Does powder get old?

MEwert

I've been away from reloading for a while and was running low on .357 ammo. I have an RCBS powder measure that I left set up with it 2/3 full of powder. It has had the lid on it, but has sat there in a dry environment for 4 or 5 years. Should I use it or toss it? It's Unique.
Thanks, Mark

zimmden

Pour it into another clean container. Does it look dry and flow smoothly without sticking together in clumps ?? Does it smell strongly like acid or vinegar?? If not, it is probably all right. Powder can be kept and used for 20 years or more if stored properly. Load up a few 357's and try them. If you have access to a chronograph, measure the loads for consistency.

sandwarrior

MEwert,

We've used powder that in some cases was fifty years old or more. but never when it looks or smells like it's starting to break down. As zimmden said, check to see it's free of clumps doesn't smell and flows smoothly. Typically, if you ever let powder sit out where humidity can get to it it breaks down. Especially ball powder for pistols. You'll see it if you need to take a stick or screw driver to help loosen it out of your powdermeasure. But sure not to hurt any machined surfaces while doing this. They have feelings too.[;)] Seriously, a lot of damage can be done by not being careful. Powder measures don't cost a ton but to replace parts is just expense you don't need.

Pearyw

I would throw it away. Powder will react to the plastic in a powder measure if you leave it in for a long time.

dcs shooters

Remember that high heat breaks down powder also, even if kept dry.

zimmden

If powder reacts to plastic in the measure, why do they sell powder in plastic bottles??? What about plastic wads and cases for shotshells?? Old powder is like old people : If taken care of properly, they both are usable and last a long time.

Pearyw

quote:Originally posted by zimmden
If powder reacts to plastic in the measure, why do they sell powder in plastic bottles??? What about plastic wads and cases for shotshells?? Old powder is like old people : If taken care of properly, they both are usable and last a long time.
I read a gun magazine article several years ago describing the damage that was done to smokeless powder due to the type of plastic that was used in some powder measures. I always make a point of pouring the powder back in the factory container when I am thru with it.

rsnyder55

Usually those bottles in powder measures are clear and therefore expose the powder to light. Light can break powders down.

RCrosby

All plastics not the same. With the type powder comes in I have never seen any sign of the powder interacting with the container. On the other hand, I once left some powder in a B&M measure with a plastic "window". After a few weeks, when I emptied the measure, you could clearly see where the powder granules had begun to fuse with the plastic. Sorry, I don't recall what kind of powder it was.

CHEVELLE427

I HAVE used powder i know was 10 years old and it all did fine.

some was old dupont PB

JustC

I would think the powder measure would allow the transfer of humidity etc. If it were in the can, it would be fine, but I would have doubts about powder simply left in the measure, even with the lid on.

Rocky Raab

The plastic used for powder bottles is pretty special stuff. It not only does not react with powder, is sunlight, air and water impermeable but also is conductive to drain off static charge.

The plastic tube in your powder measure is NONE of those things, and will actually melt if in contact with powder for any length of time.

Toss the powder and replace the tube (even if the tube looks fine).

Wulfmann

Powder will break down from light but powder stored in original containers will last decades.
I bought a 1LB H-4831 container in the mid 90's that stated it was WWII surplus powder and it shot to spec.

The amount of powder you refer to is small enough to throw out as the bullets and primers used in testing might exceed the powder value.

Another test would be to weigh 10g of known good powder and 10gr of old powder and place them outside and set a match to each. Notice the burn difference and the odor. However, that would be more relevant if trying to salvage a pound or so.

