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Neck or full-length sizing
utbrowningman
Member Posts: 2,723 ✭✭✭
Still a novice at reloading and have a single-stage Lee press. If I understand correctly, I should be able to just neck size my fire- formed brass for several (3-4?) firings before full length sizing. Is this accurate? Reloading .30-06 and .30-30 at this time.
Comments
Neck size for turn bolt guns. Break open guns you can also usually get away with.
Remington 788 is a good example. Step on the throttle and you better full length size.
Several.
Anywhere from 3? to 7? 8? all depends..
This is why reloaders are brass scroungers.
Oh, and you can probably back off the FL sizing die 1/2 a turn and only partially size your 30-06 brass. This will help brass life.
How many loadings with moderate loads?
Several.
Anywhere from 3? to 7? 8? all depends..
This is why reloaders are brass scroungers.
Oh, and you can probably back off the FL sizing die 1/2 a turn and only partially size your 30-06 brass. This will help brass life.
Case life is very dependent on many different factors, the quality of the cases being one of the big points to consider. In my 14" 7mm TCU I had a 5 shot case life with federal cases, it is a real pain to have that short of a case life in a wildcat, switching over to Lapua brass I have extended that to 15 shots without a single failure as of yet. I have over 10 firings on Winchester brass for my Marlin 336 30-30 while Remington has given shorter life with loose primer pockets. Others will disagree with me as they have had different experiences with different manufactures, they key is to find what works best in your guns.
One thing that you must remember is that anytime you change a component such as the brass you must work up your loads once again as the differences in the construction of the brass will change the needs of the load. I had a rude reminder of this with a 300WSM Striker Pistol I was fire forming loads for. 300WSM brass is had to come by and expensive when you do so I was shooting a mixed brass load with the same load in each with cases of Norma, Winchester and Federal manufacture. I had no issue with the Norma or Winchester brass, but with the first case of Federal the bolt would not open, upon forcing the bolt the extractor broke leaving the case stuck in the chamber. After getting the case out it was showing over pressure signs in every way that the book will tell you. I pulled the bullets on the other 19 pieces of brass and the load was exactly the same as with the Norma and Winchester, the only change was the brass.
I do not neck size for any rifles except bolt actions types. I full length size for pumps and lever actions and carefully chamber test before labeling them as hunting ammo.
I keep a real good log of the brass indicating how many times it's been trimmed, how many times it's been neck sized, it's separated weight within 3 grains, primer pockets uniformed inside and which rifle by model and serial number the brass is reloaded.
All this information stays with the reloaded ammo and any brass waiting for reloading.
Brass that has been trimmed 3 times is labeled for low recoil reduced loads and no longer used for regular reloading loads. Brass that has required being trimmed more than 3 times is likely to start cracking or head separating. (brass is getting thinned and work hardened) I length check new brass and trim it to minimum length before 1st loading. I do not count this first new brass trim because it's just preparing the new brass and it gives me a heads up as to how much the new brass stretches on the first firing which is quite common for new brass to need a trim and may require another trim after 1st firing. The first fired trim is #1 trim. The neck sizing and low recoil reduced loads very seldom require any trimming. (I have some reduced load, low recoil loads at 30-30 velocities that is very accurate for deer hunting and can be used as practice rounds for recoil sensitive hunters.
I've reloaded 30;06 brass 20 times or more by neck sizing only.
I use a propane cigarette lighter to smoke the neck of a couple cases when setting the die for neck sizing. (this lets me see how much of the neck is sized and I go for about 80% of the neck and stay away from the shoulder.
I chamber test the brass in the gun BEFORE adding the primer, powder, bullet.
If the reloads are for hunting I take the gun to a safe place outside and test all the rounds to make sure they chamber ok. (neck sizing only is really not recommended for use as hunting ammo due to the possibility of a round not chambering or hanging too tight in the bore while a bear is thinking about making a meal of you, etc)I do not reload any ammo for anyone other than myself and my own guns and I do not shoot other peoples reloads.
I label the brass as match brass when I've matched the weight within 3 grains, number of times trimmed, number of times reloaded.
I do not buy brass that is termed once fired. This is asking for reloading problems.
Stay safe and enjoy.
I don't neck size-everything gets full length sized since I have multiple rifles in each caliber. Brass is relatively cheap for most common cartridges so I don't feel it's worthwhile economically to neck size. I'm not a benchrest shooter and get adequate accuracy from full length sized cases for my needs so just no need for neck sizing.
