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quote:Originally posted by nards444
quote:Originally posted by wifetrained
quote:Originally posted by nards444
quote:Originally posted by austin20
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
The true cost is hard to find. out of 100 gallons of crude how much of it can actually be made into something, such as plastics, paints, chemicals etc. I have read multiple times minus tax teh true cost of gasoline should be around $2 per gallon. Factor in taxes even in the most exspensive states means we should be paying on average closer to $3 a gallon at the pump vs $4 now. So factor in 30% in extra cost and the fact oil companies continually make record profits, do the math all you want something isnt right.
I wonder how much of the price is caused by speculation. It's been long rumored that the money the major banks have been receiving from the Federal Reserve has been used to keep commodity prices up. Sure hasn't been used for the stated purpose of business loans to boost the economy.
I would say a great majority of it. As oil is traded in futures. Oil is bought in 3-6 month contracts, the oil we are using today was bought a few months ago. So they speculate on what it might be worth today. Get rid of speculation and average the price out, gas would still be high but not as high as it is today. My personal belief is gas is price artifically by at least 50 cents on the gallon. Problem is the rich and the government make to much money on it, so nothing with change.
What would the cost be if future's traders had to pony up more than 10% on a futures contract. What if they had to cough up 50%?
Vik...The RISE of WalMart EXACTLY followed the FALL of American manufacturing.. 0le Sam was a hypocrite ...Preaching ''Buy American''while selling Chinese goods by the boat load...ALL the American textile jobs were lost because of him and his KIND. Most other Consumer lndustrial manufacturing jobs too....Plus Plus they are responsible for most of the small town businesses drying up and going away.. THeir main NUMBER ONE business is/has always been.. Go in to a town.. Build a Walmart...Sell at a loss til the little guy goes under.. THEN jack prices way HIGHER and screw the lttle guy again..THats the ''WALMART WAY'' [:(!]
Actually years away, but if we keep on this path of nogrowth economy under this incompetent POTUS and his LIB followers, in several years China MIGHT overtake us. But China is faced with terrible problems....like their own housing bubble which has the potential to dwarf ours, an aging population with no SS net to catch them, a slowing economy, terrible air and water pollution issues....just to name four. And their economy is slowing but no where near our lousy growth rate under this POTUS we are stuck with for almost three long years. The point is we need to get a new Senate in 2014 and then a new more conservative POTUS in 2016 who will come in, lower taxes, cut gov't spending, and stop excessive regulations to jumpstart our economy. That happens and China's GDP is (again) in our rear view mirror.
quote:Originally posted by gary wray
Actually years away, but if we keep on this path of nogrowth economy under this incompetent POTUS and his LIB followers, in several years China MIGHT overtake us. But China is faced with terrible problems....like their own housing bubble which has the potential to dwarf ours, an aging population with no SS net to catch them, a slowing economy, terrible air and water pollution issues....just to name four. And their economy is slowing but no where near our lousy growth rate under this POTUS we are stuck with for almost three long years. The point is we need to get a new Senate in 2014 and then a new more conservative POTUS in 2016 who will come in, lower taxes, cut gov't spending, and stop excessive regulations to jumpstart our economy. That happens and China's GDP is (again) in our rear view mirror.
I still dont think gauging China as measuring stick whether they are in front of us or behind us really matters to exten. But as you said I wouldnt worry about China as much as some think. China has some storm clouds brewing. China everyday is slipping from communism to socialism which they are probably there already and are getting even closer to having some capitalistic tendencys. Which the major problem with that is they are going to have labor unrest at some point, of which signs of it are already starting. Once the population starts receving fair wages and such they will take a step back from being the factory of the world.
Also China is going to have a population problem of not having enough people, yes I said that right. The issue is the years of the one child rule has actually shot them in the foot, now they do not have enough people to support the infastructure.
Good! Let the Chinese send their aircraft, tanks, and young men to the Middle East to fight for Israel. Let them fund and supply their chosen side in Europe's wars for awhile. We can use a respite.
Exactly I remember when the Electrolux plant moved to Mexico one of the employees was quoted as saying "I hope those Mexicans buy teh vacuum cause Americans can't anymore!
But as I noted 1.35 billion people over there are starting to buy things instead of just living subsistence when their econmy really picks up along with the other bloated population thrid world coountries we should be able to make a fortune selling them things we are good at and they no longer want to do.
I've heard a few outsourced products are already coming back due to higher overseas manufactering costs and shipping added in with fuel costs makes it no longer as viable to outsource.
quote:Originally posted by Smitty500mag
Just wait until all these companies that went to China and other parts of the world in order to get cheap labor finally figure out in a few more years that they can't sell what they're making because the people in America went broke and can't afford to buy it any longer. Who are they going to sell those cars and computers to then?...3rd world countries where people are still living in one room huts with no electricity? Yeah right!
Why don't we go to school and work on the weekends and take the week off!
quote:Originally posted by footlong
Vik...The RISE of WalMart EXACTLY followed the FALL of American manufacturing.. 0le Sam was a hypocrite ...Preaching ''Buy American''while selling Chinese goods by the boat load...ALL the American textile jobs were lost because of him and his KIND.
