Need Advice with Reloading Choices

milshooter

I have been involved in shooting and less often hunting since my days in the Army provided me with the opportunity to teach pistol marksmanship to MP's in training - the BEST job I ever had. While I shoot less now due to disabilities, I decided recently to become more active in my local club, and to begin (after some practice) to get into competition.

Most of my shooting in the past centered around a vintage Government model 1911 from the early 1950's (.45 ACP) and my favorite "plinker" - a Government Model, 6 7/8" bull barrel Ruger Mark II in .22 caliber. I recently purchased a Colt Series 70 1911 pistol in .38 Super caliber - it is a full race pistol, compensated and slicked-up by the master gunsmith CT (Tim) Brian.

Now, on to the reason for my posting here. A long time ago, I reloaded shotgun shells to support my addiction to skeet shooting and really enjoyed the time spent in "rolling my own". But I haven't done this in 20 years and I have NEVER reloaded anything except 12 gauge shotgun shells. Now, I want to begin reloading my own .45 ACP and .38 Super cartridges in order to customize loads and to save some serious money (.38 Super is incredibly expensive). Although I will primarily reload these 2 pistol cartridges, I may, at sometime in the future, also reload the .40 S&W, .357 Magnum, and possibly the 5.56 mm and 7.62 mm NATO loads.

I now need help in figuring out what equipment I need to get going. I do not want to buy a "starter set" from one of the big names. Rather I want to build a "professional" loading set based on the best equipment available. For example, I don't want a beam scale - I want a digital scale. I don't want to work on each case individually, but rather have the ability to have many functions performed at once. I will purchase a quality brass tumbler and appropriate media to polish the cartridges, and so on.

What I need from you guys is literally a shopping list of what to buy... together with reasons for the choice. Ask yourself the question: If money were not tight, what pieces of equipment, dies, lubrication devices, case trimmers, etc. would I buy for myself? Don't get me wrong, I am not rich. But I also don't want to waste money on something I will be dissatisfied with in 3 months. I've heard good things about Dillon presses, but most vendors don't stock them. Why is that? All I seem to find is the standard Lee, RCBS, and Lyman stuff.

I would really appreciate your help here to identify everything that I need. I already purchased software references from Lee and Lyman, but I have not been able to find a good instructional manual to lead me through the process. (I can't find "The ABC's of Reloading" anywhere!!!) So other recommendations as to reading material will be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

nononsense

milshooter,

Here is a source for "ABCs of Reloading".

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=837228&t=11082005

"Handloading for Competition: Making the Target Bigger" by Glen Zediker

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=875590&t=11082005

Dillon equipment and guarantee are superb. They have a huge selection of gear from the basics to the very most advanced and modest manufacturing needs. They are a direct sale manufacturer but they have opened up a little to allow a few distributors to carry their equipment.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/

Request a catalog and a copy of their Blue Press magazine.

When I was doing a lot of shooting and reloading, I used everything from the Square Deals for short experimental runs to the top of the line Model 1050 for volume reloading. They stand behind their products and there work. Get the video from them and study it if you'd like to see and hear more.

I disagree on the scales since there are only two manufacturers of these things and the rest are private labeled for other companies. None of them are worth the dollars being commanded for them. They are particular about the environment that they will work in consistently. A beam scale, when set up and adjusted, will remain more accurate and consistent over a period of time. Besides this, your use of a scale will be limited once you set up your powder measures and reloading machines. Powder selection will play an important role in achieving the best, consistent loads. Some powders measure and meter better than others.

You could literally have an entire bench of Blue equipment and never have to use any other supplier or manufacturer. They make it all. I sold all of mine with a couple of exceptions when I down-scaled my reloading needs to less volume and a more custom approach for my shooting.

Best.

ADDED:

Brian Enos has save most of us the trouble of reviewing the Dillon line of equipment and accessories, biased a little I'm sure...

http://www.brianenos.com/pages/dillon.html

Graf & Sons carries the Dillon products also. I'm not sure that you'll ever see a better price than the one from Dillon but you can certainly look.

Best.

perry shooter

Hello I have been shooting bulls-eye since 1965 Army 25th Div. team . Camp Perry 1972-2005 I load pistols with a number of Star reloaders . IMHO they are the best of the best Powder measure is the best bar none and with small amounts of powder used for pistol this is very important. They have been out of production for a number of years but parts are available from a number of people I buy them from retiring shooters refurb if needed sell them to new shooters in my state and mentor these shooters in the STAR'S installation and operation. With that said My second choice would be Dillon 1050 or third choice a Dillon 650 both are built a little cheaper then the star powdermeasure is not on par with a star but Customer service from Dillion is the best Hand down. The Dillon will also load Rifle however the powder measure on a progressive and small neck of a 223 dictates Ball powder[:(] Feel free to email me on my profile if you would like pictures of the stars I have and the ones I have for sale.