IMO

Wulfmann

MEwert

Hey guys, thanks for all the reply's. I think I'll just discard the old powder and start over. I dumped the powder out of the measure and there was a layer stuck to the inside that took some rubbing to get out. I'm thinking maybe it wasn't as dry as I thought. My 30+ year old measure needs a new upper plastic now that I tried to clean the yellowing out of the inside with a bit of laquer thinner. When the plastic started melting on my rag, I called myself some names.[:(!] Guess I'll need to call RCBS since I can't find any seperate parts listings for that upper cylinder.
Thanks, Mark

sandwarrior

quote:Originally posted by MEwert
Hey guys, thanks for all the reply's. I think I'll just discard the old powder and start over. I dumped the powder out of the measure and there was a layer stuck to the inside that took some rubbing to get out. I'm thinking maybe it wasn't as dry as I thought. My 30+ year old measure needs a new upper plastic now that I tried to clean the yellowing out of the inside with a bit of laquer thinner. When the plastic started melting on my rag, I called myself some names.[:(!] Guess I'll need to call RCBS since I can't find any seperate parts listings for that upper cylinder.
Thanks, Mark


When mine cracked I called and they told me there was no replacement cylinder. You have to buy a new measure. I wasn't too happy about that so I used some aramid 2014 and glued it back together. Whatever they use for that isn't very chemical resistant[:(!][}:)]

MEwert

Mine has some cracking or fractures at the bottom of it. It has never been abused, droped, or whacked so that must be from old age. If they don't sell parts, maybe it's time to change brands. Been thinking about the Dillon 550B setup.

Rocky Raab

RCBS will send you one if you call, usually free. You could even make one by rolling plastic sheeting two or three layers thick and taping the outer seam.

Even sheet aluminum or brass would work. Just build a follower with a tall tell-tale so that it rests on the powder. When the tell-tale gets to a certain point, refill the hopper.

Radar

What kind of containers would be best to put powder in if you dont have the cans or plastic containers for powder ? I have a 50 lb can of powder i need to breakup into smaller containers.

Rocky Raab

It really ought to be a container made for smokeless powder, for all the reasons above. If you can't get one for that exact kind of powder, remove the label or spray-paint the can to completely cover the old designation and re-label it with permanent ink.

Never use glass, and avoid any can that held liquid. Don't use plastic that isn't designed to withstand the solvents in gunpowder.

If you have a paint supply store, you could use a VIRGIN quart paint can, but not one that had ever held paint or solvent.

Radar

Thanks Rocky,i never thought of paint cans.Some paint cans are now plastic,i wonder if that would be a problem ?

Rocky Raab

Probably. Unless a plastic is specially developed to withstand both ether and nitroglycerin, it won't.

5mmgunguy

Rocky why not use glass if it is not in the sunlight?

Rocky Raab

Glass is bad because fluorescent (UV) light is very bad, especially on single-base powders. It also breaks! Having $25+ of powder on your floor would make you weep - and you can't vacuum it up. (Vacuums have been known to ignite it!)

cabnetman

If old powder is OK to use, does that mean that old ammo is also OK to use. I have some ammo that dates back to the early 1950's and have been courious whether it is OK to shoot.

Rocky Raab

Inside a cartridge may be the very best place to store powder! It is dry, dark and there is very little air. Unless it is stored in very hot conditions, loaded ammo ought to be good for decades.

Old powder isn't necessarily good. Humidity, heat, light and air eventually cause it to break down. Single-base powders break down even if stored correctly due to their higher content of residual acids. Spherical powders on the other hand, may have no effective limit to shelflife.

The best test is your nose. If it smells like ether, it is fine. If it smells like vinegar, beware. And if it smells like vinegar and contains a very fine red dust - get rid of it IMMEDIATELY. Powder in the red dust stage can self-combust!

I read about this so long ago that I can't swear to the author, but think it was John Wooters. Whoever it was wrote that he went out to his garage to do some reloading, picked up a can of powder and the can was HOT. He immediately ran outside and dumped it all out. That tale stuck with me, for sure. Talk about a close call!

partisan

I still shoot rounds that I loaded in 1976. NEVER have had a powder failure. Moisture is a sure killer for stored ammo.

JustC

the only safe way is to use a canister that powder originally came in. Empty powder containers are easily found at other reloaders houses. Take off the label, put on a peice of duct tape, and use a sharpie to re-label it.