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This situation is ridiculous...I can't believe...
Doc
Member Posts: 13,898 ✭✭✭
It's gone on this long.
I stopped at Bass Pro because I happened to be passing by. Hadn't been in for a while and I wanted to ask if they are seeing any improvement in 22 ammo supplies. Short answer is no, they are only getting a small fraction of what they used to get.
The two guys in front of me were asking for 22 ammo, as was the older man behind me with his wife and pre-teen granddaughter with him. He had given her a 22 rifle for Christmas and as of today, March 27, she has yet been able to shoot her new rifle because they still can't find any ammo. They live about 90 minutes north of Little Rock in a small community and they were in town for shopping. While here they were going from one store to the next that sold guns and ammo with no success.
So I gave him my address and told him to come by the house and I would give him some ammo for his granddaughter. I grabbed two boxes of Blazers off the shelf and gave them to the girl when they arrived.
This sort of product shortage, going on this long, is unacceptable in America. Has Obama and the Democrats truly succeeded in making us a Third World country where there are shortages of common products? Why have the manufacturers not stepped up to meet demand? They issued press releases saying they are running at full capacity but every store owner and manager I speak with says they are not getting much at all. Where's it going?
Meanwhile the scum sucking gougers get their friends to help them grab up what little does arrive in the stores so they can take it to the gun show, or the Internet auction site and demand three or four times retail price. May they burn in Hell.
This would NOT have happened in the America I was born in.
I stopped at Bass Pro because I happened to be passing by. Hadn't been in for a while and I wanted to ask if they are seeing any improvement in 22 ammo supplies. Short answer is no, they are only getting a small fraction of what they used to get.
The two guys in front of me were asking for 22 ammo, as was the older man behind me with his wife and pre-teen granddaughter with him. He had given her a 22 rifle for Christmas and as of today, March 27, she has yet been able to shoot her new rifle because they still can't find any ammo. They live about 90 minutes north of Little Rock in a small community and they were in town for shopping. While here they were going from one store to the next that sold guns and ammo with no success.
So I gave him my address and told him to come by the house and I would give him some ammo for his granddaughter. I grabbed two boxes of Blazers off the shelf and gave them to the girl when they arrived.
This sort of product shortage, going on this long, is unacceptable in America. Has Obama and the Democrats truly succeeded in making us a Third World country where there are shortages of common products? Why have the manufacturers not stepped up to meet demand? They issued press releases saying they are running at full capacity but every store owner and manager I speak with says they are not getting much at all. Where's it going?
Meanwhile the scum sucking gougers get their friends to help them grab up what little does arrive in the stores so they can take it to the gun show, or the Internet auction site and demand three or four times retail price. May they burn in Hell.
This would NOT have happened in the America I was born in.
....................................................................................................
Too old to live...too young to die...
Too old to live...too young to die...
Comments
When I hit the next really big powerball lottery, I'm going down to mexico and buying an ammo plant and make millions of rounds of .22 ammo.
Then I'm shipping it up here and selling it on GB, gunshows, and every small gun store I can find.
For $19.99 a brick of 500. $15.99 if you're under 18 years old.
I don't care how much money I lose, just to to stick it to the gougers.
[:D]
It's gone on this long.
I stopped at Bass Pro because I happened to be passing by. Hadn't been in for a while and I wanted to ask if they are seeing any improvement in 22 ammo supplies. Short answer is no, they are only getting a small fraction of what they used to get.
The two guys in front of me were asking for 22 ammo, as was the older man behind me with his wife and pre-teen granddaughter with him. He had given her a 22 rifle for Christmas and as of today, March 27, she has yet been able to shoot her new rifle because they still can't find any ammo. They live about 90 minutes north of Little Rock in a small community and they were in town for shopping. While here they were going from one store to the next that sold guns and ammo with no success.
So I gave him my address and told him to come by the house and I would give him some ammo for his granddaughter. I grabbed two boxes of Blazers of the shelf and gave them to the girl when they arrived.
