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It's a military thing, you wouldn't understand
instrumentofwar
Member Posts: 1,545 ✭✭✭✭✭
The recent thread and ensuing responses, relating to the "blood rank, wings, etc." has kind of gotten my dander up.
First of all, to all of you who think that this tradition is a just bunch of misguided bravado, or guy's trying to prove that they're "tough enough". You have no idea just how out of touch you really are.
Trying to explain it to someone who wasn't in the service, combat arms specifically(sp?), is akin to sending a haircut in the mail. You just can't do it. It has nothing, whatsoever, to do with toughness. Think of it as a right of passage. An honor if you will. I have tracked down certain individuals, to whom I have looked up to, to "blood me". And I have had joes run up to me after bieng promoted asking me if I would "blood" them. It is not an across the board practice. You do have to be (and forgive how corny this sounds) one of the best at what you do. I would never blood a dirtbag soldier, only one who I believe has true potential. When you have blood drawn, that rank, or those wings, or whatever, those things are a part of your blood, and you acknowledge that. To the rest who shrink back when hearing of a little blood being drawn....you just wouldn't understand.
This all flows in with the military mans mindset. If my friends back home could hear my, or for the most part, you all here. Your mouths would drop to the floor. This is FUNNY * but you just don't talk about those sort of things with civilans. It's a brotherhood sort of thing, you just wouldn't understand.
When you live, eat, sleep, crap, whatever with your buddies a bond is formed. After you have huddled with a buddy, spooning in a shallow fighting position with nothing but your woobies (poncho liners) and body heat to keep warm, taking some of their gear for them if they're sucking on a movement, being there for them when they've been away from their wives and children for months on end....it goes on and on....you just wouldn't understand.
In the years that I have worn this nations fighting gear, I have made friends and have formed bonds with "brothers", stronger friendships than with those back home who I have known for most of my life, they just wouldn't understand. Perhaps stronger is not the perfect word for this, but it deffinetly is a different kind of bond. If I had to walk into some bar to clean it out I can tell you from which group of friends I would pick.
Maybe it's just me. I still get goosebumps when I hear the Star Spangled Banner, I love my country and even though she is scarred and not perfect, I would give my life for her and for my brothers fighting by my side. Maybe you have to be 500'AGL, flying knapp of the earth, with 150#+ worth of gear strapped onto your body, scared to death, fighting the nausea in your stomach and the sweat in your eyes. Knowing that the other 63 paratroopers aboard your bumpy * C-130 Hercules, were all feeling the same mix of adrenaline, nausea, and fear. That rush you get when you get the command to hook up, and everyone suddenly comes alive and the bird erupts with violent yells, the static line anchor reverbeating with 64 jumpers yanking on their static lines, pumping each other up (getting goosebumps)....
Yeah, nevermind,....you wouldn't understand.
SSG Ferguson
13F3P
"Devil in Baggy Pant's"
Some people just shouldn't be allowed to breed
Edited by - instrumentofwar on 05/06/2002 14:11:16
First of all, to all of you who think that this tradition is a just bunch of misguided bravado, or guy's trying to prove that they're "tough enough". You have no idea just how out of touch you really are.
Trying to explain it to someone who wasn't in the service, combat arms specifically(sp?), is akin to sending a haircut in the mail. You just can't do it. It has nothing, whatsoever, to do with toughness. Think of it as a right of passage. An honor if you will. I have tracked down certain individuals, to whom I have looked up to, to "blood me". And I have had joes run up to me after bieng promoted asking me if I would "blood" them. It is not an across the board practice. You do have to be (and forgive how corny this sounds) one of the best at what you do. I would never blood a dirtbag soldier, only one who I believe has true potential. When you have blood drawn, that rank, or those wings, or whatever, those things are a part of your blood, and you acknowledge that. To the rest who shrink back when hearing of a little blood being drawn....you just wouldn't understand.
