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anti nerve gas pills
amsptcds
Member Posts: 679 ✭
any of you guys take them during the desert shield/storm fracass?
Comments
Yes...took mine for 39 days straight. No one ever told us that we were only supposed to take them for 14 days (I think)...maybe even less, I cannot remember now. It's probably part of what's wrong with us.
They didn't tell us that either. After that first night feeling like there was a little demon in my stomach, I told my troops to stop taking them. I had stomach nerve problems for long time after that. But I believe I saved out butts from worse.
I have wondered about if there are any studies correlating those pills with Gulf War Syndrome.
but no... why would they want to see if experimental pills might be the answer....???
Took them too for about a month. Was told I never was told that I was supposed to take them. When checking out of my unit. I noticed the pills were not entered either in my SRB or medical record. Was told again, you were never told to take them. I had written it in a letter to my wife the day I started and ended and copied down the name of the pills. I brought the letter to the C.O. and showed him and the flight surgeon. They entered it in my record.
man... those "people". I kept my pills for proof in case it were ever necessary. Seems like I'm ok. Just a little nuts...
Those pills were designed to slow down synaptic response.
They were meant to counteract nerve agent, which speeds up synaptic reponse causing convulsions etc.
But no one discussed what happens from simply taking something that works on the nervous system like that alone.
I wouldn't be surprised if people who took a lot of them have problems including symptoms that imitate parkinsons in later life or oppositely MD. I think either could happen as a result of nerve damage dependent upon what cluster of nerves become affected.
quote:Originally posted by codenamepaul
Took them too for about a month. Was told I never was told that I was supposed to take them. When checking out of my unit. I noticed the pills were not entered either in my SRB or medical record. Was told again, you were never told to take them. I had written it in a letter to my wife the day I started and ended and copied down the name of the pills. I brought the letter to the C.O. and showed him and the flight surgeon. They entered it in my record.
man... those "people". I kept my pills for proof in case it were ever necessary. Seems like I'm ok. Just a little nuts...
Those pills were designed to slow down synaptic response.
They were meant to counteract nerve agent, which speeds up synaptic reponse causing convulsions etc.
But no one discussed what happens from simply taking something that works on the nervous system like that alone.
I wouldn't be surprised if people who took a lot of them have problems including symptoms that imitate parkinsons in later life or oppositely MD. I think either could happen as a result of nerve damage dependent upon what cluster of nerves become affected.
I've got all kinds of crap wrong with me...including heart problems that started two years ago...and SEVERE memory loss. I do not sleep at all. The list goes on and on. I went through the Persian Gulf Review years back and was recommended for 100% disability. I submitted the Dr's recommendations along with ALL of my medical records and the VA conveniently lost everything...said I had to start the whole process over again. I was not about to go through all that stuff again. This was just prior to the VA getting computerized, so there's no way to find those records.
Forgot to mention...I'm only 35 years old.
quote:Originally posted by amsptcds
quote:Originally posted by codenamepaul
Took them too for about a month. Was told I never was told that I was supposed to take them. When checking out of my unit. I noticed the pills were not entered either in my SRB or medical record. Was told again, you were never told to take them. I had written it in a letter to my wife the day I started and ended and copied down the name of the pills. I brought the letter to the C.O. and showed him and the flight surgeon. They entered it in my record.
This is not good. Do you still have at least the letters sent to your wife metioning the pills?
man... those "people". I kept my pills for proof in case it were ever necessary. Seems like I'm ok. Just a little nuts...
Those pills were designed to slow down synaptic response.
They were meant to counteract nerve agent, which speeds up synaptic reponse causing convulsions etc.
But no one discussed what happens from simply taking something that works on the nervous system like that alone.
I wouldn't be surprised if people who took a lot of them have problems including symptoms that imitate parkinsons in later life or oppositely MD. I think either could happen as a result of nerve damage dependent upon what cluster of nerves become affected.
