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I'm a novice reloader with novice questions, help!
torquimata
Member Posts: 200 ✭✭✭
Hi All,
Just took a bit of a plunge and am starting to reload, for the first time, with my 15 yr old son for his .243. He showed real interest (after getting a bunch of woodchucks and his first deer with it!).
I'm a single dad and on a really tight budget but, after a lot of beginner level research, just bought a Lee Loader Classic, an electronic powder scale to weigh different charges, 100 winchester cases, 100 Federal 210M primers and 100 65 grain Hornady Vmax bullets. I've been reading about overall length for the cartidge at different loads and bullet weights and wonder whether the cartridge should be exactly that size or if it's a kind of minimum size that I should never stray under.
If there's any other suggestions all you experienced reloaders have it is most appreciated. My son is really into getting started and I want the experience to be as positive as possible. I think we can make pretty decent loads for whitetail and woodchucks as long as I can measure the powder (Varget) accurately. Everything else seems like it's pretty straightforward.
Thanks everyone!
Just took a bit of a plunge and am starting to reload, for the first time, with my 15 yr old son for his .243. He showed real interest (after getting a bunch of woodchucks and his first deer with it!).
I'm a single dad and on a really tight budget but, after a lot of beginner level research, just bought a Lee Loader Classic, an electronic powder scale to weigh different charges, 100 winchester cases, 100 Federal 210M primers and 100 65 grain Hornady Vmax bullets. I've been reading about overall length for the cartidge at different loads and bullet weights and wonder whether the cartridge should be exactly that size or if it's a kind of minimum size that I should never stray under.
If there's any other suggestions all you experienced reloaders have it is most appreciated. My son is really into getting started and I want the experience to be as positive as possible. I think we can make pretty decent loads for whitetail and woodchucks as long as I can measure the powder (Varget) accurately. Everything else seems like it's pretty straightforward.
Thanks everyone!
Comments
Bullets tend to vary in their length (and the seat die usualy works off a diameter on the side of the bullet), so you won't get every round to match for length. As long as your +/- .020 from the spec in your book, don't worry about it.
Little tip for setting up your seating die, the thread on most of the seating stems is 1/4-20, which advances .050/turn, so if you want the bullets to be seated another .025 deep, turn the screw in 1/2 turn. 1 turn = .050, 1/2 turn = .025, 1/4 turn = .012 etc. Start with the stem backed out, seat a bullet, measure and subtract, adjust the screw based on the above numbers, and run it through again. This time you'll be right on (or at least durn close)
midwayusa
midsouth
and many others carry the Rem. bullets. When I started loading (40 years ago) I seated the Remington's to the bullets cannelur groove which measured an acceptable OAL.[:D]
If you plan on doing alot of shooting you should find your rifles desired OAL for each bullet you load.[^] There are many books and web sites that discuss the proceedure.[8D]
Don't forget to watch for signs of high pressures! Most of all have fun load'n and shoot'n!![:D]
But not to worry. This is why we work up loads starting with lower charges and working up till we see pressure signs. This helps us to safely account for any variations of any of the components or OAL.
If so,I"ve heard they only neck size,so your new brass may or may not fit in your chamber if just neck sized.
I"d size one or two,then chamber them to see if the gun closes easily.
Hopefully they will chamber.
once you fire them they are 'fire formed' to your chamber and your good to go with neck sizing .Just be sure to check the oal of the fired brass...and even the new brass...and trim to length.Lee makes a very affordable case lenght trimmer gizmo.
There have been several posts on the 'net about PRIMERS DETONATING when being seated on one of these tools,so don't forget to wear saftey glasses when reloading
what kind of rifle is your son's 243 ??[?]
make, model, bolt action, lever action, pump action?[8D]
You remind me of myself and my father. We started into reloading when I was 13 years old. I'm 54 and Dad's 84 and we still reload together at times.[^][^][:D][^]
mort4570 good point! he stated he has a classic, unless it is a classic turret press[:)] or a classic lee loader kit[V] he most likely has a press like this one:http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1207968484.922=/html/catalog/classic.html[^]
Is that right torquimata ?
I find that the bullet makers data is usually the best place to start, followed by the powder makers. They are doing lab tests with the actual components being used.
LEE is the only equipment maker that has their name on a manual, and the only people that use a non-standard powder measuring system. Does LEE have a real lab, or are they adapting other peoples data to their system of measuring powder?
Adisonrain
I find that the bullet makers data is usually the best place to start, followed by the powder makers. They are doing lab tests with the actual components being used.
LEE is the only equipment maker that has their name on a manual, and the only people that use a non-standard powder measuring system. Does LEE have a real lab, or are they adapting other peoples data to their system of measuring powder?
I agree with you on the subject of the bullet makers data is a good place to start. The Lee Manual list different bullet makers and different powder companies all in one book. I don't use their "cup" system of measuring, but they also have the grains listed and that's what I do use with my scales, like everyone else. They are simply taking data from everyone and listing it in their manual. I was only suggesting that torquimata to get the Lee Manual since he was using their loading products. I wasn't suggesting he use the manual for the loading data. the main reason I responded to this was the fact he had Federal primers and they are not supposed to be used in Lee Auto Primers.
