Help Newbie!! CVA Kentucky Pistol

jbw1776

Hi all. My father-in-law just gave me this CVA Kentucky .45cal pistol his father put together from a kit way back when (pics below). Now I know almost nothing about black powder and could sure use a little help and some pointers so I can go out and shoot this pistol. I'm not looking for the best this and that just want to get enough stuff to safely make this thing go BOOM.

1. I need to know what size balls to shoot in this pistol. It's marked .45cal. The lands measure .445" and the grooves measure .465".

2. What size percussion cap do I need? Top of the nipple diam. is .15" if that makes any difference.

3. What do you recommend BP, Pyrodex or something else? What is the standard load (recommended) for this model/pistol?

4. Lastly what is a list of the nessessary tools/accessories I'll need along with the ammo (measurer, etc.)?

Thanks for the help![;)] Tips/tricks appreciated.[8D]





Ben

charliemeyer007

Saw your request for help. Maybe they have a web site. About the only cap you can get these days is the #11. CCI makes them. Would guess ball needs to be .440 patch .020 tight, .445 patch .010 looser or a 45 hollow base minni ball (lyman 445499). Real black powder is the best, good luck finding any. Of the fake black powders I like Americam Pioneer 3f the best (Cabela's has it). It lights better than 777. The lyman cast bullet handbook has this data for a TC 45 Patriot 9" bbl single shot. Round ball .440 3Fg (real black) 20 gr / 650 fps, 25/765, 30/840, 35/900. 2Fg 40 gr / 950, 45/990.
The fake stuff is loaded on volume basis not weight. The little adjustable measures made of brass are calibrated for the volume.
A short starter, nipple pick and wrench, pre lubed patches .010, caps, powder, balls, black powder cleaning solvent and patches, maybe small mallet. Your first pic went away so you may need a ramrod. A patch worm and bullet puller are nice to have (that screw into ramrod).

Fire at least 3 caps on empty gun to clean (oil) out nipple flash hole. Dump in volume of powder, place patch on muzzle, with thumb push ball and patch into bore. Use short starter to push them in farther. Use ramrod to seat ball firmly on the charge. Cap and fire. When done shooting, disasemble, clean and oil as soon as possable if using real black. Products I use OX-YOKE Origional Wonder Patches, Butch's Black Powder Bore Shine, TC Bore Butter

jbw1776

Thanks for the help Charlie.[8D]

This is what I have coming so far:

.445 round ball
.010 prelubed patches
powder measurer
BP bore cleaner
Bore butter patches

I'm going to have to get the powder and caps locally, just too darn high to ship.

I have cleaning brushes and oil. The ramrod has a round recessed end and a smooth rounded other end. Is the recessed end a starter (switching to the other end to pack?) or just the end you are suposed to use to pack?

Darn it, I forgot the nipple pick on my order. Knew I would forget something.[B)]

Thanks again for all the help.[8D]

Ben

charliemeyer007

You can make your own nipple pick from a piece of music wire like a guitar/piano string and a dowel. A spare nipple is handy and never drop the hammer without a cap. I use antisieze compound on nipple threads and the clean screw. Some folks blow into bore before reloading to insure any sparks burn out before dropping in powder charge. It is way safer to load from the measure than a flask/can/horn. For that third cap to insure clean dry flash hole incert a dry patch on ramrod fully home, fire cap, pull patch and make sure its chared. Pulling a ball is a PITA. When you find the load you like, mark the ramrod with tape or permanent marker.

jbw1776

Thanks again Charlie.[8D]

Well I got all the stuff and took it out to shoot it. What fun![:D]

Got some Pyrodex P FFFG. Started with a 30g charge and went up to a 40g. Devestating on a water filled Coke can at 30ft.[:D] To be honest this is the most un-natural feeling pistol I've ever held, so it's going to take some getting use to to produce any type of accuracy with. But from the 5 shots I shot it looks to be fairly accurate for what it is.

One quick question.

What I ended up getting (while waiting on my online order to come in. Yes, I'm impatient.[;)]) is .440 ball, .018 patch, which should put it somewhere in between what you suggested (all they had locally). Is it supose to be so hard to get the ball started in the bore?? I'm using a starter but am darn near putting all my weight on it to get it started. Once it's started it goes in with the ramrod as I would expect it to.

Thanks again Charlie.

