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Found an AK I want to buy
Waco Waltz
Member Posts: 10,828 ✭✭
It's made in Russia has the AK 100 series stock set. AK-74 break on it. 7.62x39 799.00 free ship and two free mags.
Then I saw the same rifle with a real Russian Butt stock on it that folds to the side. It's same modle limited edition with the real Russian Butt stock 400.00 dollars more!
Is it worth worrying about the fancy stock? I am a picky guy but 400 extra seems outragious.
Then I saw the same rifle with a real Russian Butt stock on it that folds to the side. It's same modle limited edition with the real Russian Butt stock 400.00 dollars more!
Is it worth worrying about the fancy stock? I am a picky guy but 400 extra seems outragious.
Comments
I just don't know what to do cause 800 is enough already. Little chance of finding the butt stock as spare parts.
quote:Originally posted by buschmaster
I don't know how much extra a side folding buttstock should cost. I do know underfolders generally cost at least 200$ more, some specimens of AK it will run you 400$ more to get an underfolder of that same model. but there is a little more to an underfolder than there is a side folder. I think either way they're ridiculously overpriced.
I would like to know where you saw a Russian made AK100 for sale in the US. Arsenal makes the same thing but that's not the same thing. those cost about that much, maybe that's what you were looking at.
A mosin? Nice collectible. I have plenty of Bolt guns now.
Funny link i found many years ago:
http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinHumor.htm
Is their an SGL number on the AK that you looked at???
$825-$1125. I have a Bulgarian made SLR95 posted in my signature line. These are priced higher then the Russian made rifles but didn't pay any where near the $825 that they want. Bought mine cheap here on GB but that's a whole nother story. If you want the side folding stock the $300 difference is not that out of line as it takes more then a couple of different screws to convert a fixed stock AK to a side folder. If that's what you want that's pretty much the price you'll have to pay. Side folding stocks aren't that common nor are side folding Saiga's, its up to you.
quote:262277023 Top - 262277023
Converted Saiga AK-47 7.62x39 AK47 NEW Side Folder
1 0 $759.95 7h 30m +
It seems to me that the rifle I found is the closest thing to the Russian Army's configuration to be found in the Civilian Market place? If this is correct then I want one of them AK's. If not I need to keeop looking. Can you clerify?
quote:Originally posted by MVP
The Saiga firearms are indeed manufactured at the original AK factory Izhmash.
http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?productid=17700&cat=353&page=1
It's called the Arsenal Saiga SGL21-94 and it retails for $1195.00
The side folding full stock is the ultimate for compactness and shootability.
Only issue is that you can't fold the stock and use a receiver mounted optic like a Russian Kobra dot sight.
However, there are tons of new quality red dot mounts that don't require the use of the side mounted receiver scope rail.
This folding stock uses a special rear trunion that is rivoted into the receiver.
Having shot with other folding stocks - Ace, Underfolders, wire side folders, and even tapco. The russian full stock folder is superior to all of them in that you can get a comfortable cheek weld on the rifle.
That was confusing me. If they are manufazctured at the old Izhmash plant are you saying Armilite that Saiga is a new company just using the tooling from the old owners?
It seems to me that the rifle I found is the closest thing to the Russian Army's configuration to be found in the Civilian Market place? If this is correct then I want one of them AK's. If not I need to keeop looking. Can you clerify?
quote:Originally posted by MVP
Yes I guess that's what I'm saying its probably similar in operation like the old Armalite and the new Armalite except that the new Armalites are made in Illinois. The original Armalites where designed in California but Stoner had no major production facilities. Thats why there were only a few of the original Costa Mesa rifles but the Sterlings made in England and the Howa's made in Japan were manufactured in much larger numbers.
Saiga probably just took over the Russian plant at Izhmash.
The Saiga firearms are indeed manufactured at the original AK factory Izhmash.
Here's the gun you want:
http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?productid=17700&cat=353&page=1
It's called the Arsenal Saiga SGL21-94 and it retails for $1195.00
The side folding full stock is the ultimate for compactness and shootability.
Only issue is that you can't fold the stock and use a receiver mounted optic like a Russian Kobra dot sight.
However, there are tons of new quality red dot mounts that don't require the use of the side mounted receiver scope rail.
This folding stock uses a special rear trunion that is rivoted into the receiver.
Having shot with other folding stocks - Ace, Underfolders, wire side folders, and even tapco. The russian full stock folder is superior to all of them in that you can get a comfortable cheek weld on the rifle.
Drobs in the gun you have pictured above is that not one of Arsenals folding stocks???
