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I wanta be in the cavalry

flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
Anyone reading have some experience, opinions, or info on "mounted" cowboy action ?

Comments

  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Okay then, anyone even curious about loping around horseback, bustin' balloons ??
  • allen griggsallen griggs Member Posts: 35,669 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Yes I'd like to get in the time machine, go back to 1862 and join Jeb Stuart's cavalry, and shoot some Yanks with my .44 Colt.
  • swopjanswopjan Member Posts: 3,292
    edited November -1
    Look up "Mounted Shooting Matches" or "Cowboy Mounted Shooting." I read about it in Guns of the Old West a few weeks ago, it's probably just what you're looking for.
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanks, "swopjan" - I'll take a look there. What I was hoping for was some input from someone who's either done it, or been around it, and what they thought of it. I've found some online info, but nothing much about getting into it . . . just the fact that "it's done".

    Allen, isn't that what this foolishness is all about ? Near as you can come to a time machine ? [}:)] I'd volunteer to ride with Nate Forrest . . . 'course it's not the same if you have to pretend them balloons are damnyankees. [:D]
  • GatofeoGatofeo Member Posts: 230 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Cavalry regulations, including for Union and Confederate forces, limited most cavalrymen to 140 pounds. The horse was expected to carry 60 pounds of equipment, supplies, ammo, etc.
    Horses weren't expected to carry more than 200 pounds.
    I certainly wouldn't qualify to be a cavalryman, and few Americans would today. People were shorter then, and generally worked long hours at intense labor. Overall, they were thinner.
  • allen griggsallen griggs Member Posts: 35,669 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well, that is it for me, I weigh 220.

    Yes that would have been something to have ridden with Nathan Bedford Forrest. What a great combat commander.
  • 44caliberkid44caliberkid Member Posts: 925 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Google "cowboy mounted shooting Idaho" There are events there. Also look up Cowboy Mounted Shooting Association for clubs and events in Idaho.
    We went to the Nationals one year (as spectators) in Scottdale, AZ. It was awesome just to watch. The horses and tack that the pros have is cool just to look at.
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanks for reviving this, fellows. The nat'l org. sites don't tell you much . . . and they're kinda far off for me. CMSA apparently has some activity in the Rupert, Id. area, and that's not too far . . . I'll email the head honcho and see what happens next !
  • swopjanswopjan Member Posts: 3,292
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by us55840
    I have known many that were in the 7th Cav.

    [;)]


    How old ARE you? [:0]
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by us55840
    I have known many that were in the 7th Cav.

    [;)]


    That's kewl . . . but you didn't know their horses ! [;)]

    Gato, where do you find interesting stuff like the weight req. ? I'm thinking a horse soldier was still traveling pretty light - saddle, carbine, sabre, side-arm and ammunition would weigh up pretty quick against that 60#.

    I find the whole subject pretty fascinating. The McClellan saddle was used from just before the Civil War until horse cavalry was decommissioned after WWII. Lots of debate over "the last cavalry charge", but likely the last full cavalry assault (successful) was the Aussies at Beersheba in WWI - well worth the read, if you're interested.

    "Cavalry" still isn't totally dead, if you count the special forces guys on those wily Afghan horses recently . . .
  • DakotaElkSlayerDakotaElkSlayer Member Posts: 47 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by flyingcollie
    quote:Originally posted by us55840
    I have known many that were in the 7th Cav.

    [;)]


    Lots of debate over "the last cavalry charge", but likely the last full cavalry assault (successful) was the Aussies at Beersheba in WWI - well worth the read, if you're interested.


    Actually, the Poles probably had the last cavalry charge. Saw something on the History Channel on it years ago. Very, very impressive horseman AND tactics utilizing horses against tanks. Good thing for the Germans that the Russians decided to invade Poland also, or the Germans would've lost many more troops.
    http://www.militaryhistoryonline.com/wwii/articles/polishcavalry.aspx

    Jim
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanks for the link, Dakota.

    Yep, the uhlan lancers were legendary, and it's kewl to think they gave the Krauts a rough time . . . but they inevitably lost. [:(]
    According to other online sources (ya gotta believe who's lying to ya [;)]) the last US Cavalry charge was in the Philippines in WWII. As noted, a lot of claims to "last cavalry charge", and it depends on what qualifications one might put on the "title". It's all good reading ! [:)]
  • Fokker TriplaneFokker Triplane Member Posts: 15 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Gentlemen: Good morning all. This is great little topic "The Charge". To make a charge in front of fixed machine-gun enplacements; you where either very brave or very dum. But in each case ended up very much dead. Many a good men were lost because of bad leadership and not willing to change tactics!
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The military is always slow to make changes. Rapid fire, air cover and barbed wire spelled the end of usefulness for horse cavalry in WW I. The opening battle scenes in that movie "War Horse" showed both sides of a cavalry charge at that point in time - first off, the terror and rout a saber charge put into those Krauts who were bivouacked, then the carnage of the cavalry unit being mowed down by machine-guns. Kinda takes the romance out of it . . . [:(]
  • Fokker TriplaneFokker Triplane Member Posts: 15 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Yes terror: Youcan see it in their eyes, Never seen the movie but I bet iit was worth the price of admission. In my day I set-up a few near ambushes!
  • BergtrefferBergtreffer Member Posts: 629 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    We all have heard of Sept 11th, when the raghead flew airplanes into the buildings in NYC and the Pentagon. But, September 12th is a day that the raghead would rather we don't know about. For many years the Turkish Arab armies had been attacking Europe, and one of the main defenders of Europe was Poland. On September 12, 1683 the Polish Winged Cavalry attacked and defeated the Arab forces in the Battle of Vienna (Austria). The Polish Winged Cavalry was the very best cavalry and military force on the European continent. They actually wore large white wings strapped to their backs, sort of like avenging angles. Europe owes a huge debt of gratitude to the Polish cavalry. I don't remember September 11th. I prefer to remember September 12th, 1683, the day the Arabs met destruction.
    See: http://www.limitstogrowth.org/articles/2012/10/07/historical-film-tells-polands-role-in-saving-europe-from-islam/
    and: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1483182/posts
  • drafteedraftee Member Posts: 26 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    That Polish Cavalry didn't do so good in September 1939! Nor did the US 26 Cavalry reg. on Bataan in 1942.
  • machine gun moranmachine gun moran Member Posts: 5,198
    edited November -1
    Bending things a little more, there was a dude who claimed to be a survivor of The Little Big Horn. He didn't admit to it for years, and it popped out in some speculation about the battle by some of his friends. I believe he said he was supposed to serve as a liason between Custer's split forces, but that when he set out, he just kept right on going. Historians who investigated all of it later, said that the guy appeared to be an Army deserter who later re-enlisted in the 7th Cavalry under a different name. He couldn't be disproven, as he knew things about the battle which otherwise were not confirmed until after he was dead.
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    ?? Mighty interesting . . . I don't suppose you could point us toward some point of reference that documents this, or discusses it ?
    I'm not challenging your input . . . I just wanna know more.
  • machine gun moranmachine gun moran Member Posts: 5,198
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by flyingcollie
    ?? Mighty interesting . . . I don't suppose you could point us toward some point of reference that documents this, or discusses it ?
    I'm not challenging your input . . . I just wanna know more.


