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Trump releases his 2nd amendment stance

2

Comments

  • select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,453 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    Lots of Hillary leg humping bitches here


    [:D][:D][:D] demorats tell you to piss off..Weak..real weak...

    Repubicans use the F bomb. [:D]
  • shilowarshilowar Member Posts: 38,815 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    So when it is either Trump or Hillary WTH will you do?


    Refuse to accept either.




    Yes Sir [^]
  • Marc1301Marc1301 Member Posts: 31,897 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    They're all a bunch of * at this point.[xx(]
    "Beam me up Scotty, there's no intelligent life down here." - William Shatner
  • asopasop Member Posts: 8,898 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I just love an election year. It brings out the best in us all[}:)]
  • RocklobsterRocklobster Member Posts: 7,060
    edited November -1
  • SCOUT5SCOUT5 Member Posts: 16,182 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by shilowar
    I hope it is true, however it took him entirely too long to find someone to write that for him. Those positions are polar opposite to his previous opinions on the 2nd Amendment. Hope he is telling the truth. I am still not voting for him.



    I'm with you there.

    I want to point out I watched an interview quite a while back when he was questioned about the 2nd amendment. He said basically what is in this back then. I can't remember when it was exactly but it was well before the primaries started. It was a back and forth interview and didn't seem scripted. I've posted about this before. So he has been consistent since then anyway.

    In other reading I can see were he was exposed to some education and I think he's had a chance to think about it and has made an informed decision that he was previously wrong. It may not be that way but I think it is. If it is, and he is teachable, I see that as a plus.

    I'm sure he had someone write something for him, but it isn't new this week.
  • SCOUT5SCOUT5 Member Posts: 16,182 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    So when it is either Trump or Hillary WTH will you do?


    Refuse to accept either.

    Serving one of two masters is not freedom. The day will come when the sheep will realize that we are not slaves to the Democrats or Republicans, and that there are other options. One has to make the choice to vote for an individual rather than vote against a party.

    If you are happy with the platforms and record of the two parties, go ahead and vote for against Hilary via Trump. Perhaps a better way would be to vote against Hilary by voting for the Constitution as represented by the Libertarian candidate.

    While some will disagree with the Libertarian planks that state the Federal Government should stay out of most social issues, if they would take the time to read, they will find that this is the Constitutional approach. If we are ever again to be a free people who co-exist with a Constitutionally limited Federal Government, we will have to get a solid plurality that will walk from the paddocks of the two main parties and actually vote for liberty, the Constitution, and what should be the American Way.

    Cue music....


    Don I agree with you. That is what it will take.

    In this election I am willing to vote for Trump. Not because he is my idea of a great candidate. What I see is a way to say NO to the republican party without electing a democrat. In 2012 I did not vote for Romney for the very reasons you list. What I see in Trump is a step, a step in people's minds that we do not have to accept what the 2 major parties shove down our throats. That someone outside the power brokers choices has a chance. Perhaps, and it is perhaps, more people will start to think the grip can really be broken.

    Success breeds success. If we can show that someone not wanted by either major party can win, it may open more minds to other possibilities. It may crack the door into another route. We are over 19 trillion dollars in debt. If we do not make inroads into that trend this country will collapse, what comes after that is most likely not liberty. Yes we need big changes, but to make them we must save enough to change. If the libertarian had a chance to win I would be all over it. Not because I have to back a winner, I don't, but he doesn't have a chance this election. I see a opportunity to perhaps change course, and that may lead to an chance in the future.

    A lot of people willing to make a change will be voting for Trump. I want to keep them engaged, we will need them and others like them in the future. Nothing will keep them engaged like success.
  • chiefrchiefr Member Posts: 13,718 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    Lots of Hillary leg humping bitches here


    Isn't that the truth. Would not surprise me if some of the people complaining about Trump are wearing pant suits. They must be infatuated with Hilliary

    The pantsuits position clear on guns and the Second Amendment: Lawsuits, taxes, and an outright ban in the future.
  • SGSG Member Posts: 7,548
    edited November -1
    If I could have my way it'd be Gary Johnson and Rand Paul but that train left already.
  • BeeramidBeeramid Member, Moderator Posts: 7,264 ******
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by CaptainCrossman
    quote:
    Who cares, he yells a lot, is really orange, and has a great comb over. ....TURNIP 2016


    and he wins a lot...
    6 states in 2 weeks by 60% landslides
    what did your candidate do ?


    What did turnip do besides paint himself like a naval orange with a bad comb over, and yell a lot?

    Here's a few things Ted Cruz has done.


