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U.S.A. soon to be No. 2..............
jltrent
Member Posts: 9,209 ✭✭✭✭
China is set to overtake the U.S. as the world's number one economy.
This should have never happened.
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/economy/china-no-1-it-will-happen-soon-study-says-n93266
This should have never happened.
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/economy/china-no-1-it-will-happen-soon-study-says-n93266
Comments
Unless, like me, you put a lot of effort into support American companies making MADE IN USA products.
All claims otherwise are just so much babypoop.
I like it. His wife isn't even made in America.
NBC can't wait for it either. They are the cheerleaders against American greatness
It is as if they revel in it.
Thanks to the great economic programs of obama
[}:)][}:)][xx(]
if you're so shortsighted to think that in the 5 years of obama he has managed to boost chinas economy that much, i cant even begin to describe to you how poorly informed and ignorant you are.
this is decades in the making. decades. the government of this country has been leading us down this path since obama was messing his diapers. he isnt helping at all, but blaming it on him is illogical, factually inaccurate, ignorant, and childish.
im not an obama supporter, but good god man if you're going to bash the man, you'd be doing yourself a service to bash him for things that he actually has had an effect on...
Ir's all YOUR FAULT!
Unless, like me, you put a lot of effort into support American companies making MADE IN USA products.
All claims otherwise are just so much babypoop.
Where was your computer made? What about the components that make it work? Got a cell phone? Chances are likely it probably wasn't made in the USA, and even if final assembly DID happen here, it was assembled with foreign-made components.
How about a TV? DVD/Blueray player? Does your car have a computer to control the fuel/air mixture?
Any electronic gizmo you can buy these days is produced with foreign-made components. You cannot escape it.
quote:Originally posted by ChrisInTempe
Ir's all YOUR FAULT!
Unless, like me, you put a lot of effort into support American companies making MADE IN USA products.
All claims otherwise are just so much babypoop.
Where was your computer made? What about the components that make it work? Got a cell phone? Chances are likely it probably wasn't made in the USA, and even if final assembly DID happen here, it was assembled with foreign-made components.
How about a TV? DVD/Blueray player? Does your car have a computer to control the fuel/air mixture?
Any electronic gizmo you can buy these days is produced with foreign-made components. You cannot escape it.
So because Americans cannot be successful on all products we should give up? Throw in the towel? UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER as an act of convenient laziness?
"Never do wrong to make a friend----or to keep one".....Robert E. Lee
My wife and I go out of our way to find American made products and it's sad to say it's becoming increasingly harder and harder to do.
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
quote:Originally posted by ChrisInTempe
Ir's all YOUR FAULT!
Unless, like me, you put a lot of effort into support American companies making MADE IN USA products.
All claims otherwise are just so much babypoop.
Where was your computer made? What about the components that make it work? Got a cell phone? Chances are likely it probably wasn't made in the USA, and even if final assembly DID happen here, it was assembled with foreign-made components.
How about a TV? DVD/Blueray player? Does your car have a computer to control the fuel/air mixture?
Any electronic gizmo you can buy these days is produced with foreign-made components. You cannot escape it.
So because Americans cannot be successful on all products we should give up? Throw in the towel? UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER as an act of convenient laziness?
No you should not throw in the towel, but man up and refuse to use a non American made items. Yep, no "foreign made anything" until then, what makes you any different from the rest of us?
We have 313 million they have 1.35 billion!
Before the US became the economic superpower we used to be, Britain was #1. Anyone who truly believed that the US would stay on top forever was being silly and ignorant.
why shouldn't China be the number one economy they out number us greatly.
We have 313 million they have 1.35 billion!
that and factor that nobody is #1 forever. Factoring in like you said people and of course. If China can operate even at 50% efficeincy in comparison to us, they should over take us.
Obama's policies may have accelerated the issue but we were bound to face it sooner or later.
