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Too bad he was not selling aborted baby body parts, he would have gotten a pass then. Hell he would have been a hero if he had killed the lion in a dress.
quote:Originally posted by Junkballer
That to me is as equivalent as an African coming over here shooting our Bald Eagle for sport...........not good [V]
What are your feelings on Native Americans killing the Bald Eagle for religious purposes?
The Lion is not the national symbol of Zimbabwe.
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
quote:Originally posted by Jgreen
There's something really distasteful about this. There's a difference between wildlife conservation and management and a canned "hunt".
Even if you were thinning the herd for all the right reasons, if the animal is healthy and won't be taken for meat, it seems kind of like a di-k thing to do.
Here's a rich white American, willing to pay through the nose to kill a Lion, while everyone else does the "hunting". And for what? A thrill? I sometimes think that these are the kinds of people who would also pay to hunt a person on some island somewhere...
I know, it's a jump, but who wants to kill a lion?
Choice... Choice.. Anyone can choose what they want to do. I wouldn't have went close to that thing with a Bow and Arrow.
CROSSBOW (not bow and arrow) dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park . . . great hunt . . .
(Probably NOT legal to "hunt" jackrabbits that way in most States.)
quote:Originally posted by CaptFun
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
Wow, that is exactly what I said today to my guys, as we were discussing this. I also want to add, that "I", Just "I", think that elephant hunting is the worst crime in the world. I know this is kinda off the subject, But it is my personal biggest pet peeve. If I knew someone did that, I would lose all respect for them. I could not stand in front of that animal and just blow it's brains out in front of it's family. Sorry, but I don't even care about anyone's comments on this. It really pisses me off to no end. Oakie[;)]
I'm kind of surprised at the tone of the comments. It seems like the fellow was within his legal rights and if there's fault to be had it rests upon his guides. He was outside the park and when the animals leave the park they're not protected. While the lion apparently did have a collar, I imagine at night and behind a large mane such a collar would be quite difficult to see.
These big game licenses bring in huge amounts of money to very poor regions, and that money often goes to maintain wildlife sanctuaries.
I do have issue with the use of a crossbow. Anything that would allow an animal to suffer for 40 hours is simply not an ethical means of killing. Shot placement seems poor, but I also think that the crossbow simply did not have the destructive power of a .308 or .270, not to mention the African calibers. Still, a marginal hit with a .308 or .270 would surely put that animal down in less than 40 hours.
quote:Originally posted by Oakie
quote:Originally posted by CaptFun
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
Wow, that is exactly what I said today to my guys, as we were discussing this. I also want to add, that "I", Just "I", think that elephant hunting is the worst crime in the world. I know this is kinda off the subject, But it is my personal biggest pet peeve. If I knew someone did that, I would lose all respect for them. I could not stand in front of that animal and just blow it's brains out in front of it's family. Sorry, but I don't even care about anyone's comments on this. It really pisses me off to no end. Oakie[;)]
How about hunters paying a substantial price/trophy fee to shoot a non trophy elephant to "cull" the herd? Or killing one or two "rogue elephants" that are destroying vegetable gardens and crops?
I'd shoot a cull Bull elephant first chance if I could to help the elephant herd/population!!
CNN reported this morning that the White House will begin reviewing an on-line petition for the extradition of Palmer.
I am at a bit of a loss what this review will entail.
We have an extradition treaty in place with Rhodesia, sorry, Zimbabwe.
If a crime has been committed that is a crime in both countries, and there is probably cause to suspect a unique individual, we are contracted to extradite Palmer.
There is a hearing process, and the extradition must be ordered by a judge, but the process exists, and is completely external to the White House itself, though the State and Justice Departments are involved.
Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.
Here is the deal, the way I seep it.
Unless, they were specifically hunting "Cecil" (Which I doubt)this is ALL on the P/H and landowner. The dentist has been made the victim.