Edit Dillon sells direct used to sell to dealers but when the route of no middle man [^]

milshooter

I just visited MidwayUSA and ordered not only the ABC's of Reloading (I don't know how I missed it before...) as well as the Lee "Modern Reloading Second Edition" Reloading Manual which was recommended by another customer on Midway. Thanks for the thoughts - I've also ordered the Dillon catalog. No wonder I couldn't find a dealer! I didn't think about Goggling "Dillon" to find their direct sales web site.

After looking briefly at the Dillon product line, I can honestly say that I'm impressed when I compare them to others, especially their "commercial quality" Super 1050 reloader. It is quite a bit more sophisticated than my MEC 650 shotshell reloader!

nononsense

milshooter,

"While visions of Blue Presses danced in their heads;..."


Gotcha! Hook, Line and Sinker...


Enjoy the planning, it's half the fun!

Best.

milshooter

I agree - I'm hooked on the idea and I will pursue it until I've mastered it. I am disabled and can no longer work, so I have lots of time to devote to less stressful hobbies such as reloading. I can almost "feel" the memory of loading shotshells in the workshop - I loved every bit of it. I also love the planning, searching for just the right answer, and putting it all together. I have another month of "house arrest" following a hip replacement, so I have nothing but time to burn in researching, reading and learning. Thanks so much for your clear insight and useful references.


quote:Originally posted by nononsense
milshooter,

"While visions of Blue Presses danced in their heads;..."

Gotcha! Hook, Line and Sinker...

Enjoy the planning, it's half the fun!

Best.

nononsense

milshooter,

This is a list of the powder manufacturers. They have reloading data on their respective websites:

Accurate Arms Powder
Alliant Powder (formerly Hercules)
Hodgdon Powder
IMR Powder
Norma Powder
Ramshot Powder
Vihtavuori Powder
Winchester Powder

This is a free ballistics program that you can download and work with while you're recuperating:

http://www.huntingnut.com/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3

Best.

milshooter

As a follow-up to my inquiry, I have spent some time in putting together my "Wish List" that contains mostly Dillon Precision products. I was slightly shocked to see the grand total of my greed. Here is the list:

XL-650 Reloading Press
XL-650 Caliber Conversion Kit
Strong Mount for Press
Reloading Manual for .38 Super
Carbide Pistol Dies (3 die set) for .45 caliber
Carbide Pistol Dies (3 die set) for .38 Super caliber
Carbide Rifle Dies (3 die set) for .223 caliber
Electronic Scale (will probably order cheaper from somewhere else)
Redding Powder Trickler
Vibratory Case Cleaner (will probably order cheaper from somewhere else)
Walnut Hull Polishing Media
Case Lube
Case Length Gauge
Digital Caliper (will probably order cheaper from somewhere else)
Case Trimmer
Storage Bins
Ammo Boxes
XL-650 Instruction Video
XL-650 Case Feed Assembly
Dillon Powder Check
Dillon Low Powder Sensor
XL-650 Quick Change
Primer Pickup Tubes
XL-650 Protective Cover
Primer Flip Tray
XL-650 Large Priming System

My total is just over $2,000. And I didn't even choose the most expensive press, the "Super 1050", which would add another $1,000 to the price.

Now here's the question:

Did I miss anything important?

I hope not - this is going to be an expensive hobby! In truth, I shoot (when active - I am still recovering from hip replacement surgery) more than 500 round per week, so I should be able to recover the costs sooner or later. But I really don't care too much about such savings - I want to enjoy my hobby and create custom loads that will function well in (especially) my .38 Super Race Gun, which doesn't like factory loads.

dcs shooters

Milshooter, forget the carbide dies for the 223. You will still have to use lube, and they are not worth the price.

milshooter

quote:Originally posted by dcs shooters
Milshooter, forget the carbide dies for the 223. You will still have to use lube, and they are not worth the price.


As I looked at prices for dies by other manufacturers, I realized that the Dillon dies are 4-5 times more expensive. Do I really NEED carbide dies at all? I was blissfully unaware that the typical use of carbide dies eliminated the need for lubrication. Is that true? And can I use (for example) RCBS dies in a Dillon press?

iceracerx

You can't beat Carbide sizing dies for pistol cartridges IMO.

fire for effect

My advise to you is to stay away from the Dillon 650 progressive reloading press. This press has a poorly designed priming system. I know of a number of people who have had detonations of the primers which set off the whole tube. One person I know sent his press back twice for repairs and adjustment, and the third time he sent it back he said to send him a 550 instead, he was sick and tired of the 650 problems.
Dillon is no longer the best progressive reloader on the market. The Hornady lock and Load progressive press has taken over this position. Hornady's guarantee is just as good as Dillon's, and their press is much better. The automatic indexing system on the Hornady is made of steel rather then the plastic of Dillon, and it is adjustable. Second, the priming mechanism is similar to than of the Dillon 550, a much better and simpler design, than the 650.