    Graduated valedictorian in 1988 from Second Baptist High School

    Graduated * laude from Princeton University in 1992

    Graduated magna * laude from Harvard Law School in 1995

    1992 U.S. National Debate Champion representing Princeton

    1995 World Debating Championship semi-finalist representing Harvard

    Served a law clerk to Chief Justice William Rehnquist, making him the first Hispanic ever to clerk for a Chief Justice of the United States

    Served as Solicitor General of Texas from 2003 to 2008, making him the first Hispanic Solicitor General in Texas, the youngest Solicitor General in the entire country and the longest tenure in Texas history

    Partner at the law firm Morgan, Lewis & Bockius, where he led the firm's U.S. Supreme Court and national appellate litigation practice

    Authored over 80 SCOTUS briefs and presented over 40 oral arguments before The Court

    In the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller, Cruz assembled a coalition of 31 states in defense of the principle that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual right to keep and bear arms

    Presented oral arguments before the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit

    Defended the Ten Commandments monument on the Texas State Capitol grounds,

    Defended the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools
    Defended the State of Texas against an attempt by the International Court of Justice to re-open the criminal convictions of 51 murderers on death row throughout the United States

    Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission

    Domestic Policy Advisor to U.S. President George W. Bush on the 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign

    Adjunct Professor of Law at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, where he taught U.S. Supreme Court litigation

    Ted Cruz is currently junior US Senator from Texas, defeating Texas Lieutenant Governor David Dewhurst who was heavily favored and backed by the DC old-guard GOP

    Defeated Democrat Paul Sadler in the general election

    Endorsed by The Tea Party and the Republican Liberty Caucus

    AWARDS: "America's Leading Lawyers for Business," Chambers USA (2009 & 2010) "50 Most Influential Minority Lawyers in America," National Law Journal (2008) "25 Greatest Texas Lawyers of the Past Quarter Century," Texas Lawyer (2010) "20 Young Hispanic Americans on the Rise," Newsweek (1999) Traphagen Distinguished Alumnus, Harvard Law School

    On November 14, 2012, Cruz was appointed vice-chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee

    Unlike Obama, Cruz didn't seat in the U.S. Senate and vote "present." He has sponsored 97 bills. Here are a few crucial pieces of legislation sponsored by Cruz:

    ObamaCare Repeal Act

    Prohibit use of drones from killing citizens of the United States within the United States

    Disarm Criminals and Protect Communities Act

    Firearm Straw Purchasing and Trafficking Prevention Act
    Defund Obamacare Act of 2013

    A bill to amend the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 to permit States to require proof of citizenship for registration to vote in elections for Federal office

    A bill to designate the United States courthouse located at 101 East Pecan Street in Sherman, Texas, as the Paul Brown United States Courthouse

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards of up to $5,000,000 for information regarding the attacks on the United States diplomatic mission at Benghazi, Libya that began on September 11, 2012

    State Marriage Defense Act of 2014

    A bill to amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the intentional discrimination of a person or organization by an employee of the Internal Revenue Service

    A bill to prohibit the Department of the Treasury from assigning tax statuses to organizations based on their political beliefs and activities

    American Energy Renaissance Act of 2014

    A bill to deny admission to the United States to any representative to the United Nations who has been found to have been engaged in espionage activities or a terrorist activity against the United States and poses a threat to United States national security interests
    SuperPAC Elimination Act of 2014

    Free All Speech Act of 2014

    Guantanamo Bay Detainee Transfer Suspension Act of 2014

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards totaling up to $5,000,000 for information on the kidnapping and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, a dual United States-Israeli citizen, that began on June 12, 2014

    A bill to prevent the expansion of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program unlawfully created by Executive memorandum on August 15, 2012

    Sanction Iran, Safeguard America Act of 2014

    Expatriate Terrorists Act

    Operation United Assistance Tax Exclusion Act of 2014
  • GuvamintCheeseGuvamintCheese Member Posts: 38,932
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    Lots of Hillary leg humping bitches here
    As always......spot on !
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    Lots of Hillary leg humping bitches here


    As compared to Trump lap nuzzlers?

    Come on, Dennis, there is zero support for Hilary here that I have seen. Rather there are a lot of folks who reject both her and Trump as being worthy of being our President.

    No reason to vote for a big government leftist just to keep another big government leftist out of the White House.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • NOAHNOAH Member Posts: 9,690
    edited November -1
    exactly^^^^^quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    Lots of Hillary leg humping bitches here


    As compared to Trump lap nuzzlers?

    Come on, Dennis, there is zero support for Hilary here that I have seen. Rather there are a lot of folks who reject both her and Trump as being worthy of being our President.