This sort of product shortage, going on this long, is unacceptable in America. Has Obama and the Democrats truly succeeded in making us a Third World country where there are shortages of common products? Why have the manufacturers not stepped up to meet demand? They issued press releases saying they are running at full capacity but every store owner and manager I speak with says they are not getting much at all. Where's it going?
Meanwhile the scum sucking gougers get their friends to help them grab up what little does arrive in the stores so they can take it to the gun show, or the Internet auction site and demand three or four times retail price. May they burn in Hell.
This would NOT have happened in the America I was born in.
+1[:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!]
I have always believed with the level of production that inventories would begin to increase. Apparently we have a long-term low-level panic that, until the price raises to damper demand, may continue indefinitely.
Good on you, Doc, for helping out a stranger.
Brad Steele
Hoarders are having an impact but even they eventually run out of funds to hoard anymore ammo.
It is SOMETHING we are not seeing. Russian production and Mexican production could have filled the void in 60 days. It has not happened, not sure if it is Government or greed or maybe a combination of both??
I'm sure some remember tire shortages and butter and silk shortages.
This is exactly how things work in the America I grew up in.
I'm happy you were available to do the kind thing for them.
Some speculators/arbitrageurs will get left holding the bag.
When they do, I hope their inventories make it to the market.
But it's more likely they'll be stacked on shelves looking for the day when 22LR is the sole mode of exchange. And they will turn green and moldy before that day arrives.
I am starting to doubt the "shortage" now as much as I was able to PROVE there was no propane shortage because the exports went from 200,000 barrels a day to 357,000 barrels per day at the height of the cold snap.
Hoarders are having an impact but even they eventually run out of funds to hoard anymore ammo.
It is SOMETHING we are not seeing. Russian production and Mexican production could have filled the void in 60 days. It has not happened, not sure if it is Government or greed or maybe a combination of both??
Your right its hoarders and manufactures deliberately affecting the market. The government has a play in providing scare tatics but in the end its private companies manufacturing and filling orders.
But when you have guys on here with SCORE another 10000rds of 22lr, or dropped by walmart and bought another box to add to my collection of 100 boxes, that does affect supply after time.
Thanks Andy[:(!] quote:Originally posted by JnRockwall
He could get it if he wanted it. Just to lazy to get out of bed. Common with most people who doesnt have any.
"they are only getting in a fraction of what they use to get"
Every retailer I have asked in the last few months says
the exact same thing.....
Blame it on peolple being lazy, gougers, speculators, hoarders
but the fact remains that supply is low so any one of the above
factors makes the problem worse.....
Too old to live...too young to die...
I remember toilet paper shortages and gasoline shortages.
I'm sure some remember tire shortages and butter and silk shortages.
This is exactly how things work in the America I grew up in.
I'm happy you were available to do the kind thing for them.
Some speculators/arbitrageurs will get left holding the bag.
When they do, I hope their inventories make it to the market.
But it's more likely they'll be stacked on shelves looking for the day when 22LR is the sole mode of exchange. And they will turn green and moldy before that day arrives.
1974 toilet paper for sure, in the military it was really scary. There were fight over toilet paper people claiming someone stole their roll.
Some of you are still not listening. It is not I repeat NOT totally an increase in demand causing this shortage. No retailer I have talked with is getting his usual supply. I know demand is way up because of all the new shooters and because of fears of legislation but supply is also way down.
You don't think all of the people involved in the supply chain haven't figured out that they can can sell the product they are moving directly for 3 or 4 times retail price?
Some of you are still not listening. It is not I repeat NOT totally an increase in demand causing this shortage. No retailer I have talked with is getting his usual supply. I know demand is way up because of all the new shooters and because of fears of legislation but supply is also way down.
Every domestic manufacturer is stating that they are producing at or above their historic production levels. My guess is that retail supply is being hurt by on-line bulk sales.
For example, I picked up 100 bricks this past week for $ 32.50 a brick from a wholesaler. I would assume that this supply would normally go to a retailer. With any luck I'll be able to sell them for $ 50.00 a brick at the next show, order another 100 bricks, and pocket $ 1,750.00.