I do lots of target practice and trying different reload recipes such as different powders, bullets, etc, for best accuracy is one reason I neck size to get maximum reloading life from the brass.
In my humble opinion, (IMHO) Neck sizing only for accuracy only is really not worth the effort or time for a big game hunting rifle.
One of the advantages, to me, is actually saving time. Neck sizing generally does not require lube so the cases can be loaded right away. With FL size, the lube has to be wiped, washed, or tumbled away.
I find that cracked necks are the chief cause of case loss. Conventional dies, including neck sizing dies, make the neck too small and then the expander button opens it up. That overworks the case neck and they eventually crack. You can anneal and that will help but it's messy and time consuming. I've got several sets of Lee collet dies and I would think they would not overwork the case necks as much. I haven't kept complete enough notes yet to prove if they work.
for accuracy only is really not worth the effort or time for a big game hunting rifle.
One of the advantages, to me, is actually saving time. Neck sizing generally does not require lube so the cases can be loaded right away. With FL size, the lube has to be wiped, washed, or tumbled away.
I find that cracked necks are the chief cause of case loss. Conventional dies, including neck sizing dies, make the neck too small and then the expander button opens it up. That overworks the case neck and they eventually crack. You can anneal and that will help but it's messy and time consuming. I've got several sets of Lee collet dies and I would think they would not overwork the case necks as much. I haven't kept complete enough notes yet to prove if they work.
Right about removing the case lube after full length sizing BEFORE sending them to the polishing media. After cases have been full length sized over about 3 times they have a tendency to start neck cracking and case head web separation after firing and especially if they have been trimmed more than 3 times. I do not like trying to remove broken shells (head separated) from the chamber of a good accurate rifle.
After fighting the sizing lube ruining the polishing media for a few years and manually cleaning the lube from the cases I finally purchased a Lyman Ultrasonic cleaner and it's great and user friendly for pre-cleaning the cases before sending them to the polisher. I also use the ultrasonic for cleaning small engine carbs with good success using 50/50 white vinegar and water mix for the carb cleaning.
I do not have any of the lee collet dies and I have to carefully set up a neck die to keep from bulging the case shoulder. I also chamfer the necks of the cases so as the bullet starts into the case easier and does not push on the neck or cause the shoulder of the case to bulge. (If the shoulder bulges on cases that head spaces off the shoulder area the reloaded round won't chamber easily)
I precheck neck sized cases in the gun before loading the primer, powder, bullet and if the round chambers tight I set up a FL dies and first try just sizing the shoulder and neck small amount at a time to remove what might be a bulge of the shoulder area and this will sometimes allow chambering of a non-full sized case. (this operation will require using lube if the die is a full length sizing die) I also keep a heads up feel of the press when seating a bullet and if the bullet seats easy as compared to the others it's a indicator of case neck splitting or oversize neck. (it's usually a bad case and needs to be trashed)
I also check the length of the rifle shells with a micrometer of a matched lot (by matched lot I mean a where I started out with new or once fired brass) of brass BEFORE sizing and if I see any rounds that have stretched quite bit more than their mates I trash them because the brass is soft (weak)somewhere as compared to the others and it's most likely going to crack and separate soon. (found this out from experience) If you prechecked the unloaded case for chambering before loading the bullet and then it chambers hard after seating the bullet you most likely buldged the should of the case when seating the bullet.
I also check the lengths of new brass and trim to minimum and find that it's quite common for some rounds of new brass to not be at the minimum length speced in the reloading manuals or may already be at the required maximum trim too length. I also find that it's quite common for new rifle brass to stretch and require trimming on the first firing, after the first firing the brass cases should all stabilize to about same amount of length stretch on next firings if shooting the same reload. If I see a case or two stretching quite bit more than it's mates it gets tossed.
Keeping a heads up when working your reload cases can help eliminate or explain some of the case reload issues.
Have fun with your reloading and stay safe.
Thank You
I would add that SOMEturnbolts that are rear locking lug are also subject to action stretch that can cause neck sizing / chambering problems.
Remington 788 is a good example. Step on the throttle and you better full length size.
FIXED IT [^]
Pardon my ignorance, what is the difference between full length sizing and neck sizing?
Thank You
Neck sizing on bottle neck brass only sizes the top narrow part.
Full length sizes the whole piece, down to the rim.