    No reason to vote for a big government leftist just to keep another big government leftist out of the White House.
  • reload999reload999 Member Posts: 3,079 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    We know hitlery would absolutely gut the 2d, so I'll take pretty-much anyone over her.
  • 1911a1-fan1911a1-fan Member Posts: 51,193 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Beeramid
    quote:Originally posted by CaptainCrossman
    quote:
    Who cares, he yells a lot, is really orange, and has a great comb over. ....TURNIP 2016


    and he wins a lot...
    6 states in 2 weeks by 60% landslides
    what did your candidate do ?


    What did turnip do besides paint himself like a naval orange with a bad comb over, and yell a lot?

    Here's a few things Ted Cruz has done.


    Graduated valedictorian in 1988 from Second Baptist High School

    Graduated * laude from Princeton University in 1992

    Graduated magna * laude from Harvard Law School in 1995

    1992 U.S. National Debate Champion representing Princeton

    1995 World Debating Championship semi-finalist representing Harvard

    Served a law clerk to Chief Justice William Rehnquist, making him the first Hispanic ever to clerk for a Chief Justice of the United States

    Served as Solicitor General of Texas from 2003 to 2008, making him the first Hispanic Solicitor General in Texas, the youngest Solicitor General in the entire country and the longest tenure in Texas history

    Partner at the law firm Morgan, Lewis & Bockius, where he led the firm's U.S. Supreme Court and national appellate litigation practice

    Authored over 80 SCOTUS briefs and presented over 40 oral arguments before The Court

    In the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller, Cruz assembled a coalition of 31 states in defense of the principle that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual right to keep and bear arms

    Presented oral arguments before the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit

    Defended the Ten Commandments monument on the Texas State Capitol grounds,

    Defended the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools
    Defended the State of Texas against an attempt by the International Court of Justice to re-open the criminal convictions of 51 murderers on death row throughout the United States

    Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission

    Domestic Policy Advisor to U.S. President George W. Bush on the 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign

    Adjunct Professor of Law at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, where he taught U.S. Supreme Court litigation

    Ted Cruz is currently junior US Senator from Texas, defeating Texas Lieutenant Governor David Dewhurst who was heavily favored and backed by the DC old-guard GOP

    Defeated Democrat Paul Sadler in the general election

    Endorsed by The Tea Party and the Republican Liberty Caucus

    AWARDS: "America's Leading Lawyers for Business," Chambers USA (2009 & 2010) "50 Most Influential Minority Lawyers in America," National Law Journal (2008) "25 Greatest Texas Lawyers of the Past Quarter Century," Texas Lawyer (2010) "20 Young Hispanic Americans on the Rise," Newsweek (1999) Traphagen Distinguished Alumnus, Harvard Law School

    On November 14, 2012, Cruz was appointed vice-chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee

    Unlike Obama, Cruz didn't seat in the U.S. Senate and vote "present." He has sponsored 97 bills. Here are a few crucial pieces of legislation sponsored by Cruz:

    ObamaCare Repeal Act

    Prohibit use of drones from killing citizens of the United States within the United States

    Disarm Criminals and Protect Communities Act

    Firearm Straw Purchasing and Trafficking Prevention Act
    Defund Obamacare Act of 2013

    A bill to amend the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 to permit States to require proof of citizenship for registration to vote in elections for Federal office

    A bill to designate the United States courthouse located at 101 East Pecan Street in Sherman, Texas, as the Paul Brown United States Courthouse

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards of up to $5,000,000 for information regarding the attacks on the United States diplomatic mission at Benghazi, Libya that began on September 11, 2012

    State Marriage Defense Act of 2014

    A bill to amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the intentional discrimination of a person or organization by an employee of the Internal Revenue Service

    A bill to prohibit the Department of the Treasury from assigning tax statuses to organizations based on their political beliefs and activities

    American Energy Renaissance Act of 2014

    A bill to deny admission to the United States to any representative to the United Nations who has been found to have been engaged in espionage activities or a terrorist activity against the United States and poses a threat to United States national security interests
    SuperPAC Elimination Act of 2014

    Free All Speech Act of 2014

    Guantanamo Bay Detainee Transfer Suspension Act of 2014

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards totaling up to $5,000,000 for information on the kidnapping and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, a dual United States-Israeli citizen, that began on June 12, 2014

    A bill to prevent the expansion of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program unlawfully created by Executive memorandum on August 15, 2012

    Sanction Iran, Safeguard America Act of 2014

    Expatriate Terrorists Act

    Operation United Assistance Tax Exclusion Act of 2014






    just like any other career politicians resume

    how about listing his failures, they all have them is goes with the job


    obomo had a good resume, including harvard law school
  • WulfmannWulfmann Member Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Beeramid

    What did turnip do besides paint himself like a naval orange with a bad comb over, and yell a lot?

    Here's a few things Ted Cruz has done.