The P/H made it worse by not taking the collar to park officials, but hiding it in a tree.
As usual, the MSM has done a poor job covering this.
Palmer can my Dentist any time.
quote:Originally posted by wallie
Who do you think this billionaires son is that flew to Africa in his fathers plane and killed this defenseless animal.
Looks to me like he is "choking his chicken". [:D]
"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you"
quote:Originally posted by bullshot
quote:Originally posted by wallie
Who do you think this billionaires son is that flew to Africa in his fathers plane and killed this defenseless animal.
Looks to me like he is "choking his chicken". [:D]
quote:Originally posted by gearheaddad
dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park .
Alan, you got this where? Certainly would explain not seeing the collar!
quote:Originally posted by gearheaddad
dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park .
Alan, you got this where? Certainly would explain not seeing the collar!
I read several sources. It has been reported that Safari Club International suspended the membership of the dentist and a guide as well. I understand that sort of action is a bit unusual and for cause.
Have read reports from Zimbabwe and/or the quotes of game officials there reporting on the "hunting method" used by the dentist, his "professional guides" and of a landowner on or near the Park boundary.
I'd encourage anyone that is actually interested to read the info that is available. Or we can all stay ignorant and/or uninformed and/or disregard the reports all together and continue to dice this all this way and that.
(( The landowner and the guide had been arrested.))
I read where this doctor has a hunting
issue already in the states.
That still doesn't explain or hint to
why this fellow and Guide didn't
see the collar on the animal's neck
and why the Guide didn't know about
the local's attitude toward
the "pet" lion.
Something is fishy ,but as far
as the Zimbabwe's ,they can go
crap in their hat.
quote:Originally posted by rong
I read where this doctor has a hunting
issue already in the states.
That still doesn't explain or hint to
why this fellow and Guide didn't
see the collar on the animal's neck
and why the Guide didn't know about
the local's attitude toward
the "pet" lion.
Something is fishy ,but as far
as the Zimbabwe's ,they can go
crap in their hat.
I read he shot it at about 10pm. Which is common practice.for cat hunting. Also the large mane will help hide the collar.
"They went hunting at night with a spotlight and they spotted Cecil," Johnny Rodrigues, a spokesman for the Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force, told The Guardian. "They tied a dead animal to their vehicle to lure Cecil out of the park and they scented an area about half a kilometre from the park."
Rodrigues said Palmer first shot Cecil with a crossbow, but it did not kill him. They then "tracked him down and found him 40 hours later" and thenshot him with a rifle, Rodrigues said.
========================
I've found many photos of this guy either holding a bow, or having a bow promanently displayed within the successful "hunt" photo.
I've not yet met the honest and ethical bow hunter, neither female nor male that would "bow hunt" with a crossbow.
Are there honest and ethical bow hunters, that also hunt separetely with cross bow? No doubt - but it's doubtful that this guy is one of those folks.
F O R T Y H O U R S - to track down and finally dispatch Cecil?
How many hunters here are impressed by that?
Doesn't sound like archery hunting, nor "bowhuting", nor legal, nor ethical, nor honest, nor sportsman hunting.
That all sounds more like poaching than hunting to most sportsman hunters and most other folks as well.
"They went hunting at night with a spotlight and they spotted Cecil," Johnny Rodrigues, a spokesman for the Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force, told The Guardian. "They tied a dead animal to their vehicle to lure Cecil out of the park and they scented an area about half a kilometre from the park."
Rodrigues said Palmer first shot Cecil with a crossbow, but it did not kill him. They then "tracked him down and found him 40 hours later" and thenshot him with a rifle, Rodrigues said.
========================
I've found many photos of this guy either holding a bow, or having a bow promanently displayed within the successful "hunt" photo.
I've not yet met the honest and ethical bow hunter, neither female nor male that would "bow hunt" with a crossbow.
Are there honest and ethical bow hunters, that also hunt separetely with cross bow? No doubt - but it's doubtful that this guy is one of those folks.