It's the same stock as mine ( Bulgarian ) but mine doesn't fold.
So that would make it a non original Russian folder or did Arsenal use the Russian design ??
quote:Originally posted by drobs
Here's the gun you want:
http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?productid=17700&cat=353&page=1
It's called the Arsenal Saiga SGL21-94 and it retails for $1195.00
The side folding full stock is the ultimate for compactness and shootability.
Only issue is that you can't fold the stock and use a receiver mounted optic like a Russian Kobra dot sight.
However, there are tons of new quality red dot mounts that don't require the use of the side mounted receiver scope rail.
This folding stock uses a special rear trunion that is rivoted into the receiver.
Having shot with other folding stocks - Ace, Underfolders, wire side folders, and even tapco. The russian full stock folder is superior to all of them in that you can get a comfortable cheek weld on the rifle.
Drobs in the gun you have pictured above is that not one of Arsenals folding stocks???
It's the same stock as mine ( Bulgarian ) but mine doesn't fold.
So that would make it a non original Russian folder or did Arsenal use the Russian design ??
Not following you, I don't know what you have.
The full polymer side folding stock is Russian.
Proof of this can be seen here:
http://www.izhmash.ru/eng/product/ak103.shtml
The is the best ak folder out there.
(Side note: I believe the stamped Bulgarian rifles also offer this style folding stock.)
These guns come from Russian and are worked over by Arsenal http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/home.php in Nevada.
There is also an Arsenal Bulgaria but that is a different AK from a different country.
2nd best AK folding stock is this style:
It uses the same rear trunion as the polymer folding stock and the stocks are interchangeable.
3rd best = Ace stock - sturdy and comfortable to shoot with.
4th - tie between Underfolding stock & Romanian - East German wire side folders.
Both make the AK more compact, all 3 are uncomfortable to shoot with. Underfolders loosen up quickly and offer a horrible cheek weld.
The East German and Wire folder stocks are more sturdy than an underfolding stock. May edge out the underfolder in shooting comfort not by much though.
The stamped Bulgarian rifle with folding stocks (SLR-107) look almost exactly like the Russian Arsenal Saiga...
Example here:
http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/manufacturers.php?manufacturerid=1
Bulgarian SLR-107 side folder:
http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/product.php?productid=25&cat=&page=1
Want the best buy the Arsenal Saiga or the Arsenal Bulgarian.
$799 for the side folder, I'd snag it.
Some day I'll add one to my collection.
quote:Originally posted by armilite
quote:Originally posted by drobs
Here's the gun you want:
http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?productid=17700&cat=353&page=1
It's called the Arsenal Saiga SGL21-94 and it retails for $1195.00
The side folding full stock is the ultimate for compactness and shootability.
Only issue is that you can't fold the stock and use a receiver mounted optic like a Russian Kobra dot sight.
However, there are tons of new quality red dot mounts that don't require the use of the side mounted receiver scope rail.
This folding stock uses a special rear trunion that is rivoted into the receiver.
Having shot with other folding stocks - Ace, Underfolders, wire side folders, and even tapco. The russian full stock folder is superior to all of them in that you can get a comfortable cheek weld on the rifle.
Drobs in the gun you have pictured above is that not one of Arsenals folding stocks???
It's the same stock as mine ( Bulgarian ) but mine doesn't fold.
So that would make it a non original Russian folder or did Arsenal use the Russian design ??
Not following you, I don't know what you have.
The full polymer side folding stock is Russian.
Proof of this can be seen here:
http://www.izhmash.ru/eng/product/ak103.shtml
The is the best ak folder out there.
(Side note: I believe the stamped Bulgarian rifles also offer this style folding stock.)
These guns come from Russian and are worked over by Arsenal http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/home.php in Nevada.
There is also an Arsenal Bulgaria but that is a different AK from a different country.
2nd best AK folding stock is this style:
It uses the same rear trunion as the polymer folding stock and the stocks are interchangeable.
3rd best = Ace stock - sturdy and comfortable to shoot with.
4th - tie between Underfolding stock & Romanian - East German wire side folders.
Both make the AK more compact, all 3 are uncomfortable to shoot with. Underfolders loosen up quickly and offer a horrible cheek weld.
The East German and Wire folder stocks are more sturdy than an underfolding stock. May edge out the underfolder in shooting comfort not by much though.
Drobs look at the AK in my signature line mine has the crease running horizontally across the stock the same as in your picture but mine doesn't fold. What I'm asking is the stock with the crease in it an original Russian design or is it an Arsenal design???
Not sure who came up with that style polymer stock.