    Graduated valedictorian in 1988 from Second Baptist High School

    Graduated * laude from Princeton University in 1992

    Graduated magna * laude from Harvard Law School in 1995

    1992 U.S. National Debate Champion representing Princeton

    1995 World Debating Championship semi-finalist representing Harvard

    Served a law clerk to Chief Justice William Rehnquist, making him the first Hispanic ever to clerk for a Chief Justice of the United States

    Served as Solicitor General of Texas from 2003 to 2008, making him the first Hispanic Solicitor General in Texas, the youngest Solicitor General in the entire country and the longest tenure in Texas history

    Partner at the law firm Morgan, Lewis & Bockius, where he led the firm's U.S. Supreme Court and national appellate litigation practice

    Authored over 80 SCOTUS briefs and presented over 40 oral arguments before The Court

    In the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller, Cruz assembled a coalition of 31 states in defense of the principle that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual right to keep and bear arms

    Presented oral arguments before the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit

    Defended the Ten Commandments monument on the Texas State Capitol grounds,

    Defended the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools
    Defended the State of Texas against an attempt by the International Court of Justice to re-open the criminal convictions of 51 murderers on death row throughout the United States

    Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission

    Domestic Policy Advisor to U.S. President George W. Bush on the 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign

    Adjunct Professor of Law at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, where he taught U.S. Supreme Court litigation

    Ted Cruz is currently junior US Senator from Texas, defeating Texas Lieutenant Governor David Dewhurst who was heavily favored and backed by the DC old-guard GOP

    Defeated Democrat Paul Sadler in the general election

    Endorsed by The Tea Party and the Republican Liberty Caucus

    AWARDS: "America's Leading Lawyers for Business," Chambers USA (2009 & 2010) "50 Most Influential Minority Lawyers in America," National Law Journal (2008) "25 Greatest Texas Lawyers of the Past Quarter Century," Texas Lawyer (2010) "20 Young Hispanic Americans on the Rise," Newsweek (1999) Traphagen Distinguished Alumnus, Harvard Law School

    On November 14, 2012, Cruz was appointed vice-chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee

    Unlike Obama, Cruz didn't seat in the U.S. Senate and vote "present." He has sponsored 97 bills. Here are a few crucial pieces of legislation sponsored by Cruz:

    ObamaCare Repeal Act

    Prohibit use of drones from killing citizens of the United States within the United States

    Disarm Criminals and Protect Communities Act

    Firearm Straw Purchasing and Trafficking Prevention Act
    Defund Obamacare Act of 2013

    A bill to amend the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 to permit States to require proof of citizenship for registration to vote in elections for Federal office

    A bill to designate the United States courthouse located at 101 East Pecan Street in Sherman, Texas, as the Paul Brown United States Courthouse

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards of up to $5,000,000 for information regarding the attacks on the United States diplomatic mission at Benghazi, Libya that began on September 11, 2012

    State Marriage Defense Act of 2014

    A bill to amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the intentional discrimination of a person or organization by an employee of the Internal Revenue Service

    A bill to prohibit the Department of the Treasury from assigning tax statuses to organizations based on their political beliefs and activities

    American Energy Renaissance Act of 2014

    A bill to deny admission to the United States to any representative to the United Nations who has been found to have been engaged in espionage activities or a terrorist activity against the United States and poses a threat to United States national security interests
    SuperPAC Elimination Act of 2014

    Free All Speech Act of 2014

    Guantanamo Bay Detainee Transfer Suspension Act of 2014

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards totaling up to $5,000,000 for information on the kidnapping and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, a dual United States-Israeli citizen, that began on June 12, 2014

    A bill to prevent the expansion of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program unlawfully created by Executive memorandum on August 15, 2012

    Sanction Iran, Safeguard America Act of 2014

    Expatriate Terrorists Act

    Operation United Assistance Tax Exclusion Act of 2014


    You forgot to mention another thing Cruz has done:

    He received millions fewer votes than Trump.

    So, I guess what you really saying is the voters should have no say in who becomes the republican nominee? (BTW, I voted for Cruz in the Florida primary)
    3YUCmbB.jpg
    "Fools learn from their own mistakes. I learn from the mistakes of others"
    Otto von Bismarck
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Wulfmann
    quote:Originally posted by Beeramid

    What did turnip do besides paint himself like a naval orange with a bad comb over, and yell a lot?

    Here's a few things Ted Cruz has done.