F O R T Y H O U R S - to track down and finally dispatch Cecil?
How many hunters here are impressed by that?
Doesn't sound like archery hunting, nor "bowhuting", nor legal, nor ethical, nor honest, nor sportsman hunting.
That all sounds more like poaching than hunting to most sportsman hunters and most other folks as well.
Now, if that is how it went down, I have a whole different feeling about Palmer.
I'll continue following this story until the facts and true story actually come out!
The picture I saw was Palmer with a Compound Bow(which doesn't make much of a difference!) Which is probably the same as a crossbow to the average journalist!
I listened to the audio and .......couldn't stop laughing. The narration made it sound like this lion had a PHD, left a family of six, was a good husband and provider. You don't even hear this kind of outrage at the death of a person unless they're black. Still laughing.......at the lion situation.
Man I sure hope when I go to Canada for another black bear that what happened in Maine two years ago doesn't repeat itself. You see, I shot this bruiser of a bear 400lb+. Walked right up under the tree, did a couple cart wheels, stood on his head, and then did a balancing act on the bait bucket. Wild baby! I took a 10 yard shot and he knuckled. Got him back to camp and hung him on the meat hook. It was then the game warden, who came for a tooth sample to age the bears made the discovery. He went up to check the tooth and when he rolled the lip back there it was.....as big as day....a tattoo....It read... Property of Barnum & Bailey Circus. Talk about Murphy's Law. What are those odds....huh?
I cannot for the life of me understand nor believe the outrage a hunter is bringing on! With everything else going on in the world and this is what pisses people off??
ISIS killing anyone who disagrees with them in a very grotesque manner and they even kill kids!!!
Iran and nukes.
And so many other things wring in this world and people are pissed off over a lion being killed???????
This people is a prime example of what's wrong in our world today!!
Let's not forget Planned Parenthood and the murder of babies!! Ohh no, forget that let's hang the lion killer!!
You my brother are right on target. I agree.
quote:Originally posted by Big Sky Redneck
I cannot for the life of me understand nor believe the outrage a hunter is bringing on! With everything else going on in the world and this is what pisses people off??
ISIS killing anyone who disagrees with them in a very grotesque manner and they even kill kids!!!
Iran and nukes.
And so many other things wring in this world and people are pissed off over a lion being killed???????
This people is a prime example of what's wrong in our world today!!
Let's not forget Planned Parenthood and the murder of babies!! Ohh no, forget that let's hang the lion killer!!
I was just telling my wife there going nuts over a lion , I agree its a bad deal all the way around. but at the end of the day its a lion ,
to me there going after the money $$$ and the American is where they know it is . , now here in the states all the do gooders have a new cause to chant too , I suggest they focus there efforts on some of the following
Africa has has many school girls kidnapped raped and marred off to the roaming bad guys oh well , how may disappear each day oh well , how many are people are killed by the warring dictators each year oh well , , look in the mirror Africa long and hard one lion vs the thousands of starving and dying population you ignore , same with all the out crying public get a real life
just goes to show [:(!][:(!]
just wonder how many of these "real" hunters would be ready to go against some one who would shoot back....sometimes an animal may win but not since the advent of modern weapons has the chances been very even...
Of the two main hunter types, the ones that hunt for food and the ones that hunt for trophies neither hunts for the sake of even combat anymore than a shark hunts for the joy of the fight.
I personally do not agree with trophy hunting. I can not figure out the lure of killing a beautiful animal so I can say I did.
So, you know what I do? Insult those that do? Degrade them for thinking differently than I do?
Nope.
I don't trophy hunt and I can not remember a trophy hunter ridiculing me because I did not agree with him
Hint, ugh, hint hint
"Fools learn from their own mistakes. I learn from the mistakes of others"
Otto von Bismarck
quote:Originally posted by CaptFun
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
Comments
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2015/07/29/globalpost-drug-traffickers-wiping-out-jaguar-central-america/30826811/
"Never do wrong to make a friend----or to keep one".....Robert E. Lee
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. ~ Woodrow Call
Canned hunts are an abomination ... Period !