This all flows in with the military mans mindset. If my friends back home could hear my, or for the most part, you all here. Your mouths would drop to the floor. This is FUNNY * but you just don't talk about those sort of things with civilans. It's a brotherhood sort of thing, you just wouldn't understand.
When you live, eat, sleep, crap, whatever with your buddies a bond is formed. After you have huddled with a buddy, spooning in a shallow fighting position with nothing but your woobies (poncho liners) and body heat to keep warm, taking some of their gear for them if they're sucking on a movement, being there for them when they've been away from their wives and children for months on end....it goes on and on....you just wouldn't understand.
In the years that I have worn this nations fighting gear, I have made friends and have formed bonds with "brothers", stronger friendships than with those back home who I have known for most of my life, they just wouldn't understand. Perhaps stronger is not the perfect word for this, but it deffinetly is a different kind of bond. If I had to walk into some bar to clean it out I can tell you from which group of friends I would pick.
Maybe it's just me. I still get goosebumps when I hear the Star Spangled Banner, I love my country and even though she is scarred and not perfect, I would give my life for her and for my brothers fighting by my side. Maybe you have to be 500'AGL, flying knapp of the earth, with 150#+ worth of gear strapped onto your body, scared to death, fighting the nausea in your stomach and the sweat in your eyes. Knowing that the other 63 paratroopers aboard your bumpy * C-130 Hercules, were all feeling the same mix of adrenaline, nausea, and fear. That rush you get when you get the command to hook up, and everyone suddenly comes alive and the bird erupts with violent yells, the static line anchor reverbeating with 64 jumpers yanking on their static lines, pumping each other up (getting goosebumps)....
Yeah, nevermind,....you wouldn't understand.
SSG Ferguson
13F3P
"Devil in Baggy Pant's"
Some people just shouldn't be allowed to breed
Edited by - instrumentofwar on 05/06/2002 14:11:16
Comments
I responded "hell yes" and the black hat pinned the wings to my chest, and using his thumbs, pressed ever slow slowly. I could feel the wings burn into my chest. As a 3rd generation paratrooper, I could not have felt any more proud. I took those black-anodized wings and polished all the black off them. I still wear those same wings.
I never wanted anything more than my blood wings. As for misguided bravado, isn't that what you want in a combat soldier? We are designed and trained to destroy, kill, maim, brutalize, and cause a lot of hurt on people. If you can't stand a little pain from two tiny pin pricks, you're in the wrong damned business.
Brian Watson
Captain, U.S. Army Field Artillery
Artillery lends dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. --Napoleon
Edited by - Redleg on 05/06/2002 14:28:39
but hey, if you like it, dude, then i am all for you. the problem is that i would guess that anyone who doesn't go along with this bs is ostricized and labeled as being less than full measure. i think i have a baseball bat out in the garage. i think i'll go give myself a whack on the head with it. i am sure that when i wake up i'll feel so much better about myself! those of you who have never felt the need to give yourself a concusion just don't get it.
i never make misteakes.
Hacker, think of it like this, those men will do things alot of people will never think of, they will knowingly put themseves at high risk at the drop of a hat, pain and death is something they are trained to not fear and the only explanation I have for that is maybe it shows that they are ready for the job and can swallow pain and fear, for that I respect them.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
That is far from the truth on what the "blooding" is. It is quite simply poking the pins into the chest and you MIGHT get two drops of blood.
I served fro 70-92 and was "blooded" several times. Hurt? Nope.
Have you ever been there? Done that? If you say no...how can you speak on it??
NO GUTS, NO GLORY
We don't exist to raise your son or daughter. We prefer to take the sons and daughters that have been raised properly and give them the tools to get the job done.