OK, this did not happen.[:)] I didn't buy 100 bricks. But it is a scenario that no doubt is repeated around the country many times a day, drying up retail supply.
Brad Steele
This is according to a distributor who happened to be at the gun shop when I stopped in...heard it right outta his mouth. HE isnt getting any....so HOW can people be hoarding them?? They have to go through him first...and he, nor his competitors, have gotten anything near what they order...so, hoarders are out.....
Why are they not making any???
More profit in other calibers.....thats what Federal is putting all effort into.....and yes, and big part of that is government....the military gets first dibs...always has. Same with other makers....higher profit calibers get the production time. You all should know this....its capitalism!!
He says dont worry, by next Feb. the selves will be overflowing with 22LR.....and at 30% higher prices then before, Ill bet!!!
really Now I Have Checked Walmart And Dicks Everywhere I Go Since August Last year Still Not able to Buy a Single .22 LR SHELL We Could atleast Buy From A gouger Online if Not for the Prick Governor We have.
Thanks Andy[:(!] quote:Originally posted by JnRockwall
He could get it if he wanted it. Just to lazy to get out of bed. Common with most people who doesnt have any.
I've picked up close to 3000 rd of 22 lr sporadically through out this year hitting Walmart on Saturday mornings. Its been about 6 months since I have found any, but for a while there I was scoring every couple weeks.
What I say is not political, but factual.
The right has done a great job of demonizing Obama. Forget whether it is deserved or not.
They have done a great job of making people think that "he's going to take our guns!!" Forget whether it is true or not, but that's what they are peddling.
Frankly, as an accident of history, we have had horrific mass shootings recently. Perhaps not worse or any more frequent that in the past, but again, with all the media, we are more "aware" of these things.
So again, there's a panic.
How many posts have you seen through the years talking about "what is the one caliber I should have?" and the answer is .22?
So we have people out there who are more convinced than ever that the sky is falling.
And the public is playing into their hands. There is more demand than ever for these products and services, and there is a shortage, but one that the manufactures are loving.
Scarcity = higher prices.
Couple that with the fact that each of these companies are "right sized" - that is to say, they are and were profitable before. If they can sell everything that they can make and do so at 2x the price, why make more? If they make more, then the scarcity is gone.
Until such time as the preppers chill, this is what you are going to see.
Just one of the steps the libs are using for gun control. Control the ammo.
Charlotte, NC --(Ammoland.com)- In December, the final primary lead smelter in the United States will close. The lead smelter, located in Herculaneum, Missouri, and owned and operated by the Doe Run Company, has existed in the same location since 1892.
The Herculaneum smelter is currently the only smelter in the United States which can produce lead bullion from raw lead ore that is mined nearby in Missouri's extensive lead deposits, giving the smelter its "primary" designation. The lead bullion produced in Herculaneum is then sold to lead product producers, including ammunition manufactures for use in conventional ammunition components such as projectiles, projectile cores, and primers. Several "secondary" smelters, where lead is recycled from products such as lead acid batteries or spent ammunition components, still operate in the United States.
Doe Run made significant efforts to reduce lead emissions from the smelter, but in 2008 the federal Environmental Protection Agency issued new National Ambient Air Quality Standards for lead that were 10 times tighter than the previous standard. Given the new lead air quality standard, Doe Run made the decision to close the Herculaneum smelter.
Whatever the EPA's motivation when creating the new lead air quality standard, increasingly restrictive regulation of lead is likely to affect the production and cost of traditional ammunition.
Too old to live...too young to die...
He could get it if he wanted it. Just to lazy to get out of bed. Common with most people who doesnt have any.
Some of us work for a living and can't hang out at academy every morning before the doors open like a obama supporter waiting in line for the next new shoe to come out.
It's gone on this long.
I stopped at Bass Pro because I happened to be passing by. Hadn't been in for a while and I wanted to ask if they are seeing any improvement in 22 ammo supplies. Short answer is no, they are only getting a small fraction of what they used to get.