Dillon still makes a very good press, the Hornady is just better.

Opinions of an NRA Certified Reloading Instructor

non mortuus

Are you planning on using crimped military brass?
If so you'll want something to remove the crimps, either reaming or swagging. Since you like dillion, maybe their Dillon Super Swage 600?

dcloco

"The automatic indexing system on the Hornady is made of steel rather then the plastic of Dillon"

Huh? The index on a Dillon 550B is a spring applying pressure to a ball bearing on the bottom of the shell plate. Maybe the 650?

I have used the Hornady and the Dillon. Seems that you never stop buying accessories for the Hornady...your pocketbook will be drained.

Takes, literally, two minutes to change calibers on the Dillon if you have another powder drop, tool head, & dies in the tool head already.

I load 9mm, 357 mag, 44 mag, 45 acp, 223, 223 AI, 308, & 30/06 on my 550B.

The powder measure works ok with longer grain powders, very good with Benchmark, and about perfect with any ball or flake powders.

For a single stage press, I cannot say enough about the Forster CoAx. The little bit extra you spend on it is easily recouped because you don't have to buy shell holders for every caliber you own. Forster or Hornady die lock rings work on this press as well.

JustC is correct, you still need a balance beam scale. I like the Hornady Model M, because it has the longest beam of any out there.

CapnMidnight

I'm a Dillon 550 man myself, but in all fairness, I haven't been around a Hornady press. I use Lee carbide dies, no problem at all, and they are not expensive. RCBS for single stage work, RCBS auto powder dispencer/scale. Once you get set up, SHOP SHOP SHOP, I look for good deals on powder, primers & bullits all the time, Graff has the best deal on shipping, lots of the time I can drive 50 miles to Sportsmans Wharehouse, if I only need bullits and one or two other items, cheaper than having them shipped. Go to your local feed store and buy your walnut shell media, cheaper than anywhere else. Buy bulk once fired brass. Don't take ANYTHING for granted, check and recheck yourself constantly.
W.D.

HandLoad

Another Forster (Bonanza) devotee here. I have Dillon SDB for pistol reloading, and Bonanza for rifle.

I just recently bought a huge book Ken Waters "Pet Loads" - it sure has a buncha technical info and lil hints and tricks that I was unaware of from other loading manuals and mentors. I have really enjoyed the historical nuggets. Makes for some fun reading, ans since it is a compendium of short magazine articles, it is great to read an article or two, then put it down.

I employ a bunch of buckets, trays and suchlike for sorting, intermediate stage short-term storage storage and so on. Dillon's (and others') "akrobin" system is helpful.

I have another handy thing that I use - a "loader stand" that holds four of the small akrobins, and provides a small flat surface to place something handy near you while loading. It is a wide base, post mounted surface they intended for you to mount your press to. I just use it as noted above, for a portable bin holder and aux handtool stand to position at or near my side. It is just the right height to have at your elbow while seated in front of your loading bench. It is real hard to tip over, and holds heavy weighted bins well.

Thanks for your Service, and your Sacrifice, milshooter.

Mort4570

I have never seen the need to spend money on Dillon's 'strong mounts' IF your bench is very sturdy and built tall enough.I've used my 550b ofr years on a bench made of a solid core door,bolted to the wall.It don't wiggle,and neither do my presses.

I too think that digital scales are over priced,and over rated,fwiw.

jtmarine0831

Still prefer a single stage myself, makes me pay more attention to each round and each step. Going on to 11,000rds and counting for my 45ACP with my RCBS RockChuckerII with out a squib or double charged round, Man thats a lot of time spent at the bench, no wonder my wife is was always mad at me. You cannot beat carbide dies when it comes to pistol cartridges! But as far as carbide rifle dies go, I have found them a waste of money, so far. At well over 30,000rds of .223 through a set of RCBS full-length dies I still have yet to even scratch the sizer. But I can probably attribute that to the delicate care I take of my cases. I still Loooong for a Dillion, but still don't have the $$ to spare for one. I did luck into a cheap Lee turret press though. Not a perfect creation but does speed up the process a little. I set mine up a little different though, I decap my cases in a seperate step, then clean, then prime, then go to the turret press, where it is sized in a carbide sizer(decap rod removed), belled and charged, seated, and then crimped with a Lee factory crimp die. It works great for me, mostly because I eliminated using the press to prime the case. That step has been a fear of mine with most of the progressives on the market.

But Welcome to the Family and enjoy!!