    Graduated valedictorian in 1988 from Second Baptist High School

    Graduated * laude from Princeton University in 1992

    Graduated magna * laude from Harvard Law School in 1995

    1992 U.S. National Debate Champion representing Princeton

    1995 World Debating Championship semi-finalist representing Harvard

    Served a law clerk to Chief Justice William Rehnquist, making him the first Hispanic ever to clerk for a Chief Justice of the United States

    Served as Solicitor General of Texas from 2003 to 2008, making him the first Hispanic Solicitor General in Texas, the youngest Solicitor General in the entire country and the longest tenure in Texas history

    Partner at the law firm Morgan, Lewis & Bockius, where he led the firm's U.S. Supreme Court and national appellate litigation practice

    Authored over 80 SCOTUS briefs and presented over 40 oral arguments before The Court

    In the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller, Cruz assembled a coalition of 31 states in defense of the principle that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual right to keep and bear arms

    Presented oral arguments before the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit

    Defended the Ten Commandments monument on the Texas State Capitol grounds,

    Defended the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools
    Defended the State of Texas against an attempt by the International Court of Justice to re-open the criminal convictions of 51 murderers on death row throughout the United States

    Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission

    Domestic Policy Advisor to U.S. President George W. Bush on the 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign

    Adjunct Professor of Law at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, where he taught U.S. Supreme Court litigation

    Ted Cruz is currently junior US Senator from Texas, defeating Texas Lieutenant Governor David Dewhurst who was heavily favored and backed by the DC old-guard GOP

    Defeated Democrat Paul Sadler in the general election

    Endorsed by The Tea Party and the Republican Liberty Caucus

    AWARDS: "America's Leading Lawyers for Business," Chambers USA (2009 & 2010) "50 Most Influential Minority Lawyers in America," National Law Journal (2008) "25 Greatest Texas Lawyers of the Past Quarter Century," Texas Lawyer (2010) "20 Young Hispanic Americans on the Rise," Newsweek (1999) Traphagen Distinguished Alumnus, Harvard Law School

    On November 14, 2012, Cruz was appointed vice-chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee

    Unlike Obama, Cruz didn't seat in the U.S. Senate and vote "present." He has sponsored 97 bills. Here are a few crucial pieces of legislation sponsored by Cruz:

    ObamaCare Repeal Act

    Prohibit use of drones from killing citizens of the United States within the United States

    Disarm Criminals and Protect Communities Act

    Firearm Straw Purchasing and Trafficking Prevention Act
    Defund Obamacare Act of 2013

    A bill to amend the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 to permit States to require proof of citizenship for registration to vote in elections for Federal office

    A bill to designate the United States courthouse located at 101 East Pecan Street in Sherman, Texas, as the Paul Brown United States Courthouse

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards of up to $5,000,000 for information regarding the attacks on the United States diplomatic mission at Benghazi, Libya that began on September 11, 2012

    State Marriage Defense Act of 2014

    A bill to amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the intentional discrimination of a person or organization by an employee of the Internal Revenue Service

    A bill to prohibit the Department of the Treasury from assigning tax statuses to organizations based on their political beliefs and activities

    American Energy Renaissance Act of 2014

    A bill to deny admission to the United States to any representative to the United Nations who has been found to have been engaged in espionage activities or a terrorist activity against the United States and poses a threat to United States national security interests
    SuperPAC Elimination Act of 2014

    Free All Speech Act of 2014

    Guantanamo Bay Detainee Transfer Suspension Act of 2014

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards totaling up to $5,000,000 for information on the kidnapping and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, a dual United States-Israeli citizen, that began on June 12, 2014

    A bill to prevent the expansion of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program unlawfully created by Executive memorandum on August 15, 2012

    Sanction Iran, Safeguard America Act of 2014

    Expatriate Terrorists Act

    Operation United Assistance Tax Exclusion Act of 2014


    You forgot to mention another thing Cruz has done:

    He received millions fewer votes than Trump.

    So, I guess what you really saying is the voters should have no say in who becomes the republican nominee? (BTW, I voted for Cruz in the Florida primary)


    The party uses the primary system to gauge who party members believe will be the best representative of their party in the general election. If Sanders had run as a Republican and got the most votes, should the GOP accept him as their standard bearer?

    Trump keeps bragging how he has been supported by non Republicans like it is a good thing. What it has done, is corrupt the process by giving a result that does not necessarily reflect the will of the party. Wether one agrees with it or not, a majority support of non-republicans in a Republican primary car and perhaps should be ignored, particularly if the candidate does not support the traditional party platform.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • pip5255pip5255 Member Posts: 1,629 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Beeramid
    quote:Originally posted by CaptainCrossman
    quote:
    Who cares, he yells a lot, is really orange, and has a great comb over. ....TURNIP 2016


    and he wins a lot...
    6 states in 2 weeks by 60% landslides
    what did your candidate do ?


    What did turnip do besides paint himself like a naval orange with a bad comb over, and yell a lot?

    Here's a few things Ted Cruz has done.