I've got all kinds of crap wrong with me...including heart problems that started two years ago...and SEVERE memory loss. I do not sleep at all. The list goes on and on. I went through the Persian Gulf Review years back and was recommended for 100% disability. I submitted the Dr's recommendations along with ALL of my medical records and the VA conveniently lost everything...said I had to start the whole process over again. I was not about to go through all that stuff again. This was just prior to the VA getting computerized, so there's no way to find those records.
Forgot to mention...I'm only 35 years old.
This is not good. Do you still have at least the letters sent to your wife metioning the pills?
If your doctor can't figure out what's wrong or is happy to treat it with medication instead of continuing tests to determine the problem then you are seeing the wrong doctor. Also stop drinking and smoking completely for two weeks to see if you feel better. Healthy people can drink and smoke, so it's not to determine whether drinking or smoking causes the problem but would help expose what area the problem could be coming from since tobacco and drinking affect different parts of the body. If completely stopping drinking/smoking (no cheating for 2 weeks) doesn't give you a 100% improvement, then you can possibly rule out some kinds of obvious health problems and focus more on the less likely things.
2 PAM-Chloride/Atropine taken by PO? Didn't know such concoction, or it's equivalent, was available. Where can I learn more?
From my understanding, what we took was supposed to be a mild dose of nerve agent, to hopefully help us build up an immunity to nerve agent. I cannot remember exactly what they were called...might have been pp pills, or pvp...I really cannot remember now. I saved some, but they have since been lost in our numerous moves.
As far as I know, atropine in sustained doses has a wicked side effect, namely an increase in oxygen consumption on myocardial (heart) cells. Was it atropine or something else?
Hey Eric, how are you? Greetings from the West Indies!!!
As far as I know, atropine in sustained doses has a wicked side effect, namely an increase in oxygen consumption on myocardial (heart) cells. Was it atropine or something else?
Hanging in there...How about yourself? I'm glad to see you checking in here again...seemed as if you were gone for a while.
I do not believe it was atropine. We had atropine injectors to keep us fighting in the event we were exposed to nerve agent. Every soldier there kept their syringes in a pouch on the case for our gask masks. I had a couple of those that I hung on to for a while as well...they too have been lost over the years.
On second thought, I believe our injectors were called antropine...not atropine.
quote:Originally posted by Polite Psycho
Hey Eric, how are you? Greetings from the West Indies!!!
As far as I know, atropine in sustained doses has a wicked side effect, namely an increase in oxygen consumption on myocardial (heart) cells. Was it atropine or something else?
Hanging in there...How about yourself? I'm glad to see you checking in here again...seemed as if you were gone for a while.
I do not believe it was atropine. We had atropine injectors to keep us fighting in the event we were exposed to nerve agent. Every soldier there kept their syringes in a pouch on the case for our gask masks. I had a couple of those that I hung on to for a while as well...they too have been lost over the years.
On second thought, I believe our injectors were called antropine...not atropine.
need a giggle?
One of my staffsergeants stabbed himeslf with one when the ship pitched while he was showing his section how to use them...
I took maybe only 3 of those pills. The rest went out the window one at a time when we were told to take a dose. I don't remember what they were called either. I to have memory problems, and sleep apnea. My biggest complaint though is joint pain.
I hear you...I have so much joint pain that I feel like I must be at least 60...but my old man gets around better than I do.
I have that packet right here:
21 tablets
pyridostigmine bromide usp 30mg
(Nerve Agent Pre-Treatment tablets)
NSN 6505-01-178-7903
Directions for use:
1.Commence taking onlywhen ordered by your commander.
2.Take one every 8 hours
3.It is dangerous to exceed the stated dose.
Duphar BV Amsterdam Holland
That's all that is written on the package.
THIS IS WHAT YOU TOOK
I have that packet right here:
21 tablets
pyridostigmine bromide usp 30mg
(Nerve Agent Pre-Treatment tablets)
NSN 6505-01-178-7903
Directions for use:
1.Commence taking onlywhen ordered by your commander.
2.Take one every 8 hours
3.It is dangerous to exceed the stated dose.
Duphar BV Amsterdam Holland
That's all that is written on the package.