Anyone that participates in such activity deserves all the bad Karma they generate.
[}:)][}:)][}:)][:(!][:(!]
Define "Canned hunts" please.
That to me is as equivalent as an African coming over here shooting our Bald Eagle for sport...........not good [V]
What are your feelings on Native Americans killing the Bald Eagle for religious purposes?
The Lion is not the national symbol of Zimbabwe.
quote:Originally posted by Jgreen
There's something really distasteful about this. There's a difference between wildlife conservation and management and a canned "hunt".
Even if you were thinning the herd for all the right reasons, if the animal is healthy and won't be taken for meat, it seems kind of like a di-k thing to do.
Here's a rich white American, willing to pay through the nose to kill a Lion, while everyone else does the "hunting". And for what? A thrill? I sometimes think that these are the kinds of people who would also pay to hunt a person on some island somewhere...
I know, it's a jump, but who wants to kill a lion?
Choice... Choice.. Anyone can choose what they want to do. I wouldn't have went close to that thing with a Bow and Arrow.
CROSSBOW (not bow and arrow) dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park . . . great hunt . . .
(Probably NOT legal to "hunt" jackrabbits that way in most States.)
Alan, you got this where? Certainly would explain not seeing the collar!
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
Wow, that is exactly what I said today to my guys, as we were discussing this. I also want to add, that "I", Just "I", think that elephant hunting is the worst crime in the world. I know this is kinda off the subject, But it is my personal biggest pet peeve. If I knew someone did that, I would lose all respect for them. I could not stand in front of that animal and just blow it's brains out in front of it's family. Sorry, but I don't even care about anyone's comments on this. It really pisses me off to no end. Oakie[;)]
These big game licenses bring in huge amounts of money to very poor regions, and that money often goes to maintain wildlife sanctuaries.
I do have issue with the use of a crossbow. Anything that would allow an animal to suffer for 40 hours is simply not an ethical means of killing. Shot placement seems poor, but I also think that the crossbow simply did not have the destructive power of a .308 or .270, not to mention the African calibers. Still, a marginal hit with a .308 or .270 would surely put that animal down in less than 40 hours.
I've shot dogs, cats, rabbits, cows, turkeys, deer, bears, mice, woodchucks and 50 more kinds of animals probably. All for various reasons.
The lion didn't know it was a celebrity. It wanted to live no more than a cow shot for butchering.
Sneaking thru the brush buck naked with a sharpened stick to kill an animal, versus tying it up to shoot it, still results in a dead animal.
Fair chase??? 1 in a million practices true fair chase. Or less. I'd like to see anyone wrestle a buck deer to the ground with their bare hands.
quote:Originally posted by CaptFun
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
Wow, that is exactly what I said today to my guys, as we were discussing this. I also want to add, that "I", Just "I", think that elephant hunting is the worst crime in the world. I know this is kinda off the subject, But it is my personal biggest pet peeve. If I knew someone did that, I would lose all respect for them. I could not stand in front of that animal and just blow it's brains out in front of it's family. Sorry, but I don't even care about anyone's comments on this. It really pisses me off to no end. Oakie[;)]
How about hunters paying a substantial price/trophy fee to shoot a non trophy elephant to "cull" the herd? Or killing one or two "rogue elephants" that are destroying vegetable gardens and crops?
I'd shoot a cull Bull elephant first chance if I could to help the elephant herd/population!!
I am at a bit of a loss what this review will entail.
We have an extradition treaty in place with Rhodesia, sorry, Zimbabwe.
If a crime has been committed that is a crime in both countries, and there is probably cause to suspect a unique individual, we are contracted to extradite Palmer.
