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308 Load Testing

ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited January 2005 in Perry Shooter Competition Shooting and Reloading Forum
Guys,

Was able to hit the range today and test out some 308 loads. Here is the group of the day. The rest of the loads sucked at 300yards.

Let me know if this is decent for 300 yards or should I keep on working on the load.

300yard.jpg
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Comments

  • richbugrichbug Member Posts: 3,650
    edited November -1
    What is that? just under 2", what was the load? Its too cold here, need to plan for the future.

    My border collie is smarter than your honor student.
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    That's a 3" pastie target.

    Load is 43.5gn of 4064 with a 168gn Sierra Match King
    Federal 210 Match primer.
    Federal Gold Medal brass
    OAL of 2.8

    Gives me right around 2650FPS

    Funny thing is this load didn't work for bababooey at 100 yards. Gave me around a 1.5 inch group.
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  • plains scoutplains scout Member Posts: 4,563
    edited November -1
    Don't expect the same hole accuracy at 300 yards unless you are writing fiction.

    Hint. Shoot at 25 yards with the .308. When they all go in or nearly in the same hole, then stretch it out. It will save you walking and you will work your load up faster.

    In fact with the 223 if it is on at 25yards it is on at 200 as a general rule.

    BTW, what was the wind and temp like the day you shot those. Obviously that can work a variabl at that range.



    "Be thankful we're not getting all the government we're paying for." -- Will Rogers

    My friend is one... who takes me for what I am.
    Henry David Thoreau
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Temp was right around 60 degrees and wind was coming from the right at 5 to 8 mph
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  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    wind could have caused some of the dispersion,..but temp at 60deg had nothing to do with the spread. With the 168gr class,..try 44.5gr of Varget and see what happens.

    One hole groups at 300yds are possible,..but usually with a "hunter class" or "varmint class" benchrest rifle which is maxed out in performance and with no wind being present. My pard got a 3/8" group at 300yds with a 7mmRUM and the 180gr Bergers. I have had 1/2" groups at 300yds with a 7remmag and 162gr a-max pills.

    Remember,..many times match loads will not shoot well at 100yds,..and often won't stabilize until 200yds or even 300yds. I have seen guns group the SAME at 300 as 100yds.

    Still,..that is some pretty damn nice shooting,..that's a head shot at 300yds!!!!!!

    why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
    Got Balistics?
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am trying to balance my gun out for the tactical long range deal rather than benchrest. I wish I can have the best of both worlds but you know that will never be without spending more than what I can afford.

    I will try that 44.5 of varget.
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  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    a lot of the difference in a good LR tactical rig and a BR rig is only the stock[8] Many of them are built the same except for riding the bags on a mechanical rest making for flat bottom stocks. I bet that group will come down some with the rifle/scope/stock combo you have, I'll bet on a tighter group than that.

    why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
    Got Balistics?
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I hope so. 45gn of Varget seems to be the key for most of the guys I talk to shooting the same gun and same caliber, same everything. I think it may be the neck tension. I switched from a 337 bushing to a 336, maybe too much tension?
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  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    how thick is the brass? at 308 with a .015" case,..that makes for a .338 neck with no nk tension,..so .336 would provide .002" nk tension. The neck thickness will tell you how far to go down on the bushing. You may try seating depth as well. Either back it off a bit or shove it in the rifling by .005-.010" and try both ways with the same load and bushing. A lot of the BR guys go wayyy into the lands with VLD style pills and the a-max tends to run a longer nose profile than similar weighted pills,..so it takes on more of a VLD style. I am betting a little tweaking should give a solid 1.5" group.

    remember the becnhrest rule,..3 shots is the test of the load/rifle,..5 shots is the test of the shooter. Flyers in 5 shot groups can very often be shooter error/fatigue moreso than load/rifle error.

    why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
    Got Balistics?
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  • FrancFFrancF Member Posts: 35,279 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Looks good to me. You are at the same point I am most of the time. Some days I do better, some days worse. Point being to keep in mind The current, gun you are shooting, wind conditions load etc.

    The best shooting competition is within yourself. Take your target and make it a goal to improve on what you know and make it happen. My dream is someday I would like to compeat in a match. But I have a long WAAAAAAY to go. Sure, I can bust a squirrel a 600 yards with my Varmint gun, but to say that I can do that all day long with every single shot would be a lie.

    To be very honest, between you and I, I have seen guys with tons of money invested in a rig that would make most people sick. That can't shoot the group that you did @ 200.
    [;)]




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    NRA Life Endowment Member
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I plan on making some loads up this week to with a 337 bushing instead of the 336 and also seat the bullet out a lil more. I was going with sammi spec of 2.80 with all the loads.

    After thinking about what could of gone wrong I think the triple white mocha venti from star bucks could of had a lil to do with it. HA!
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  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    NO COFFEE, and NO ALCOHOL the night before. I am not without blame on either account,.but when I have a match I drink water and try no to party too hard the night before.

    FrancF,..if you can hit a squirrel at 600yds,..then it is time to go to the match!!! My pard finally told me a few years back " STOP MAKING LOAD/RIFLE/PRACTICE EXCUSES AND SHOW UP" !!!! My first time on paper was at Quantico 1000yd nationals and my goal was to get all 5 on paper. I managed all 5 inside 10" and was enlightened. After 400yds or so,..the wind and mirage play so much more a role,..that you just have to shoot. the matches are fun,.nobody will Boo ya. Most of the guys will help get you on paper during sight in just so you can shoot. hell,..I just try to have good form and let them fly. Wind flags and mirage are a talent only time can teach. GO TO A MATCH AND HAVE FUN.

    CF,..forget that SAAMI stuff and get a sinclair tool for seating depth. that may well be the best $20 you ever spend. Have you messed with trying to seat to the lands yet? if you have a long throated barrel,..you may be experiencing some accuracy degradation due to the jump you have to make to the rifling. If the throat is too long,.you may have to be a ways off to still get good neck tension,..but I doubt it. Seat one to the lands,..then hold a bullet next to the loaded round,. and see if there looks to be enough bearing surface in the neck to maintain a good grip. You should not progress too much more than 30%? up the neck to reach the lands( the ideal situation being the bullet touching the rifling while the base of the bullet is at the neck/shoulder junction of the case). I have a 30-06 ruger that goes well under 1moa at 100yds (plain jane rifle) with 125gr balitic tips and N140,..but goes to he!! at 300yds since there is almost NO bearing surface in the case and the lands are what I am using to provide pressure. If I want to tighten it up past 100yds,..I have no doubt that putting it .030" or more back into the case is the cure. Now,.a 165gr pill will still leave enough in the case while seated to the lands to give consistent groups past 100yds. Then again,..my 1000yd rifle in 300RUM is throated for a 180gr pill even though I knew I wanted to use 200-240gr pills, which places bullets down in the case a bit. That is so I can chase the rifling and slightly increase powder charges while the rifling erodes in this less than friendly caliber. The throat will determine how much you can do,..but for ~$50, a gunsmth can shorten that for you[8D]



    why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
    Got Balistics?
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  • ContacFrontContacFront Member Posts: 1,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    JustC,

    Have not put the rounds close to the lands yet because I need them to feed through my magazine. I will play with the seating dept this time around though to see if I get better results.

    The match I intend to shoot is a tactical match and we only have 35 seconds for 3 shots, that includes range estimation. It would be great to get this thing to shoot and still be able to feed from the mag. Which sinclair tool are you talking about? Got a link?

    Those meanies just got another 260.00 bucks from me this month! ha!
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