Communists and the rest of the world (for that matter) don't believe in trademarks.
If your Bulgarian SLR has US made stocks on it, K-Var has been making the most accurate US made poly stocks for a long time.
Most of these current guns have K-var US made poly stocks (Russian & Bulgarian) on them.
Ahh ok.
Not sure who came up with that style polymer stock.
Communists and the rest of the world (for that matter) don't believe in trademarks.
If your Bulgarian SLR has US made stocks on it, K-Var has been making the most accurate US made poly stocks for a long time.
Most of these current guns have K-var US made poly stocks (Russian & Bulgarian) on them.
Mine is a milled version and that's what I was wondering if that polymer stock was an original Russian design or a Bulgarian design or was it Arsenals design. Those are the only polymer stock designs that I have seen on an Arsenals
Mine is a milled and imported Made In Bulgaria SLR 95.
quote:Originally posted by drobs
Ahh ok.
Not sure who came up with that style polymer stock.
Communists and the rest of the world (for that matter) don't believe in trademarks.
If your Bulgarian SLR has US made stocks on it, K-Var has been making the most accurate US made poly stocks for a long time.
Most of these current guns have K-var US made poly stocks (Russian & Bulgarian) on them.
Mine is a milled version and that's what I was wondering if that polymer stock was an original Russian design or a Bulgarian design or was it Arsenals design. Those are the only polymer stock designs that I have seen on an Arsenals
Mine is an imported milled Bulgarian SLR 95
I had almost the same gun, sold it. Mine was a Milled SLR 95MB but I dont recall it had the receiver scope rail like yours.
Had same exact stocks (non-thumbhole).
They were importing Bulgarian Poly stocks not too long ago. That were the same as were seeing on both countries rifles.
My dealer I was talking to on Gun Broker told me they are not currently availible. MIght just be with his contacts not sure but they will be going fast I'd think.
If the Saiga Rifles are made on the old tooling with new owners, to me they are being made by the people who made Russian army weapons for the last 100 years. New onwers matter not. Factories change hands, the march of time.
I want one!
quote:Originally posted by armilite
quote:Originally posted by drobs
Ahh ok.
Not sure who came up with that style polymer stock.
Communists and the rest of the world (for that matter) don't believe in trademarks.
If your Bulgarian SLR has US made stocks on it, K-Var has been making the most accurate US made poly stocks for a long time.
Most of these current guns have K-var US made poly stocks (Russian & Bulgarian) on them.
Mine is a milled version and that's what I was wondering if that polymer stock was an original Russian design or a Bulgarian design or was it Arsenals design. Those are the only polymer stock designs that I have seen on an Arsenals
Mine is an imported milled Bulgarian SLR 95
I had almost the same gun, sold it. Mine was a Milled SLR 95MB but I dont recall it had the receiver scope rail like yours.
Had same exact stocks (non-thumbhole).
They were importing Bulgarian Poly stocks not too long ago. That were the same as were seeing on both countries rifles.
That scope rail is a whole nother problem.[:(]
Yes that is the ak I want but already knew that. The butt stock from what I got was a limited offering that the importer scored form Saiga.
My dealer I was talking to on Gun Broker told me they are not currently availible. MIght just be with his contacts not sure but they will be going fast I'd think.
If the Saiga Rifles are made on the old tooling with new owners, to me they are being made by the people who made Russian army weapons for the last 100 years. New onwers matter not. Factories change hands, the march of time.
I want one!
You won't go wrong with the SAIGA.
http://www.arsenal-bg.com/main.htm
Lower forearms are on the Russian and Bulgarian stocks are the same but rear butstocks are different.
Russian:
Bulgarian:
Would've sworn there was a stamped Arsenal Bulgarian but looking at their website, wrong.
Yes that is the ak I want but already knew that. The butt stock from what I got was a limited offering that the importer scored form Saiga.
My dealer I was talking to on Gun Broker told me they are not currently availible. MIght just be with his contacts not sure but they will be going fast I'd think.
If the Saiga Rifles are made on the old tooling with new owners, to me they are being made by the people who made Russian army weapons for the last 100 years. New onwers matter not. Factories change hands, the march of time.
I want one!
Good guns.
Side note, here's a side folder with tan stocks for $850
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=261752055
Stamped Bulgarian...[B)][B)][:0][:0]
The NATO length makes all the difference in the world when you shoot the AK, atleast for me it does.
The stocks you guys are talking about are the NATO length stocks which are 1" longer than other AK stocks to include the pic of the miled bulgarian that drobs posted up a few.