10X. Dug the letter out last night to post the name. You got it.
Thanks for the info...last night I was thinking they may have been PB pills.
check out those idiot instructions.
But the key here is that the NSN is on the package. Makes them harder to deny.
I have to go back to the VA here in the near future. Mood swings, digestive problems, headaches, joint pain, and a few others. Civilian doctors have no idea and just want to suck as much money out of me as they can get. Decided it was time to give the local VA a shot.
Good luck. The VA in DC is horrible. The one in Martinsburg is a LOT better, but you still have to PUSH to have anything done...and to get them to give you any information...and as usual, they want to treat everything with pills.
PS-Does anyone else get violently ill after smelling Avon Skin so soft?
The Gobulin shot contained thimerosal (mercury):
http://www.fda.gov/Cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm
"theoretical potential for neurotoxicity of even low levels "
They say even the flu shot contains mercury...but that big horse needle you got shoved in your keister was for a very large dose of vaccine containing mercury.
And the say you shouldn't eat Salmon from the Great Lakes....why not...Uncle Sam shoves mercury up your.......
That globulin shot was recalled and is no longer given to service members:
http://www.tricare.osd.mil/policy/fy96/hav54.html
I lied and never got it. They ran out and told me to get the shot over there. When I got there I told them I already got it. Lucky for me....it was recalled.
""In June, 1996, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) requested that manufacturers test lots of IG for the presence of Hepatitis C virus (HCV) RNA, using advanced polymerase chain reaction (PCR2) methods. Centeon, the primary supplier of IG used by DoD, initiated a voluntary recall of its product rather than conduct the tests. ""
You got Hepatitis C and mercury injected in you Gulf War vets.
i took the pills and every other damn shot that a pfc has to take. now i am 33 years old and poop 15 times a day, i have cramps that feel like a knife in my gut all day. and dont worry that hasnt messed up my mind being so messed up.
Have you been worked up to rule out Chrohn's disease or Irritable bowel?
the va has given me a ton of tests including upper and lower gi. checked for krons(sp)and everything else. they rated me at 30% but i have hardly worked in the last few years. I think my rating should be higher.
May be worth an inquiry to your Liason (Am. Legion ), or even a letter to you Congressional Rep. Good luck w/ it.
I figured if we were gassed I'd be screwed anyways......
Most of the nerve gasses are basically superpotent insectides,ie cholineesterace inhibitors, which cause over stimulation of nerves.
Cannot readily find reference as to what pridostigmine does, but my guess is it probably occupies receptor then the nerve agent would attach and stimulate.
Again cannot find reference as to what it would do in a pertson not suffering myasthenia gravis.
JJk RPh
I do know if you keep on the VA, and keep putting in for re-evaluation that eventually you will get to a 100% rating.
I was medically discharged 1 year after returning from desert storm. The VA started me at a 10% rating. I kept putting in for re-evaluation and sometimes they would raise it others they wouldn't. But after years of fighting them I finally got my 100% about 2 years ago. I have a list of about 40 things that I am rated for, rangeing from bone & joint problems to "UNDIAGNOSED ILLNESES". (And they truely do call "Gulf War Illness""Undiagnosed Illnesses".
The best advice I can give anyone is: List every little thing you ever had wrong with you while you were in the service. I don't care if it was a hang-nail, list it. That is what my represenitive from AM-VETS told me. He is known as one of the best in the country in helping VETS get their benifits from the VA. (in fact he was insrumental in helping the guys from nam to start getting benifits for agent-orange) Also support your claim with all documentation. Order your 201 filesto show were you were in the gulf. (mine were suprising: you here about government papers having been blacked out in sections: mine had just this very thing. Most of the page would be fine but a paragraph in the middle would be blacked out for some reason.) If you have you shot records, that too is a big help. (there were 750,000 shot records lost from the gulf war)
If any one would like some help with there claims feel free to contact me and I can tell you what was done on mine. I have a file cabnet full of my papers and such from my years of fighting the VA on my claim. I can also help get you in touch with the guy from AM-VETS who helped me with mine to get advise.