S&W 500 Dies?

jcook01

Hi all,

I've an older Pacific reloading press, will any or all of the main stream brands of reloading dies fit my press (LEE, Hornady, RCBS etc?)

Any manfacturer to aviod or preferences? I'd prefer a set that will stay calibrated once adjusted, I'm willing to pay a bit more if there's a differences in dies.

New at this game, any help is appreciated.

Regards, John

dcso3009

I'm not sure about you pacific loader, but my preference for pistol dies is for Lee. Their carbide dies are excelent! All my pistol dies have been changed over, but I will be sticking with RCBS for the rifles.

SawBonesBob

My specialty is S&W 500--been loading them for about a year now using Lee equipment. I have a Lee loadmaster progressive press which should have come with counseling or gift certificates for an anger management hotline. I probably spent more money on replacement parts for the automatic priming system than for the initial press set-up. Now I use a Lee classic press for the depriming/sizing/re-priming operation and then I use the Loadmaster for expanding/charging/seating and then crimping. It's just as well since the resizing operation requires enough exertion that it really doesn't need to be added to a progressive press performing three other energy-consuming tasks simultaneously. Interestingly, I lever the classic press with my left arm and the loadmaster with my right and this gives me a balanced pump so that I don't look/feel like a human sized stone crab or something[:D] I'm really happy with the Lee carbide three die set since they have performed flawlessly. These dies have a locking ring thats makes fine tuning convenient nad the dies seem to hold their adjustment very well. I did buy a seperate crimping die from RCBS (you'll want a crimping die for the 500)and now I couldn't be happier. In fairness to Lee, the Loadmaster works very well on 44 mags etc but seems a bit challenged by the 500 mags--the press just wasn't designed to traffic these huge rounds. I don't know anything about Pacific presses but I'd be really surprised if the dies wouldn't fit the press. Finding compatible shell plates might be more of a challenge since the SW 500 was only introduced in 2003. Anyhow, I have developed a few very shootable loads if your interested (I can't believe I just said that[:(!]) but I'm leaving it in because it made laugh so hard I had to pee! Anyhow--what kind of gun do you have? Later--Rob.

jcook01

Thanks for the info all.

Rob,

A compatible shell plate, I hadn't given that much thought, since Hornday bought out Pacific (I think this is correct) maybe Hornady will have what I need.

When you purchased the LEE three die set, didn't it come with a crimping die, confused? If not why wouldn't they sell a four die set with everything you neeed? Is the RCBS crimper better than the LEE?

I purchased a 6.5" Performance Center 500 Magnum, Lou Horton model with the German barrel, hard to find now they didn't make a whole lot of them.

I love shooting it, really accurate, but expensive to buy roundsoff the shelf.

Regards, John

SawBonesBob

John
Yes, since probably 95% of the dies made in the past forty years either screw into a 7/8-14 or a 1 1/4-12 threading, the dies will likely fit. The 500 mag shellplate was actually a specialty item for my system which is still in current production. SW500 is a small niche market right now which also explains why the ammo is so rediculously expensive.
The Lee three die sets are pretty good and thats all they offer in the SW500.
The first die is the sizer/decapper. the case passes all the way into this die and the inside diameter of this die "squeazes" the case down to its original size while ironing out any imperfections in the case and during the last 3-4mm passes a pin through the primer hole displacing the old primer. This is a fairly standard two-function first die. At this point you'd be unable to shove a slug into the cases mouth--too tight.
(A new primer is installed now)
In the second die, the case passes inside freely until the last few millimeters where it encounters a mandrel which stretches the case mouth just enough so that a bullet will snugly slide in. this die and its mandrel are hollow allowing the charge(selected amount of gunpowder) to be dropped into the case.
The third die(in a three die set) has an adjustable bullet seating plug or punch which determines how deeply the bullet is forced into the case. The inside diameter of this die abruptly narrows creating a stricture zone within the die. The die body is adjusted so that this narrowing constricts a crimp onto the lip of the case mouth thus "crimping" the case mouth into the bullet(slug.) Both of these functions--(the final depth delivery and the installation of the crimp) are accomplished as the case is traveling through the die such that the crimping phase is occurring while the slug is still insertively progressing into the case. If your crimping action starts too early the crimping action will prematurely arrest the advancement of the bullet into the case. At the same time, the movement of the bullet interpheres with the "grip" that the crimp can place on the slug. Cumbersome!!
If you do get this third die adjusted just right you can get a fairly snug crimp but it's a lot of effort and your crimps tend to lack consistency due to slight vriations in stroke travel etc.
If you add a fourth die you can pretty much use your third die as a seater-only die. You simply back the third die body out a couple of turns and then readjust the bullet seating plug. (Now the case mouth never encounters the crimping zone) Your bullets can now be consistently and precisely placed at any depth by this third die.
The fourth (crimping) die has an abrupt narrowing or stricture zone. The case mouth with seated bullet doesn't encounter this area until the end of the stroke and since the bullet is stationary within the case mouth a more intense crimp can be applied. In fact you can easily "over crimp" your round if this die is set too deep.
In a nutshell, the multi-purpose seater/crimper die is a lot like the "spork" offered by Kentucky Fried Chicken. This spoon/fork has a crinkle-cut tip which stands in poorly as a fork having no meaningful tines. Then, when you attempt to scoop the last of the mashed potatoes out of the cup, you leave behind these pointy little rows of potatoes as though applying tile mastic because this "crinkle-tip" interferes with the spoon function. so the compromise of a spoon/fork produces one device that at best perfunctorily provides the function of both utensils--and for what? How much would it cost to provide a spoon AND a fork when your charging nine friggin bucks for three stinkin pieces of greasy fried chicken. By the way, just what the HE|| is "honey flavored sauce"[?] their honey is high-fructose corn sweetener with honey perfume in it.[:(!] I guess those guys really need that extra quarter of a penny hunh? Well I'm just playing around with KFC business. I wouldn't insult people with sporks or "honey sauce--its not worth it. Reloading SW500 rounds for 53.6 cents per round IS worth the effort though so don't be afraid to invest a little money getting your reloading hobby going. I've never fired a Lou Horton PC model before--I'm sure its a sweet peice.[:D] TTYL, Rob.