    Graduated valedictorian in 1988 from Second Baptist High School

    Graduated * laude from Princeton University in 1992

    Graduated magna * laude from Harvard Law School in 1995

    1992 U.S. National Debate Champion representing Princeton

    1995 World Debating Championship semi-finalist representing Harvard

    Served a law clerk to Chief Justice William Rehnquist, making him the first Hispanic ever to clerk for a Chief Justice of the United States

    Served as Solicitor General of Texas from 2003 to 2008, making him the first Hispanic Solicitor General in Texas, the youngest Solicitor General in the entire country and the longest tenure in Texas history

    Partner at the law firm Morgan, Lewis & Bockius, where he led the firm's U.S. Supreme Court and national appellate litigation practice

    Authored over 80 SCOTUS briefs and presented over 40 oral arguments before The Court

    In the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller, Cruz assembled a coalition of 31 states in defense of the principle that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual right to keep and bear arms

    Presented oral arguments before the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit

    Defended the Ten Commandments monument on the Texas State Capitol grounds,

    Defended the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools
    Defended the State of Texas against an attempt by the International Court of Justice to re-open the criminal convictions of 51 murderers on death row throughout the United States

    Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission

    Domestic Policy Advisor to U.S. President George W. Bush on the 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign

    Adjunct Professor of Law at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, where he taught U.S. Supreme Court litigation

    Ted Cruz is currently junior US Senator from Texas, defeating Texas Lieutenant Governor David Dewhurst who was heavily favored and backed by the DC old-guard GOP

    Defeated Democrat Paul Sadler in the general election

    Endorsed by The Tea Party and the Republican Liberty Caucus

    AWARDS: "America's Leading Lawyers for Business," Chambers USA (2009 & 2010) "50 Most Influential Minority Lawyers in America," National Law Journal (2008) "25 Greatest Texas Lawyers of the Past Quarter Century," Texas Lawyer (2010) "20 Young Hispanic Americans on the Rise," Newsweek (1999) Traphagen Distinguished Alumnus, Harvard Law School

    On November 14, 2012, Cruz was appointed vice-chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee

    Unlike Obama, Cruz didn't seat in the U.S. Senate and vote "present." He has sponsored 97 bills. Here are a few crucial pieces of legislation sponsored by Cruz:

    ObamaCare Repeal Act

    Prohibit use of drones from killing citizens of the United States within the United States

    Disarm Criminals and Protect Communities Act

    Firearm Straw Purchasing and Trafficking Prevention Act
    Defund Obamacare Act of 2013

    A bill to amend the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 to permit States to require proof of citizenship for registration to vote in elections for Federal office

    A bill to designate the United States courthouse located at 101 East Pecan Street in Sherman, Texas, as the Paul Brown United States Courthouse

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards of up to $5,000,000 for information regarding the attacks on the United States diplomatic mission at Benghazi, Libya that began on September 11, 2012

    State Marriage Defense Act of 2014

    A bill to amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the intentional discrimination of a person or organization by an employee of the Internal Revenue Service

    A bill to prohibit the Department of the Treasury from assigning tax statuses to organizations based on their political beliefs and activities

    American Energy Renaissance Act of 2014

    A bill to deny admission to the United States to any representative to the United Nations who has been found to have been engaged in espionage activities or a terrorist activity against the United States and poses a threat to United States national security interests
    SuperPAC Elimination Act of 2014

    Free All Speech Act of 2014

    Guantanamo Bay Detainee Transfer Suspension Act of 2014

    A bill to require the Secretary of State to offer rewards totaling up to $5,000,000 for information on the kidnapping and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, a dual United States-Israeli citizen, that began on June 12, 2014

    A bill to prevent the expansion of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program unlawfully created by Executive memorandum on August 15, 2012

    Sanction Iran, Safeguard America Act of 2014

    Expatriate Terrorists Act

    Operation United Assistance Tax Exclusion Act of 2014




    my only problem is I don't like Cruz and since Trump has been my guy since the beginning then he has my vote period...................
    just because you could doesn't mean you should
  • topdadtopdad Member Posts: 3,408 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dennisnielsen
    The bass turds will get Hillary voted in

    And then when she guts the 2nd amd. They'll * about how the NRA has let them down again.[xx(]
  • allen griggsallen griggs Member Posts: 35,183 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It has come down to Trump or Hillary.
    How can anybody say they will not support either one?
    Trump isn't perfect and I dislike much about him. But, if you don't vote for him, you cast half a vote for Hillary.
    Are you kidding me?

    Your perfect libertarian candidate may be out there, but he didn't make the World Series this year.
  • select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,453 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by allen griggs
    It has come down to Trump or Hillary.
    How can anybody say they will not support either one?
    Trump isn't perfect and I dislike much about him. But, if you don't vote for him, you cast half a vote for Hillary.
    Are you kidding me?

