just because of this.

    Best
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    MIKE WISKEYMIKE WISKEY Member, Moderator Posts: 9,972 ******
    edited November -1
    "is that you dropped a gas check in the barrel,"............I doubt that a single gas check would cause a blow-up (a 'ringed' barrel yes). you had a very 'over pressure' event, what caused it is still undertermined. I have seen one other Howa that did this, a .270 using reloads and a max charge of 4350.
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    babunbabun Member Posts: 11,054 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Reduced loads are the most dangerous thing a reloader can fool with.
    Never liked them...see no good reason for them. About the only reduced loads I've done are for the .38 special mid range target pistols.
    If you need a reduced power load, Get a smaller gun!!
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    jonkjonk Member Posts: 10,121
    edited November -1
    This is NOT a reduced load. It is load data as published by the manufacturer, a nice mid range load. It IS a load designed specifically for cast lead, as it is a bulky powder that fills the case and is fairly fast burning.

    Any chance there was another powder in your dispenser, just a few grains in the bottom, that contaminated ONE cartridge? If visually similar to the 5744 that could cause quite a problem if of dissimalar burn rate. Even if you weighed the charges.
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    Rocky RaabRocky Raab Member Posts: 14,190 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm equally at a loss to explain this. It's not a reduced load; that's not a slow powder; a double charge probably wouldn't fit; each charge was weighed; and as the previous shot delivered a normal chronograph reading, that bullet couldn't have stuck in the barrel.

    I'm stumped. But I'm glad you weren't seriously injured.
    I may be a bit crazy - but I didn't drive myself.
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    babunbabun Member Posts: 11,054 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Reduced Loads, Lead Bullets
    bullet grs
    5744 160 LYM RNGC 27.0 2,085 34.5 2,525 41,800 3.035
    5744 173 LYM FNGC 25.0 1,920 32.0 2,337 41,100 3.015
    5744 200 LYM RNGC 22.0 1,625 30.0 2,134 42,000 3.250


    This is C&P from Acuurate"s charts. Page 16

    My take on 5744, {which I don't use} is it is for reduced loads.

    What load chart shows 180gr bullets with 29 grains of that 5744??
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    babunbabun Member Posts: 11,054 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by jonk
    This is NOT a reduced load. It is load data as published by the manufacturer, a nice mid range load. It IS a load designed specifically for cast lead, as it is a bulky powder that fills the case and is fairly fast burning.

    Any chance there was another powder in your dispenser, just a few grains in the bottom, that contaminated ONE cartridge? If visually similar to the 5744 that could cause quite a problem if of dissimalar burn rate. Even if you weighed the charges.


    That is a reduced load.
    Look at page 16 of Accurate PDF file for 30-06
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    bpostbpost Member Posts: 32,664 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am glad you are OK!

    With the tons of 5744 burned pushing tons of lead bullets out of rifle barrels with zero problems something had to go wrong with the round fired to weld the bolt closed and split the receiver ring.......

    If you have any rounds left pull them down looking for answers.

    I would guess a double charge just fits to the base/middle of the neck....
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    Laredo LeftyLaredo Lefty Member Posts: 13,451 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Any chance of an obstructed bore?
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    jonkjonk Member Posts: 10,121
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by babun
    quote:Originally posted by jonk
    This is NOT a reduced load. It is load data as published by the manufacturer, a nice mid range load. It IS a load designed specifically for cast lead, as it is a bulky powder that fills the case and is fairly fast burning.

    Any chance there was another powder in your dispenser, just a few grains in the bottom, that contaminated ONE cartridge? If visually similar to the 5744 that could cause quite a problem if of dissimalar burn rate. Even if you weighed the charges.


    That is a reduced load.
    Look at page 16 of Accurate PDF file for 30-06

    Whatever Accurate might call it, it is not a reduced load. I looked at that exact pdf. What it IS is a low recoil load, with normal powder charge for that powder and bullet weight. A REDUCED load would be reducing the PUBLISHED load to UNDER the start load, at least in my opinion... which is where you run into trouble.

    All I can conclude is either a gross occlusion in the metal that just finally let go or a totally flawed piece of brass with massive case head failure.
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    FrancFFrancF Member Posts: 35,278 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It's been my understanding XMP 5744 was designed as a smokeless BP replacement for strait wall cases like 45-70 45-110 45-120, cowboy loads etc.
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    JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    unless it was detonation, I got nothing.

    be thankful you are OK.
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