The two guys in front of me were asking for 22 ammo, as was the older man behind me with his wife and pre-teen granddaughter with him. He had given her a 22 rifle for Christmas and as of today, March 27, she has yet been able to shoot her new rifle because they still can't find any ammo. They live about 90 minutes north of Little Rock in a small community and they were in town for shopping. While here they were going from one store to the next that sold guns and ammo with no success.
So I gave him my address and told him to come by the house and I would give him some ammo for his granddaughter. I grabbed two boxes of Blazers off the shelf and gave them to the girl when they arrived.
This sort of product shortage, going on this long, is unacceptable in America. Has Obama and the Democrats truly succeeded in making us a Third World country where there are shortages of common products? Why have the manufacturers not stepped up to meet demand? They issued press releases saying they are running at full capacity but every store owner and manager I speak with says they are not getting much at all. Where's it going?
Meanwhile the scum sucking gougers get their friends to help them grab up what little does arrive in the stores so they can take it to the gun show, or the Internet auction site and demand three or four times retail price. May they burn in Hell.
This would NOT have happened in the America I was born in.
Americans happened, see who they voted in and keep voting in [:o)]
He could get it if he wanted it. Just to lazy to get out of bed. Common with most people who doesnt have any.
you know this man personally i assume..and know hes lazy....you sound like such a nice guy
All the companies that have jumped on the bandwagon with the AR type 22's,Walther,Smith,Chiappa,GSG etc,etc.and the 1911 platform also.
Although being an outdated primer system, initially black powder round, it happens to be the most popular and versatile round for plinking, sport shooting, small game, garden pests, the whole gamut.
Of coarse a seemingly short time ago, one could go into about any sporting goods store and find the .22 round of their liking since it is by far the most used and manufactured round.
Sadly I have not shot any in about a year, one reason I don't want to use up what I have and then have none and many of my friends are doing the same.
There are alternatives, high velocity air rifles and black powder. I do feel bad for the beginner shooters that are starting out. Quite an injustice for the future of shooting sports.
Thanks Doc for donating some ammo for this cause.
If you find some online, quick, tell your buddies and buy it.
Get up early and be first in line. Yep, keep buying it.
Stop at every store and pester the clerk. Keep buying it.
Then piss and moan about the high price and lack of availability.
I actually find it comical. A consumer driven artificial problem. Good thing some of you don't have to buy your breathing air.
quote:Originally posted by Doc
Some of you are still not listening. It is not I repeat NOT totally an increase in demand causing this shortage. No retailer I have talked with is getting his usual supply. I know demand is way up because of all the new shooters and because of fears of legislation but supply is also way down.
Every domestic manufacturer is stating that they are producing at or above their historic production levels. My guess is that retail supply is being hurt by on-line bulk sales.
For example, I picked up 100 bricks this past week for $ 32.50 a brick from a wholesaler. I would assume that this supply would normally go to a retailer. With any luck I'll be able to sell them for $ 50.00 a brick at the next show, order another 100 bricks, and pocket $ 1,750.00.
OK, this did not happen.[:)] I didn't buy 100 bricks. But it is a scenario that no doubt is repeated around the country many times a day, drying up retail supply.
After the last Gun show I went to and talking to several people, I have no doubt this is happening. They are selling bricks for $75.
Also at the last show these sellers were being heckled and called all sort of names rather not repeat.
It was good to see no one was buying from these people. Apparently between the heckling and outright boycott, they packed up and left early and did not show the following Sunday. They paid in advance for two days.
I can also say there were people buying powder and primers from the local merchants and selling powders that they paid around $24 for $40 or more. Same with primers. Some did not even bother to remove the original price tags. Still no one is taking the bait.
The first paragraph of the op sums it up......
"they are only getting in a fraction of what they use to get"
Every retailer I have asked in the last few months says
the exact same thing.....
Blame it on people being lazy, gougers, speculators, hoarders
but the fact remains that supply is low so any one of the above
factors makes the problem worse.....
And THAT... Is what doesn't make sense.
Ammo is not on the shelves... Because AMMO... Is not getting to the stores.
BUT... The claim is, that ammo manufacturers are going gang busters 24/7.