    Your perfect libertarian candidate may be out there, but he didn't make the World Series this year.


    Sad folks are so narrow minded their only consideration is the 2nd amendment on their decisions. The democrat nominee failed at her secretary of state position.. failed miserably.. How the hell do you THINK she could even handle a higher position?
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    So, Trump supporters and detractors alike are not happy with the current two party system.

    The majority on both sides of this fence seem to believe they are trapped within this broken system.

    Currently, the Libertarian Party candidate is polling a 11% nationally, when included in a Trump - Hilary - Johnson comparison. This is up by a factor of 10 from just 4 years ago.

    If you are fed up with the two-party cabal, and are actually looking for a new direction for this country, 2016 may be the year to stick it to both the GOP and the Democrats and let them know that the growing Liberty movement is something that should be taken seriously.

    Hitching your wagon to a woman who has been part of the problem for over 20 years, or a man who has bragged about being part of the establishment who worked within our corrupted system seems to be an odd way to express one's dissatisfaction with that system.

    If you are stuck in the morass of 'Social Conservatism' whereby you want the Federal Government to exceed its Constitutional restraints through the legislation of social norms, you obviously cannot be a fan of either Clinton of Trump, so why not get past the labels and look at what true Liberty can be?

    If you actually want a fiscally limited Federal Government that works within the constraints of the Constitution, you again cannot support the big Government decrees and positions advocated by Clinton and Trump.

    So why pretend that either of the front runners offers anything different than more of the same?

    If we start from a position of Constitutional adherence with a co-equal respect for the rights and freedoms of the individual, it is obvious that both Clinton and Trump are not to be considered.

    Gary Johnson is as imperfect a human being as are we all, but it is impossible to ignore his record of respect for the limitation of the Constitution, and his respect for the rights and freedoms of the individual that are inherent as expressed in our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution.

    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country. Johnson is not a savior - far from it - but the work towards establishing the viability of a third party is our only hope to break the power of the two major parties and eventually moving this already Great Country back to when it was even greater.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • reload999reload999 Member Posts: 3,079 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.
  • Rack OpsRack Ops Member Posts: 18,597 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus

    Trump keeps bragging how he has been supported by non Republicans like it is a good thing. What it has done, is corrupt the process by giving a result that does not necessarily reflect the will of the party. Wether one agrees with it or not, a majority support of non-republicans in a Republican primary car and perhaps should be ignored, particularly if the candidate does not support the traditional party platform.


    I find it difficult to believe this is the position you would be taking if Ron Paul was the presumptive nominee.


    And if it really is your position, why bother to have a primary at all? We could have save ourselves lots of trouble just by naming Jeb! the nominee right off the bat and rallying around him.
  • topdadtopdad Member Posts: 3,408 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I guess it boils down to one of two things. Either you see our path coming to a fork in the road, and although neither way seems great
    you're going to vote for the path that looks the least destructive to the country. Or on the other hand, you're going to vote for what makes you feel good even though the fork only goes two ways, or just sit down on the trail and * because we're not getting anywhere.
    PS. and the damn NRA wont do anything about it.[xx(]
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Rack Ops
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus

    Trump keeps bragging how he has been supported by non Republicans like it is a good thing. What it has done, is corrupt the process by giving a result that does not necessarily reflect the will of the party. Wether one agrees with it or not, a majority support of non-republicans in a Republican primary car and perhaps should be ignored, particularly if the candidate does not support the traditional party platform.


    I find it difficult to believe this is the position you would be taking if Ron Paul was the presumptive nominee.


    And if it really is your position, why bother to have a primary at all? We could have save ourselves lots of trouble just by naming Jeb! the nominee right off the bat and rallying around him.


    If I believed the presumptive nominee would respect the Constitution and believed in a Constitutionally limited Federal Government, it would be a different story, and I would probably support him, regardless of who he was.

    This is not the case today. The people voted for candidates who advocated extra-constitutional positions in every election cycle in recent memory, and we are then stuck with them when the actual voting takes place in November. There is nothing legally binding about a primary election vote, and a party should retain the power to select who is to be their standard bearer, particularly when many of the votes and being placed by people that have never been and are not even now members of the party.

    The primaries, as it seems many people are just figuring out, are where the party selects who it wants to represent it in the general. Primary votes do not matter in that sense, and suggesting they should ignores the very reason for the existance of a party and a party platform. Insisting that primary votes be legally binding sets up a scenario whereby 20% of the voting public can dictate who is going to voted upon for President.