Thats true. But youll find in here, a lot of the good ole boys have this dying belief that all the countries and worlds problems just started within the last 4-5 years
There is nothing wrong with buying imported products, everyone does it. Everyone should buy something from far away now and then. The wrong is in not maintaining a balance where most of your spending on manufactured goods benefits your own people instead of foreigners. Or worse, enemy governments.
Why manufactured goods specifically is because the most good paying jobs for the most people are to be found in that sector.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.
The U.S. has around 0.32 billion.
As living standards rise, it is inevitable that China (and probably India, though that country remains a mess) pass the U.S.
It is, in a lot of ways a good thing. As their standard of living increases, we are seeing a trickle of manufacturing return to our shores. As it continues to increase, we will see more.
Brad Steele
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
Obviously the $ 100.00 per barrel price of today is why the more expensive extraction techniques being used in the oil sands in
Canada and the shale extraction in the Bakken formation in ND have become profitable. No doubt the 2014 average cost of extraction is quite a bit higher than in 2009.
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=367&t=6
There is no way, even at an average extraction cost of $ 33.76 per barrel that $ 1.50 per gallon gasoline is possible. After extraction, there is transportation to the refinery, refining, transportation to distribution centers and of course distribution to retail outlets. $ 3.55 is what I am paying, and obviously there is profit in that all along the way. Probably too high, but the cost is also driven by demand.
Brad Steele
You know what, I don't care all that much if we are "Number 1" on some particular economic yardstick. What I care about is day to day do we look out for our own enlightened self interest? Or do we, on a routine and casual basis, do all we can to benefit other people far away? All while we are hurting ourselves doing so?
There is nothing wrong with buying imported products, everyone does it. Everyone should buy something from far away now and then. The wrong is in not maintaining a balance where most of your spending on manufactured goods benefits your own people instead of foreigners. Or worse, enemy governments.
Why manufactured goods specifically is because the most good paying jobs for the most people are to be found in that sector.
This post I will agree with 100%.
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.
Tarriffs and fair trade, yes that has probably been the leading contributor to the fall of our products. Unions yes to an extent, and they are an issue still to this day, specially since a lot of the unions fight for is federally or state mandated anyways. Unions do drive up cost. But I still contend that unions are double edged swords. One hand they promote the wrong thing, drive up cost, artificially inflate wages. On the other hand I have no faith in private business doing the right thing, just look at major scandals in the corporate world in recent history. Without the union what does the little guy have to protect himself. I know some will argue the market will dicate wages and force industry to do the right thing, again perfect world and perfect capitolism yes, real world probably not as greed comes in and ruins any ecomoc system whether its capitolism or communism
EPA is also another double edged sword. Does the EPA stick its nose in things it shouldnt , create uneeded red tape for no reason, which drive up cost sure. Again without the EPA do I trust that private industry to not pollute lakes, ground water, the air, etc. Because they have never done that in the past. Now when it means jobs and livelyhood is important to save the spiny backed fly, maybe not. But question is who and when do we say its worth eradicating species and ruining the environment for industry? Remember basic food chain we learned in grade school, take something out of it, it could come back to bite us.
I have no problem with not being number 1 economicaly as long as the nation is doing good for its self in relativatity. I would think to remain relevent we should probably still maintain a top 3 to 5 rating.
Two biggest things we could do to help is to reform corporate taxes and reform tarrifs, and free trade agreements. Throw out all the politics aside, you tackle those two things, we would be on our way. problem is both sides of the house have to much to lose by changing these things otherwise they would have been changed already.
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quote:Originally posted by austin20
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
The true cost is hard to find. out of 100 gallons of crude how much of it can actually be made into something, such as plastics, paints, chemicals etc. I have read multiple times minus tax teh true cost of gasoline should be around $2 per gallon. Factor in taxes even in the most exspensive states means we should be paying on average closer to $3 a gallon at the pump vs $4 now. So factor in 30% in extra cost and the fact oil companies continually make record profits, do the math all you want something isnt right.
quote:Originally posted by austin20
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
The true cost is hard to find. out of 100 gallons of crude how much of it can actually be made into something, such as plastics, paints, chemicals etc. I have read multiple times minus tax teh true cost of gasoline should be around $2 per gallon. Factor in taxes even in the most exspensive states means we should be paying on average closer to $3 a gallon at the pump vs $4 now. So factor in 30% in extra cost and the fact oil companies continually make record profits, do the math all you want something isnt right.