Thanks, so much, for all the great input, I'm actually starting to feel like I know what in the heck I'm doing. I got a Frankford Arsenal mini-electronic powder scale and have downloaded every reloading stat page I can. I particularly like the one from Hodgdon as it lists the 65 grain Vmax and a variety of powders. I had settled on Varget as being able to make varmint loads and deer loads from one powder using different bullet weights. However, it's impossible to get at the only outlet we have, Gander Mountain. I then searched again for a suitable powder and Hodgdon's 380 looks like it would do well across all bullet weights. I also searched all the posts on this forum and noticed other reloaders use 380 often, so it looks like a good place to start until I can ever get some Varget.
The only concern I think I still have is that the Lee Classic hand tool my son and I have doesn't seem to crimp the bullet into the case at all. It does seat it nice and tightly. Should I be concerned. I know that if I bought a press it would crimp the bullet but I simply can't afford to do it!Are the bullets going to be seated firmly enough? I bought my son a Savage bolt action 243 so there's only the stress of the bullet in the magazine and being chambered. If there's a cheap hand-crimping tool I could save up for it.
Thanks for all the wonderful info, my son and I thank you so much!
It sounds like you have one of the LEE "provide your own hammer" kits, those neck size only, so after a few times through the cycle you may find the cartridges getting a little hard to chamber (by than you'll have sent roughly 500 rounds down range) and they'll need to be full length resized. Also, brass fired in a different rifle may not chamber in your rifle (pick up any range brass you find anyway). Down the road you can/will pick up a press and a set of "regular" dies, as the budget allows, and will be able to do the FL sizing thing with all the brass you've saved.
Sounds like you and your son are on the way to an exciting part of shooting and hunting, RELOADING.[8D]
Be very careful using the hand tool. When I was a kid I loaded 12 ga. shotgun shells with a LEE hand tool. I had a primer go off which blew the die into an overhead fluorescent light and a piece of the primer went straight through my hand.[V][B)] I never used one for rifle or pistol. I DID use the old Lyman "pliers" type loading tools for 220 Swift and 6.5x55. They worked ok. Nothing beats a press though. Check out the used presses on the auction sites when you are ready.
I read in the instructions I found on LEE's web site that your loader is capable of crimping grooved bullets only. AS Tailgunner stated, you really don't need to crimp the case neck on the bullet. You are not using a tube magazine or a heavy recoil caliber. Your LEE sizer should size the neck down enough that the bullets are very tight when seated.
I see that bullet seating depth IS adjustable by screwing the stop collar in or out and locking into place with the lock nut. SOoooo I can explain a easy way to find your guns desired OAL as you had asked originally in your posts.
1. First, take a case and size it. Don't put a primer in it. Seat one of your 65 gr. V-Max bullets into the case mouth about 1/8". Remember..... NO PRIMER and NO POWDER! We will call this the 65 gr. V-Max dummy case.
2. Now take a permanent ink black or dark blue magic marker and "paint" the V-Max bullet. Slide it into the chamber and close the bolt on it. Open the bolt and eject the 65 gr. V-Max dummy case. (If the bullet sticks in the barrel, knock it out with a cleaning rod. Seat it a little deeper and start over). Notice if there are marks on the bullet where it came in contact with the lands / bore groove of the barrel. If so, Turn your seater stop collar (one turn) to seat the bullet a little deeper. Re-paint the bullet and chamber it again. Close the bolt on it completely. Open the bolt and eject the dummy round.
3. If you still see marks from the bore grooves repeat step 2.
4. Once you reach the point where there is No noticeable marks, give the seater stop collar a half turn more and lock it in place.
Seat the bullet one last time. Paint it and try it again just to be sure. If you still see marks from the bore grooves repeat step 2.
5. Try it in the guns magazine to make sure it is not too long. If it is, you will have to seat the bullet deeper so it will fit the magazine.[:(!]
6. Once you have completed this process measure the OAL with calipers and record the length with your reloading records for the 65gr. V-Max. With the same marker or a paper label maker mark your dummy case "65 gr. V-Max". Keep it with your loading kit.
7. Want a Deer round? Do the exact same process except using your desired bullet. 100 gr. Rem. SP or 95 gr. Nosler BT or ???? Mark it as your "100 gr. Rem SP" or whatever bullet you intend to use. Every time you change bullet weights, types or manufacturer make a dummy round for it. Also record the measured OAL in your reloading records.
8. Each time you switch bullets while reloading you can use your dummy round to set the seater stop collar. Insert the dummy round so it rests in the decapping chamber and turn the stop collar until it makes contact with the dummy round, then lock it in place. Don't use too much pressure! You don't want to seat the dummy rounds bullet deeper. Check the OAL with your calipers and make sure your measurement matches your original OAL in your records. Once it's set you can load that bullet till you are ready to switch to another.
As I said I'm not an expert with a Rifle LEE Hand Loader so if any of the readers have that experience PLEASE correct my instructions.[:I] Until I bought a comparator and OAL gauge I used this method for all of the guns I loaded for. With a press and regular dies it worked great![^]
BTW: I'd use Varget.
federal primers use softer cups,..and if a hamm * reloader tries to force a stuck or cocked primer, there is a small chance of a kaboom. I go by feel,..and can tell if a primer is cocked or something is amiss.