There is a hearing process, and the extradition must be ordered by a judge, but the process exists, and is completely external to the White House itself, though the State and Justice Departments are involved.
Brad Steele
Unless, they were specifically hunting "Cecil" (Which I doubt)this is ALL on the P/H and landowner. The dentist has been made the victim.
The P/H made it worse by not taking the collar to park officials, but hiding it in a tree.
As usual, the MSM has done a poor job covering this.
Palmer can my Dentist any time.
Who do you think this billionaires son is that flew to Africa in his fathers plane and killed this defenseless animal.
Looks to me like he is "choking his chicken". [:D]
quote:Originally posted by wallie
Who do you think this billionaires son is that flew to Africa in his fathers plane and killed this defenseless animal.
Looks to me like he is "choking his chicken". [:D]
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/pics-rump-adult-sons-hunting-game-africa-resurface-article-1.2308107
dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park .
Alan, you got this where? Certainly would explain not seeing the collar!
quote:Originally posted by gearheaddad
dark of the night, with lights, on or near border of a National game park .
Alan, you got this where? Certainly would explain not seeing the collar!
I read several sources. It has been reported that Safari Club International suspended the membership of the dentist and a guide as well. I understand that sort of action is a bit unusual and for cause.
Have read reports from Zimbabwe and/or the quotes of game officials there reporting on the "hunting method" used by the dentist, his "professional guides" and of a landowner on or near the Park boundary.
I'd encourage anyone that is actually interested to read the info that is available. Or we can all stay ignorant and/or uninformed and/or disregard the reports all together and continue to dice this all this way and that.
(( The landowner and the guide had been arrested.))
http://heavy.com/news/2015/07/walter-palmer-minnesota-dentist-hunter-killed-cecil-the-lion-dead-shot-zimbabwe-illegal-arrested-photos-video-cubs-theo-bronchorst-trymore-ndlovu/
Atleast he wasn't harvesting human fetuses for profit using taxpayer funding...that would be terrible![B)]
+1, I'll save my outrage for the 57 million abortions that have taken place since Roe V Wade.
issue already in the states.
That still doesn't explain or hint to
why this fellow and Guide didn't
see the collar on the animal's neck
and why the Guide didn't know about
the local's attitude toward
the "pet" lion.
Something is fishy ,but as far
as the Zimbabwe's ,they can go
crap in their hat.
I read where this doctor has a hunting
issue already in the states.
That still doesn't explain or hint to
why this fellow and Guide didn't
see the collar on the animal's neck
and why the Guide didn't know about
the local's attitude toward
the "pet" lion.
Something is fishy ,but as far
as the Zimbabwe's ,they can go
crap in their hat.
I read he shot it at about 10pm. Which is common practice.for cat hunting. Also the large mane will help hide the collar.
Rodrigues said Palmer first shot Cecil with a crossbow, but it did not kill him. They then "tracked him down and found him 40 hours later" and thenshot him with a rifle, Rodrigues said.
========================
I've found many photos of this guy either holding a bow, or having a bow promanently displayed within the successful "hunt" photo.
I've not yet met the honest and ethical bow hunter, neither female nor male that would "bow hunt" with a crossbow.
Are there honest and ethical bow hunters, that also hunt separetely with cross bow? No doubt - but it's doubtful that this guy is one of those folks.
F O R T Y H O U R S - to track down and finally dispatch Cecil?
How many hunters here are impressed by that?
Doesn't sound like archery hunting, nor "bowhuting", nor legal, nor ethical, nor honest, nor sportsman hunting.
That all sounds more like poaching than hunting to most sportsman hunters and most other folks as well.
"They went hunting at night with a spotlight and they spotted Cecil," Johnny Rodrigues, a spokesman for the Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force, told The Guardian. "They tied a dead animal to their vehicle to lure Cecil out of the park and they scented an area about half a kilometre from the park."
Rodrigues said Palmer first shot Cecil with a crossbow, but it did not kill him. They then "tracked him down and found him 40 hours later" and thenshot him with a rifle, Rodrigues said.