The NATO length makes all the difference in the world when you shoot the AK, atleast for me it does.
+1000
I still want Ivan's AK :)This is really going to drain my wallet. I am already selling an SKS to make up for it and will have to sell something else.
And not to dampen your excitment on the Arsenal AK but Arsenal assembles/completes these in the USA under the 922 compliance laws.
I don't know how much of an Arsenal is original Russia manufactur but I doubt it is very much with the majority of the rifle being made with US parts.
The Butt stock is not US made on the 94, it's Russian army surplus.
quote:Originally posted by MVP
quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
I still want Ivan's AK :)This is really going to drain my wallet. I am already selling an SKS to make up for it and will have to sell something else.
And not to dampen your excitment on the Arsenal AK but Arsenal assembles/completes these in the USA under the 922 compliance laws.
I don't know how much of an Arsenal is original Russia manufactur but I doubt it is very much with the majority of the rifle being made with US parts.
Unfortunately, it folds to the wrong side making access to safety and operating handle a bit awkward.
Otherwise, I'd prefer it to other offerings including that shovel handle.
I never questions anyone's math because mine is so bad.
quote:Originally posted by armilite
Okay now I understand what you want. The one you want is made by Saiga. They are very good guns but they weren't the original Russian manufacturers. There a relative new comer, non the less they are still well made guns. The price difference you speak of is $300 not $400.
$825-$1125. I have a Bulgarian made SLR95 posted in my signature line. These are priced higher then the Russian made rifles but didn't pay any where near the $825 that they want. Bought mine cheap here on GB but that's a whole nother story. If you want the side folding stock the $300 difference is not that out of line as it takes more then a couple of different screws to convert a fixed stock AK to a side folder. If that's what you want that's pretty much the price you'll have to pay. Side folding stocks aren't that common nor are side folding Saiga's, its up to you.
Just looked at this again after taking your word for it. The Difference is 395.00 closer to 400 dollar disfference.
I never questions anyone's math because mine is so bad.
quote:Originally posted by armilite
Okay now I understand what you want. The one you want is made by Saiga. They are very good guns but they weren't the original Russian manufacturers. There a relative new comer, non the less they are still well made guns. The price difference you speak of is $300 not $400.
$825-$1125. I have a Bulgarian made SLR95 posted in my signature line. These are priced higher then the Russian made rifles but didn't pay any where near the $825 that they want. Bought mine cheap here on GB but that's a whole nother story. If you want the side folding stock the $300 difference is not that out of line as it takes more then a couple of different screws to convert a fixed stock AK to a side folder. If that's what you want that's pretty much the price you'll have to pay. Side folding stocks aren't that common nor are side folding Saiga's, its up to you.
Sorry I misread it the first time thought it was $1125 might have been looking at a different model.[:(]
So back to 400 bones for a Army stock. I should just buy the regular stock and be happy with it but I can't stop looking at the folder.
That must be it another modle. Cause it slipped by me over and over as I looked at it.
So back to 400 bones for a Army stock. I should just buy the regular stock and be happy with it but I can't stop looking at the folder.
Well you probably wouldn't lose any money on it if you had to sell it down the line. On top of that you would be the only one on your block to have one.[;)][;)]
quote:Originally posted by armilite
quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
That must be it another modle. Cause it slipped by me over and over as I looked at it.
So back to 400 bones for a Army stock. I should just buy the regular stock and be happy with it but I can't stop looking at the folder.
Well you probably wouldn't lose any money on it if you had to sell it down the line. On top of that you would be the only one on your block to have one.[;)][;)]
The only one on the block? Damn you just sold me.
quote:Originally posted by armilite
quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
That must be it another modle. Cause it slipped by me over and over as I looked at it.
So back to 400 bones for a Army stock. I should just buy the regular stock and be happy with it but I can't stop looking at the folder.
Well you probably wouldn't lose any money on it if you had to sell it down the line. On top of that you would be the only one on your block to have one.[;)][;)]
Well its not like your buying a Camaro.[:D][:D][:D]
quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
The only one on the block? Damn you just sold me.
quote:Originally posted by armilite
quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
That must be it another modle. Cause it slipped by me over and over as I looked at it.
So back to 400 bones for a Army stock. I should just buy the regular stock and be happy with it but I can't stop looking at the folder.
Well you probably wouldn't lose any money on it if you had to sell it down the line. On top of that you would be the only one on your block to have one.[;)][;)]
Well its not like your buying a Camaro.[:D][:D][:D]
[:D][:D]
Waco, what are you seeing for a price on the fixed stock Saiga?