I wonder how much of the price is caused by speculation. It's been long rumored that the money the major banks have been receiving from the Federal Reserve has been used to keep commodity prices up. Sure hasn't been used for the stated purpose of business loans to boost the economy.
quote:Originally posted by nards444
quote:Originally posted by austin20
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
The true cost is hard to find. out of 100 gallons of crude how much of it can actually be made into something, such as plastics, paints, chemicals etc. I have read multiple times minus tax teh true cost of gasoline should be around $2 per gallon. Factor in taxes even in the most exspensive states means we should be paying on average closer to $3 a gallon at the pump vs $4 now. So factor in 30% in extra cost and the fact oil companies continually make record profits, do the math all you want something isnt right.
I wonder how much of the price is caused by speculation. It's been long rumored that the money the major banks have been receiving from the Federal Reserve has been used to keep commodity prices up. Sure hasn't been used for the stated purpose of business loans to boost the economy.
I would say a great majority of it. As oil is traded in futures. Oil is bought in 3-6 month contracts, the oil we are using today was bought a few months ago. So they speculate on what it might be worth today. Get rid of speculation and average the price out, gas would still be high but not as high as it is today. My personal belief is gas is price artifically by at least 50 cents on the gallon. Problem is the rich and the government make to much money on it, so nothing with change.
[:D]
The FEDERAL GOVERNMENT is making 18.5 cents per gallon and STATE GOVERNMENT making around 20 cents per gallon (each state is different) for each gallon sold in taxes. Can someone explain why oil companies making around 6 cents per gallon profit is such a big deal?
I amazes me there are people who blame the oil companies for the price of gas. Their profit margin has been the same for many years.
The FEDERAL GOVERNMENT is making 18.5 cents per gallon and STATE GOVERNMENT making around 20 cents per gallon (each state is different) for each gallon sold in taxes. Can someone explain why oil companies making around 6 cents per gallon profit is such a big deal?
The problem is you and everybody else is looking just at the gasoline, what about rest of the crude they have, it surely doesnt go to waste. And the 6-8 cents figure is true but thats just for gasoline and grossly underestimates what they make for a whole barrel of crude. Even so 350 million gallons of gas are used every day in the US. Thats still raking in 20 million dollars a day in profit, thats profit not gross.
A barrel of crude is 42 gallons and makes roughly 44-45 gallons of product. Of which experts say regardless of what they make, they make about 8 cents in profit per gallon of whatever they make.
The US used 18 million barrels a day. or roughly 790 million gallons of product, with a 8 cent profit per gallon they make in total around 60 million a day in profit.
Dont forget products other than gas are diesel, jet fuel, propane, shingles, shoes, paint, sunglasses, medicins, shampoo, hand sanatizer and the list goes on.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_products_do_you_get_out_of_a_barrel_of_crude_oil
Also figure the between state and federal tax on a gallon of gas in NYS is about 70 cents per gallon, which means throw out taxes. Gas is costing in the state of NY 3 bucks a gallon.
Im not a sheep to beleive its just big bad oil companies, its also the government, and its also big business. But Im also not a sheep to just accept that its capitolism and its poor old oil companies not making money like the far right would like you to believe.
http://www.factcheck.org/2011/05/playing-politics-with-gasoline-prices/
l give Sam Walton and his * luven kids of the credit [:(!]
Don't blame it on Sam Walton. When he was in charge, Wal Mart proudly displayed as many Made in USA products as possible, and it was a decent place to shop with very helpful and friendly people working there, and the company cared about the employees. (Dad worked there when Sam Walton was still in charge.)
It all changed to what it is now when he died and his kids took over. They became money hungry, and didn't care how they got it.