Ben

oldgunner

As long as you can load it, it's ok..But you could use either a thinner patch or slightly smaller ball if you'd like to try it. It ain't all that critical, so experiment. Just don't overload..and so far you've done just fine.

allen griggs

I would go to a smaller ball. You might break the stock loading that charge.

jbw1776

Thanks guys!

Well I finally got in touch with CVA.

They recommend the .440 ball with .015 patches. Min. load 20g, max load 40g 3FG Pyrodex P

Once it goes in it pushes with the ramrod with just slight pressure, just like it should. The ball will actually drop in the barrel fine with no patch. I think I'm gonna try some .015 patches and live with them. I have some .010 coming but worry they will be too loose, will give them a try anyways.

I have always heard how much fun BP can be, just wish I had tried it earlier.

Thanks again for all the help Charlie and everyone else. Couldn't have got it going as soon as I did without it.

For s#!ts and giggles...........[:D][:D][8D]



Ben

charliemeyer007

I'd look closely at the crown on the bbl. Perhaps it has some small burrs. Recover a shot patch, it should not be torn. The Lyman cast bullet hand book shows you what one should look like as far as sealing. If balls are cast make sure spru is up, centered when loading. Some short starters have a like 1/4 inch brass convex incert in the ball handle (you can add one to yours via a deprimed 9mm/38 case you have coned with a drill then glued into the wood ball of short starter. Now you understand the small mallet. Fabric Stores have all kinds of pillow ticking (cotton) in lots of thickness. Thickness is determined by a reasonable tug to pull through a micrometer. Compare that to what you have already. Spit makes a great lube addition to bore side of pre lubed patches. Patch/ball combo is a trade off between loadability and sealing/accuracy.

allen griggs

Great photo, jbw!
I am glad you are having so much fun with your blackpowder pistol.
I know the CVA is not the most expensive gun on the market, but, that is one good looking pistol. I like the way your father in law put the little brass tacks on the grips, the Indians loved to put brass tacks on their guns.
I might just have to get one of these pistols.

jbw1776

Thanks, makes a nice little fireball.[:D]

Yeah, I know they aren't the top of the line but it was my FIL's fathers (wifes grandfather), that passed away last year. FIL gave it to me, telling me about when his father put it together, and stories of him and his father shooting it, so it holds more sentimental value than anything.

Actually those are just divets drilled into the grip....more decoration than anything I supose.

Like this BP stuff so much, thinking about a repro. Rem 1885 or Colt 1860. Leaning towards the Rem.

Ben

charliemeyer007

Steel frame Rem was my first pistol. When loaded with 40 gr of 4F it would cock the hammer and rotate the cylinder when fired (not reccomended). Jack rabbits at 10 yards would explode. Use good grease over ball or chainfire will mean something to you. Later I only loaded every other chamber. Was tons of fun to fan with lighter loads and shot better also. If you shoot it a lot the cylinder pin needs good greese too or you will need to pound it out with a brass drift.

HandgunHTR52

quote:Originally posted by jbw1776
Thanks, makes a nice little fireball.[:D]

Yeah, I know they aren't the top of the line but it was my FIL's fathers (wifes grandfather), that passed away last year. FIL gave it to me, telling me about when his father put it together, and stories of him and his father shooting it, so it holds more sentimental value than anything.

Actually those are just divets drilled into the grip....more decoration than anything I supose.

Like this BP stuff so much, thinking about a repro. Rem 1885 or Colt 1860. Leaning towards the Rem.

Ben


I have an 1858 Remingtion reproduction and I love it. It is extremely easy to break down for cleaning (no wedge pin to worry about). Mine is pretty accurate as well.
As far as using grease on each chamber, it gets kinda messy if you shoot it a lot. I have started using over-powder wads (you can get them from Cabelas). The are pre-lubed and will do the same as the grease for preventing chain-fires.

oldemagics

since you are shooting in the dark any way, try a real challenge...club i used to shoot with had regular "candle shoots" but with flintlocks.
imagine holding steady enough through the pan flash in the dark to "blow out" a candle at a given distance with the breeze from the passing slug...without hitting the candle itself

Underdog2264

oldemagics, That sounds like a hoot! I'll have to try it!

rgerge

Tried it, killed the candle, I'm now selling all my guns and moving to san francisco.[V]