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quote:Originally posted by hughbetcha
I am giving my opinion, not arguing about the textbook definition of maximum effective range.
By any chance do you play the accordion? You expand and contract your intent only as demanded by counter-example. I suggest you read our exchange again; your wording and your insistence that I was wrong is hardly the parlance of opinion. Ever hear the phrase, "Don't piss down my back and tell me it's rainin'"?
Ever hear the phrase, "Don't piss down my back and tell me it's rainin'"?
I think I saw it in the theater..It's that old Gene Kelly number where he's dancing down the sidewalk in the rain.. "They're pissing down my back, but i'm singing in the rain"
All I was trying to do was answer your question about why the M1,M14 M16,,, all have maximum effective range of 500 yards. In my opinion the shooter is really the limiting factor not the cartridge.
I can understand the technical definition and the mechanical definition of maximum effective range and I am even aware of the ballistic difference between the cartrideges in question and the weapons in question. The M1 and M-14 might not be as inherently accurate as the M-16 at 100 yards, but further down range the heavier bullet will remain stable.
quote:Originally posted by FrancF
You guys are still spliting hairs between the .308 and -06[:D]
Don't spit in my hair and tell me it's rainin!
I think that the larger case of the 30-06 will always trump the .308 in the end. Standard loads might be close but reloaders should be able to give the 30-06 an advantage.
quote:Originally posted by hughbetcha
quote:Originally posted by FrancF
You guys are still spliting hairs between the .308 and -06[:D]
Don't spit in my hair and tell me it's rainin!
I think that the larger case of the 30-06 will always trump the .308 in the end. Standard loads might be close but reloaders should be able to give the 30-06 an advantage.
No dought about the -06 having the advantage with 175gr+ bullets out past 500 yards.
But just punching paper at 500 yards? were splitting hairs between
the two.
Either round, utilizing a 180 gr. bullet, started at a muzzle velocity
of 2600 fps, still has 1000 foot pounds of energy at 600 yds..the longest distance given in the Hornady Manual I am looking at.
1000 foot pounds is considered minimum for deer.
Both rounds were used for sniping at far longer distances then 500 yards.
The point being..either round at 500 yards could win the match. The rifles being equal..the shooter, not the round will win the match.
The Speer manual shows the max velocity for the '06 with the 180 gr. bullet as 2756 fps..(Sierra manual 2800 fps)
The 308 as being 2613 fps.( I run mine at 2660 fps)....
100 or so fps makes little difference at 5-600 yards.
Comments
I am giving my opinion, not arguing about the textbook definition of maximum effective range.
By any chance do you play the accordion? You expand and contract your intent only as demanded by counter-example. I suggest you read our exchange again; your wording and your insistence that I was wrong is hardly the parlance of opinion. Ever hear the phrase, "Don't piss down my back and tell me it's rainin'"?
You guys are still spliting hairs between the .308 and -06[:D]
Don't spit in my hair and tell me it's rainin!
I think that the larger case of the 30-06 will always trump the .308 in the end. Standard loads might be close but reloaders should be able to give the 30-06 an advantage.
quote:Originally posted by FrancF
You guys are still spliting hairs between the .308 and -06[:D]
Don't spit in my hair and tell me it's rainin!
I think that the larger case of the 30-06 will always trump the .308 in the end. Standard loads might be close but reloaders should be able to give the 30-06 an advantage.
No dought about the -06 having the advantage with 175gr+ bullets out past 500 yards.
But just punching paper at 500 yards? were splitting hairs between
the two.
of 2600 fps, still has 1000 foot pounds of energy at 600 yds..the longest distance given in the Hornady Manual I am looking at.
1000 foot pounds is considered minimum for deer.
Both rounds were used for sniping at far longer distances then 500 yards.
The point being..either round at 500 yards could win the match. The rifles being equal..the shooter, not the round will win the match.
The Speer manual shows the max velocity for the '06 with the 180 gr. bullet as 2756 fps..(Sierra manual 2800 fps)
The 308 as being 2613 fps.( I run mine at 2660 fps)....
100 or so fps makes little difference at 5-600 yards.