That's like blaming the gun for gun crime. Sam never forced anyone to buy anything at his stores. If you want to blame anyone blame the people that shop there.
Comments
quote:Originally posted by wifetrained
quote:Originally posted by nards444
quote:Originally posted by austin20
quote:Originally posted by Viktor
I still maintain that if the US truly wants to regain the manufacturing might we once had, we need to significantly limit the power of the EPA and unions, and put hefty trade tariffs on all imported goods, to the extent that the end-user cost would be the same or slightly higher than the end-user cost of competitive, domestically-produced goods.
Also, giving tax breaks to companies that actively promote the use and production of domestically-produced goods would certainly turn the economy around, and make companies WANT to move production back into this country.
The problem right now is that with all the free-trade agreements this country has made, it is significantly cheaper and easier for manufacturers to move the production to countries with lower labor costs and less restrictive worker safety laws.
Trade laws need to be made by people who understand the mindset of owning a business: the goal is to make as much money as the market will allow. Business owners (and I apologize for any offense caused) are greedy; they like making money, and hate spending it. So if they can spend less while keeping the product price the same, they actually make more in the long run.
The assumption that business owners will reduce the price of their product that they know from experience their customers are willing to pay is stupid. The oil companies are a perfect example of this phenomenon; they know we, as consumers, will pay upwards of $5.00/gallon for fuel. They COULD set the end-user price around $1.50/gallon if they wanted to, but they know they can make more money by charging us more than that, and we'll pay it. It doesn't really cost them much more to produce $1.50/gallon fuel than it does $5.00/gallon fuel, but the $5.00/gallon fuel makes them more money, so gas prices stay high.Crude is currently trading for over $100 per barrel (43 gallon barrel yielding 19.5 gallons of gasoline per barrel plus other products) Please show us your math on how you can profitably sell it for $1.50 per gallon.
The true cost is hard to find. out of 100 gallons of crude how much of it can actually be made into something, such as plastics, paints, chemicals etc. I have read multiple times minus tax teh true cost of gasoline should be around $2 per gallon. Factor in taxes even in the most exspensive states means we should be paying on average closer to $3 a gallon at the pump vs $4 now. So factor in 30% in extra cost and the fact oil companies continually make record profits, do the math all you want something isnt right.
I wonder how much of the price is caused by speculation. It's been long rumored that the money the major banks have been receiving from the Federal Reserve has been used to keep commodity prices up. Sure hasn't been used for the stated purpose of business loans to boost the economy.
I would say a great majority of it. As oil is traded in futures. Oil is bought in 3-6 month contracts, the oil we are using today was bought a few months ago. So they speculate on what it might be worth today. Get rid of speculation and average the price out, gas would still be high but not as high as it is today. My personal belief is gas is price artifically by at least 50 cents on the gallon. Problem is the rich and the government make to much money on it, so nothing with change.
What would the cost be if future's traders had to pony up more than 10% on a futures contract. What if they had to cough up 50%?
Actually years away, but if we keep on this path of nogrowth economy under this incompetent POTUS and his LIB followers, in several years China MIGHT overtake us. But China is faced with terrible problems....like their own housing bubble which has the potential to dwarf ours, an aging population with no SS net to catch them, a slowing economy, terrible air and water pollution issues....just to name four. And their economy is slowing but no where near our lousy growth rate under this POTUS we are stuck with for almost three long years. The point is we need to get a new Senate in 2014 and then a new more conservative POTUS in 2016 who will come in, lower taxes, cut gov't spending, and stop excessive regulations to jumpstart our economy. That happens and China's GDP is (again) in our rear view mirror.
I still dont think gauging China as measuring stick whether they are in front of us or behind us really matters to exten. But as you said I wouldnt worry about China as much as some think. China has some storm clouds brewing. China everyday is slipping from communism to socialism which they are probably there already and are getting even closer to having some capitalistic tendencys. Which the major problem with that is they are going to have labor unrest at some point, of which signs of it are already starting. Once the population starts receving fair wages and such they will take a step back from being the factory of the world.
Also China is going to have a population problem of not having enough people, yes I said that right. The issue is the years of the one child rule has actually shot them in the foot, now they do not have enough people to support the infastructure.
But as I noted 1.35 billion people over there are starting to buy things instead of just living subsistence when their econmy really picks up along with the other bloated population thrid world coountries we should be able to make a fortune selling them things we are good at and they no longer want to do.
I've heard a few outsourced products are already coming back due to higher overseas manufactering costs and shipping added in with fuel costs makes it no longer as viable to outsource.
quote:Originally posted by Smitty500mag
Just wait until all these companies that went to China and other parts of the world in order to get cheap labor finally figure out in a few more years that they can't sell what they're making because the people in America went broke and can't afford to buy it any longer. Who are they going to sell those cars and computers to then?...3rd world countries where people are still living in one room huts with no electricity? Yeah right!
Vik...The RISE of WalMart EXACTLY followed the FALL of American manufacturing.. 0le Sam was a hypocrite ...Preaching ''Buy American''while selling Chinese goods by the boat load...ALL the American textile jobs were lost because of him and his KIND.
That's like blaming the gun for gun crime. Sam never forced anyone to buy anything at his stores. If you want to blame anyone blame the people that shop there.