========================
I've found many photos of this guy either holding a bow, or having a bow promanently displayed within the successful "hunt" photo.
I've not yet met the honest and ethical bow hunter, neither female nor male that would "bow hunt" with a crossbow.
Are there honest and ethical bow hunters, that also hunt separetely with cross bow? No doubt - but it's doubtful that this guy is one of those folks.
F O R T Y H O U R S - to track down and finally dispatch Cecil?
How many hunters here are impressed by that?
Doesn't sound like archery hunting, nor "bowhuting", nor legal, nor ethical, nor honest, nor sportsman hunting.
That all sounds more like poaching than hunting to most sportsman hunters and most other folks as well.
Now, if that is how it went down, I have a whole different feeling about Palmer.
I'll continue following this story until the facts and true story actually come out!
The picture I saw was Palmer with a Compound Bow(which doesn't make much of a difference!) Which is probably the same as a crossbow to the average journalist!
Man I sure hope when I go to Canada for another black bear that what happened in Maine two years ago doesn't repeat itself. You see, I shot this bruiser of a bear 400lb+. Walked right up under the tree, did a couple cart wheels, stood on his head, and then did a balancing act on the bait bucket. Wild baby! I took a 10 yard shot and he knuckled. Got him back to camp and hung him on the meat hook. It was then the game warden, who came for a tooth sample to age the bears made the discovery. He went up to check the tooth and when he rolled the lip back there it was.....as big as day....a tattoo....It read... Property of Barnum & Bailey Circus. Talk about Murphy's Law. What are those odds....huh?
ISIS killing anyone who disagrees with them in a very grotesque manner and they even kill kids!!!
Iran and nukes.
And so many other things wring in this world and people are pissed off over a lion being killed???????
This people is a prime example of what's wrong in our world today!!
Let's not forget Planned Parenthood and the murder of babies!! Ohh no, forget that let's hang the lion killer!!
Didn't Jimmy Kimmel cry for the lion on TV? What pu55y!
I cry every time his show comes on.[:D]
[:D][:D]
quote:Originally posted by Big Sky Redneck
I cannot for the life of me understand nor believe the outrage a hunter is bringing on! With everything else going on in the world and this is what pisses people off??
ISIS killing anyone who disagrees with them in a very grotesque manner and they even kill kids!!!
Iran and nukes.
And so many other things wring in this world and people are pissed off over a lion being killed???????
This people is a prime example of what's wrong in our world today!!
Let's not forget Planned Parenthood and the murder of babies!! Ohh no, forget that let's hang the lion killer!!
to me there going after the money $$$ and the American is where they know it is . , now here in the states all the do gooders have a new cause to chant too , I suggest they focus there efforts on some of the following
Africa has has many school girls kidnapped raped and marred off to the roaming bad guys oh well , how may disappear each day oh well , how many are people are killed by the warring dictators each year oh well , , look in the mirror Africa long and hard one lion vs the thousands of starving and dying population you ignore , same with all the out crying public get a real life
just goes to show [:(!][:(!]
I personally do not agree with trophy hunting. I can not figure out the lure of killing a beautiful animal so I can say I did.
So, you know what I do? Insult those that do? Degrade them for thinking differently than I do?
Nope.
I don't trophy hunt and I can not remember a trophy hunter ridiculing me because I did not agree with him
Hint, ugh, hint hint
"Fools learn from their own mistakes. I learn from the mistakes of others"
Otto von Bismarck
Lets be straight up about it, he killed a semi tame zoo lion with a collar that was about as popular as Willie B the gorilla was here at the Atlanta zoo with the visitors to that park. He (and or the guide) lured the lion outside the park over a period of time and then shot it.
If you want to shoot a lion there are places to do it and tags to get, this guy is nothing but a rich poacher. (And makes the rest of us look bad)
good tactic