Edited by - idsman75 on 05/06/2002 16:46:17
keep lots of extra uppers for your ar..you can change often enough to keep the thing from over heating...what ever caliber fits the moment..~Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets~
http://travelor223.tripod.com
i never make misteakes.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
That's the most ignorant statement I've ever heard. Thank God for those guys just trying to "prove their manhood" during the second world war, otherwise we all might be speaking German or Japanese today.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
Edited by - Lowrider on 05/06/2002 16:53:58
i never make misteakes.
Tell me people, who else does he sound like?
Unless you see it from our shoes, shut the hell up. Sitting back sneering at others' traditions is bigotry, plain and simple. You have no room to cast aspersions at a tradition you admit you do not understand.
I earned my wings and they were tempered with my blood. I have no scars from the incident, but I do have a fierce and undying pride to be an airborne artilleryman. The memory of that incredibly hot day and the accomplishment of becoming a paratrooper is something I will cherish for the rest of my life.
So, until you take the oath and earn rank, wings, whatever, please do us the service of not furnishing your uneducated opinion on the matter. We don't care.
Brian
Artillery lends dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. --Napoleon
PC=BS
As I rapidly reach old age.I find my greatest memores are of those I served with.I was in the draft Army,But we still had 110%s.
We were living in a world of Shi8 in the 60's, But we looked out for each other.Look after your brothers,And tell the rest of the world to PUCKER UP.
A unarmed man is a subject.A armed man is a citizen.
SSG idsman75, U.S. ARMY
PC=BS
Part of what these guys don't understand is the fact that these traditions, are due in no small part, to what you and others like you, who chose not to hide, have done. Even though your name was called, and perhaps you didn't quite believe in what you were fighting for, thanks to you and countless others like you willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for his brother and his country. And for this, I thank you, and to all who cannot comprehend these sacrifices that were made, maybe you don't deserve to know.
Hacker- Apparently you don't read too well, boy. Like I said, sending a haircut through the mail....
Some people just shouldn't be allowed to breed
Edited by - instrumentofwar on 05/06/2002 19:10:18
No some folks will never understand. Nor will they likely appreciate the fact that you are in the finest military in the world training hard and ready to fight to defend their right to think what they will, however misguided it may be. I do understand, and I thank you for your dedication and service to this country. Lead on.
Justice through Valor 1*
keep lots of extra uppers for your ar..you can change often enough to keep the thing from over heating...what ever caliber fits the moment..~Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets~
http://travelor223.tripod.com
I couldn't have put it better myself. I am afraid that your words fall on deaf ears for the civilian. Don't be disturbed by their ignorance or their reactions. Those of us who understand will keep our traditions for those who someday will.
Save, research, then buy the best.Join the NRA, NOW!Teach them young, teach them safe, teach them forever, but most of all, teach them to VOTE!
Edited by - dheffley on 05/06/2002 20:31:50
Now, if you have a problem with the pinnings, I can understand that..... because you are probably the same type of people that just cant seem to figure out how to scroll past threads that dont interest you! You know, life is so difficult, being stupid just makes it that much more difficult for some. How many of you that disapprove of the pinning actually think that for a second you would let it be done to you if you REALLY did not want it done? If you cant stand up for yourself, then you are a weak, lame, shameful excuse for a man, and shouldnt be there in the first place. Notice, I did not say that you shouldnt be there if you dont allow it, I said if you dont want it, and allow it. I for one agree with the idea that some traditions are stupid, if you think I'm wrong, look around, and you will see some dumb ones. I do not like the fact that the media and public at large have stuck their noses in where it should, I say again, should not be. Meaning, we are public servants, as such, we should expect it. Just for the record, I do not, or did not, since its not allowed anymore, allow anyone to pin on my chevrons for promotion, unless I respected them. Now we have lost a tool of comraderie since we can not show people we respect that we do respect them and allow them to do this. It was not always this way. It use to be that you WERE going to get pinned, by everyone. I was the only one promoted with my peers that actually told some to step off, or get back twice what they dished out. I allowed, I said allowed, people I respected to pin me. We had one Marine that was so upset at not being able to get tagged on the shoulder, because of the new rules, that I actually got a bunch of his buddies, yes friends, together and brought them to his room, so that he could be properly promoted, you have 24 hours to complete the process. We did not hurt this man, I would not have allowed it, it was nothing like the crap you saw in the video. I am not in anyway comparing promotion pinning to wing pinning either, I know there is a big difference. I fear I will ramble so I will end it with this. If the mommas of America would keep their noses where they belong, our military would not be so weak. If the politicians would keep their lazy, lying, overpaid butts and noses out of our business, we could be proud of what we could accomplish again, that being building military men and women with pride, dignity, self discipline, and above all, HONOR. Where has all the honor gone? The honor has gone the way of some of our traditions, its slipped away into the past, its still there, here and there, and its still talked about, but when you screw with tradition you sometimes screw with the machine. Screw with the machine and end up with scrap.