What gives ???
Enough time has passed for the factories to add more production if it was truly a situation of too much demand.
1st, factories don't add capacity unless the long term market analysis supports it.
2nd, specialized machinery doesn't just sit on shelves waiting for a factory to order it. It can take a couple years to get a production facility up and running.
Just the manpower implications disprove this. No factory hires employees, invests in their training, and takes the financial hit for new machinery for a simple market spike.
I saw the guy with about 200 bricks and as many 225 boxes at the show (priced at $80 and I didn't see anyone carrying one around) so he's getting it from somewhere. I know these guys will have friends and family swamp a Walmart to buy all they can but it would be amazing to obtain as much as he had doing it that way. even if they did buy it all, Walmart isn't getting that much to allow this guy to stock up that way.
Too old to live...too young to die...
The manufacturers are not making any. Federal will NOT produce ANY until Jan. 2015.....that means Federal and CCI.....Remington has not stepped up production, and what is put out, thats what you have been buying 100 rounds at a time. The other makers just plain are not big enough to fill Federals (ATK) shortfall.
i dont buy that for a minute. the shareholders in any ammo company equipped to make .22 ammo that decided to not make it for a time would find themselves voted out on their * as soon as the share holders found out about it, since it would be arguably the stupidest possible decision.
you got this malarkey from some distributor allegedly in the know just shooting the bull in a gun store? yeah, cause theres never been a tall tale told in a gun shop...
This far past the "panic" days and still little to nothing on the shelves. Me thinks there's more to this than a simple supply and demand issue.
7.62x39 is already drying up where I live.
There is an ammo manufacturing plant outside of Little Rock (Remington) and I am told they have gone to 3 shifts on 22 ammo. That's what I'm told. ChrisinTempe maintains that once the distribution warehouses were emptied, the supply chain is inefficient leading to disruptions in deliveries to stores. There may be something to that. But after a year, I would think some progress would have been made and it in fact mostly seems to be getting worse. Yet, as some have noted, the gougers seem able to stock up so they can price their ammo through the roof.
I saw the guy with about 200 bricks and as many 225 boxes at the show (priced at $80 and I didn't see anyone carrying one around) so he's getting it from somewhere. I know these guys will have friends and family swamp a Walmart to buy all they can but it would be amazing to obtain as much as he had doing it that way. even if they did buy it all, Walmart isn't getting that much to allow this guy to stock up that way.
Every time I go by a Wallys... I look and ask...
"Any 22 LR lately... ?"
The answers almost ALWAYS result in... "We got a maybe 6 boxes... Or 10 boxes... "
"Or two cases... In LAST week... It was gone before it could be put up."
Two cases a week multiplied by ~11,500 stores in the USA = 23,000 cases per week.
10 bricks per case equates to 115 million rounds per week
ONE CCI location alone (Lewiston, Idaho) in 2012 was producing 4 million rounds per DAY... Every day.
Multiplied x 7 days = 28 million rounds per week. LINK
Lump ALL the 22 LR manufacturers together...
And that is a helluva lot more than what we're seeing...
It's being made I'm sure... Jus'where the hell is it going ???
Keep buying it, yep, just keep buying it whenever, wherever you find it.
If you find some online, quick, tell your buddies and buy it.
Get up early and be first in line. Yep, keep buying it.
Stop at every store and pester the clerk. Keep buying it.
Then piss and moan about the high price and lack of availability.
I actually find it comical. A consumer driven artificial problem. Good thing some of you don't have to buy your breathing air.
yep, funny how so many goobers haven't figured this out yet....
Keep buying it, yep, just keep buying it whenever, wherever you find it.
If you find some online, quick, tell your buddies and buy it.
Get up early and be first in line. Yep, keep buying it.
Stop at every store and pester the clerk. Keep buying it.
Then piss and moan about the high price and lack of availability.
I actually find it comical. A consumer driven artificial problem. Good thing some of you don't have to buy your breathing air.
The .22 hoarders remind me of those numb nuts that were fighting over toilet paper back in the late Fall of 1999.