    It was actually in a television documentary, on one of the 'educational' channels. I don't remember which channel, but there is a tendency to re-run these things periodically, so it will probably appear again. I believe the researchers backtracked on Army enlistment documents and compared signatures and handwriting, which led to two individuals being identified as the same person. If true, the guy would have deserted twice, so no wonder he kept his head down.

    Custer also had a number of Crow scouts whom he dismissed as the tactical formations were deployed, as the scouts had done their job and were no longer needed. But about half of the scouts stayed, anyway. The several who split were located later by writers, and they gave testimony that is often overlooked, because some statements were unfavorable to Custer. One scout said that Custer could have enveloped the Sioux who were attacking Reno and avoided encirclement himself at the same time, but for some reason, Custer never moved. I think the Army should have canvassed all of the Sioux who later turned themselves in, for any details about the battle that they knew, but that was an opportunity that was missed.[B)]
  • machine gun moranmachine gun moran Member Posts: 5,198
    edited November -1
    The Battle of the Wash-ita (hyphenated to get around the auto-censor) was another of Custer's debacles. He lost around 20 Troopers, and although about 20 Indians were killed, most were women and children. The Indians gave better than they got. Within a short time, Custer had inflated the number of Indians killed, to over a hundred. I believe it was General Sheridan who told Custer to rein in the BS, but before long, Custer was claiming that he had killed 300. But I gotta love the Indian, Stone Forehead. At a peace parley at the Wash-ita, he walked over and pizzed into Custer's boot. Custer did not respond.
  • Rex MahanRex Mahan Member Posts: 529 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Im a history teacher and we do dicuss Wounded Knee. Not a favorable topic on the US side. Like everything there are always 2 sides, but this one makes the US look pretty bad.
  • CapnMidnightCapnMidnight Member Posts: 8,038 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Read the book by Dee Brown, Bury My Hart at Wounded Knee.
    I was in the Cavalry, 2/1 Armoured Cav in Viet Nam, 1968-69. We even had a horse, but mostly tanks and tracks.
    I have a copy of the U.S. Cavalry requirements for confirmation and color when purchasing horses. The general guide lines for size and confirmation is what we used when selecting dude horses, when I worked for a packer and guide in Cody Wyoming. The Cavalry requirements made for good mountain horses.
    W.D.
  • yonsonyonson Member Posts: 946 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    In regard to the Custer massacre survivor, Google "little big horn survivor - history channel". His name was Frank Finkel, and as machine gun moran said, was one of many who had previously deserted the military, then when times got tough, re-enlisted under a different name. Of course he kept quiet about it to hide his history.
  • flyingcollieflyingcollie Member Posts: 197 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Sure seems from the drift of this thread that no one reading these boards is into cowboy mounted shooting . . . that's too bad, 'cause I finally met up with a group Sunday, and it is two hoots and a holler plain dang FUN !!

    I hauled my green pony over to see about starting her on getting used to gunfire. I tied her in a corner of the arena, and true to her training to date, she pulled once at the first shot, then really quick, figured out she wasn't going to get hurt. Sound was loud in the covered arena, she'd shake her head a little at each shot. The riders often use ear plugs made from "kitty toys", little soft cloth-covered balls sold for cat toys.

    Most of the horses were pretty rock-solid bridle horses, easy handling at a lope. Patterns are pretty intricate, it's no barrel race. In case you don't know, only blanks are used, the targets are balloons, the weapons are .45 SA pistols, the range probably no more than fifteen feet as the riders engage the targets on the course pattern.

    Competetively, it's time vs. accuracy. The main thing is everyone had one helluvalotta fun. It will be a good goal for me to finish my green pony . . . she'll have to rate at a lope, and master flying lead changes before we can run a pattern at that gait, and I'll have to get used to not changing hands on the reins. I'm hooked ! You guys don't know what you're missing.
  • CapnMidnightCapnMidnight Member Posts: 8,038 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    We used to start horses we where going to shoot off from by tying can to them when they where very young. This would get them used to unexpected loud noises. Then we would progress to 22s and work up from there.
    There's an old expression among packers and cowboys,"you can shoot off from any horse, but reloading is a *".[;)]
    W.D.
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