jcook01

Rob,

Bingo, your last post explained a lot, and was thorough enough to understand, thanks I appreciate it.

I'm guessing step one is to contact Hornady and enquire about a 500 mag shell plate for my fathers (inherited) Pacific Multi-Power 'C' reloading press. He told me he has dies for our 270 Winchester as well as 44, 38 and 357mag.

Once that's been established it's die time. You're suggesting the LEE 500 die set (only one to choose from can't mess that up) and a fourth die (RCBS crimping die, do they make more than one to choose from?)

Time to contact Hornady and see what's what.

Thanks, I'll re-post once I hear back from Hornady.

Regards, John

SawBonesBob

Let me know how it turns out--Rob.

jcook01

I stopped by our local gun shop today, they have everything I needed (Hornady 4 die set and the #44 shell plate) to reload 500 mag on my Pacific.

Who's using what kind or reloading bullets? Compared to everthing else I priced 350 Grain 50 cal bullets seem to be pretty pricey, on the order of $30/box of 50, compared the 500 prices against 308 rifle or 357 mag bullets at ~$15/box of 100. Twice the money, half the bullets.

Regards, John

richbug

Check out MIdwayusa.com for bullets they have a huge selection.

jcook01

Richbug,

Thanks.

Anyone have any experience with these:
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=726343
Rainier Bullets 50 Caliber (500 Diameter) 335 Grain Plated Hollow Point

MidwayUSA has them priced box 1000 free shipping for $147.98 but they're currently out of stock.

John

dcso3009

not in the 500. I do use them in my 9mm, 40's and 45's. They are a good range bullet. For hunting you would want something else.

jcook01

Midway USA has the Qty 500 ea 335 grain back in stock.

I ordered a box of 500ea a Hornady 4 die set and several reloading trays (.560" diameter hole.)

Another question for you gents, most of my spent cartridges has an "R" on the bottom of the casing. I'm assuming that means Rifle primer. Can anyone tell me for instance on Starline S&W 500 magnum cases with an "R" if these are these small or large rifle primers?

Also, I've found that I'm really comfortable at the range shooting 325 grain ultramax ~1290fp/s rounds. I can shoot these all day long without any discomfort. Considering my purchase of 335 grain reload bullets can anyone provide me with a specific powder brand and amount of charge "grains" to get me close to the ultramax charge referenced above? I'd prefer a powder that isn't smoky. I shot a couple of boxes of ammo last month that left me choking in my stance, nasty stuff, they were in a red colored box, don't remember the brand name.

Regards and thanks in advance, John

jcook01

From what I've been able to ascertain looking at dozens of sites over the weekend large rifle primers are the way to go as long as the brass is made to handle them. Some have reported problems when using large magnum pistol primers.

Also, I've narrowed my powder choices down to two, tightgroup and H110. Both appear suitable for reloading 500 and 357 mag, however the H110 is a much hotter load. The quesiton I have about H110 is is the powder case location dependent, if the charge is lower and the case not filled can I expect uniform discharge? From what I've read on the tightgroup it doesn't matter where in the case the powder lies, it'll burn uniformly.

I didn't know if lowering the recommended starting charge when using H110 would have any affects on repeatable accuracy due to un-uniform case loading. The starting loads listed on most of the sites for H110 is still pretty damn hot. From a generic load calculation given a specific grain bullet can the recommended starting loads be reduced by 25-30% to drop the fp/s down further? One site lists a 335 grain bullet starting load with H110 to have a velocity of ~1700fp/s. Can the H110 charge be reduced to perform safely at say 1300-1400fp/s using the same grain bullet?

John

jcook01

Can these be safely roll crimped without a crimping cannelure for use in a revolver?

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=420271

Anyone shooting non-cannelure reloading bullets in a revolver?

Thanks, John