SSgt Ryan E. Roberts, USMC
Yes, you are the exception to the rule. If you were trying to be a ballplayer, you have an understanding of team and teamwork. You win together, you loose together. The base ideology is the same. If you can take it one step up the ladder and see that you live together, you die together. It's also why most military people believe in God. "There is no greater sacrafice than when a man lays down his life for you". It's a brotherhood that never ends.
Save, research, then buy the best.Join the NRA, NOW!Teach them young, teach them safe, teach them forever, but most of all, teach them to VOTE!
i never make misteakes.
Hacker you made your point...you don't understand the mindset of the warrior. Fine now it's time for you to let go. If you think pin pricks of pain and the gallons of the yucky blood expended is some stupid tribal ritual then please go thinking the way you do. There are many things that the "protected" don't understand. We don't expect you to understand....now just go cuddle your fuzzy Teddy bear and sleep tight tonight because there are warriors out there protecting you. "lock and load,baby?" Yeah right ROFLMAO!! Beach
Save, research, then buy the best.Join the NRA, NOW!Teach them young, teach them safe, teach them forever, but most of all, teach them to VOTE!
i never make misteakes.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
Somebody help me with this quote from "A Few Good Men";
" You live under the very blanket of freedom I provide, then question the manner in which I provide it". Jack Nicholson
Is that right and how does the rest of it go?
This guy Hacker may be the fella that was on the cops show the other night, you know the guy from Maine that got a speeding ticket and justy flat out kicked and screamed to the cop yelling insults.
You want me on that wall. You need me on that wall. You sleep comfortably under the blanket of protection I provide then question the manner in which I provide it. I'd just as soon you said "Thank you" and went on your way. We use words like duty, honor, and code. We use these words to define a life spent defending freedom. You use them as a punch line.......The rest escapes me at the moment...
Justice Through Valor 1*
Edited by - Teamblue on 05/07/2002 00:11:26
I understand. I didn't serve and you did. For that I thank you and I appreciate all that you have done. It is an Honor to speak with you here. I understand and respect any ritual that you have experienced.
You have my upmost respect. To those that don't understand: you should show some respect and try to understand. If you can't do that I think you should shove it.
Bill
After his firebase was attacked during Tet 68, he and a bunch of his buddies got wasted. They then took rolled up newspapers, lit them on fire, and held them between their * cheeks. The one who held it the longest, won.
There's one tradition I don't mind seeing go.
You know, Hacker, I don't understand why Jewish folks break glass when they get married. I don't understand the Cossacks' dance. I don't understand a lot about other cultures, and yes the military is a culture. But, that does not give me the right to riducule, belittle, or besmirch those traditions. Sure, the First Amendment says I have that right, but my honor as a man prevents me from exercising it.
What may seem dumb to your is our lifeblood. Those two little pinpricks are the only wounds I hope to ever receive while in the service of this country. That ritual is the seal that makes some of us Soldiers, Marines, Sailors, and Airmen (and Merchant Marines, I suppose).
So...get back under your porch, boy.
Brian
Artillery lends dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. --Napoleon