    One needs to ask if an uninformed 20% is really that much better than the party bosses of old. They might be, but given the last few cycles, there is room for doubt.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,184 ******
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    If you are so concerned about these votes "taking away from the GOP candidate" then maybe you should pressure the GOP to proffer a candidate that supports liberty and freedom. Until you do, you're part of the problem with the GOP.
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • 4205raymond4205raymond Member Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by select-fire
    quote:Originally posted by allen griggs
    It has come down to Trump or Hillary.
    How can anybody say they will not support either one?
    Trump isn't perfect and I dislike much about him. But, if you don't vote for him, you cast half a vote for Hillary.
    Are you kidding me?

    Your perfect libertarian candidate may be out there, but he didn't make the World Series this year.


    Sad folks are so narrow minded their only consideration is the 2nd amendment on their decisions. The democrat nominee failed at her secretary of state position.. failed miserably.. How the hell do you THINK she could even handle a higher position?
    +1 Yes, Sad that it has come to this.Without the Second Amendment, there can be no "Bill of Rights." My forefathers in Va.(Mother of Presidents)wrote often of the "Individual Right to Keep and Bear Arms." Too late for me to change now,their blood is in my veins.PROUD NATIVE SON OF VIRGINIA.
  • reload999reload999 Member Posts: 3,079 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I never said I was "so concerned" over it; I was just stating what I believe to be facts...The fact is that either a democrap or a republican will win, and voting for the libertarian, even when that party more accurately reflects our beliefs, only serves to strengthen the position of the democrap against the only viable opposition.

    Since the democrap is likely to be more opposed to our views than even a crappy republican choice would be, it makes no sense (to me) to vote for someone who will not win.

    I don't need you to tell me what I should do, and I really don't much care whether you think I am "part of the problem with the GOP" whatever that's supposed to mean. quote:Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    If you are so concerned about these votes "taking away from the GOP candidate" then maybe you should pressure the GOP to proffer a candidate that supports liberty and freedom. Until you do, you're part of the problem with the GOP.
  • GuvamintCheeseGuvamintCheese Member Posts: 38,932
    edited November -1
    Trump or Cruz lets get it over with and concentrate on defeating the democrat. Cruz reminds me of a snake oil salesman and trump reminds me of someone that will probably try and fix the mess.
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.



    If you truly believe that Trump is going to be a good President, by all means vote for him. I believe he would be a poor President; one would by his very words does not believe in Constitutional limitation upon Government, and by his deeds has proven to be part of the corruption that is our politics today. If you really want your grandchildren to be faced with the same failed candidates that the GOP and Democrats have presented year after year, by all means rally the troops behind Trump and be happy with the further degradation of your liberties and the further entrenchment of big government.

    If you are in it for today and next year, maybe Trump would be better than Hilary. Time will tell.

    If you are in it for your children and grandchildren, I suggest that it is time to support something outside the current power structure, accepting that in the short term we may suffer a little in the hopes that our grandchildren suffer less.

    I personally have a problem with candidates who ignore and belittle through advocacy that which is enshrined in our Constitution. Doesn't really matter whether it is a Republican named Trump or a Democrat named Clinton. Supporting a candidate who advocates for extra-Constitutional actions is supporting the degradation of the Constitution, even if you agree with the position.

    Just food for thought.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,184 ******
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I never said I was "so concerned" over it; I was just stating what I believe to be facts...The fact is that either a democrap or a republican will win, and voting for the libertarian, even when that party more accurately reflects our beliefs, only serves to strengthen the position of the democrap against the only viable opposition.

    Since the democrap is likely to be more opposed to our views than even a crappy republican choice would be, it makes no sense (to me) to vote for someone who will not win.

    I don't need you to tell me what I should do, and I really don't much care whether you think I am "part of the problem with the GOP" whatever that's supposed to mean. quote:Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    If you are so concerned about these votes "taking away from the GOP candidate" then maybe you should pressure the GOP to proffer a candidate that supports liberty and freedom. Until you do, you're part of the problem with the GOP.

    Ok, so then please clarify your position: are you not a voting republican that will support whichever candidate the GOP puts forth or what? Because you don't seem to be liberty minded and you don't appear to be helping to improve the system. Or are you just one of those who truly thinks that Trump would be a great president that thinks everything is fine and dandy?
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • reload999reload999 Member Posts: 3,079 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I guess we must all just depend upon you alone to be liberty minded and to improve the system.quote:Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I never said I was "so concerned" over it; I was just stating what I believe to be facts...The fact is that either a democrap or a republican will win, and voting for the libertarian, even when that party more accurately reflects our beliefs, only serves to strengthen the position of the democrap against the only viable opposition.

    Since the democrap is likely to be more opposed to our views than even a crappy republican choice would be, it makes no sense (to me) to vote for someone who will not win.

    I don't need you to tell me what I should do, and I really don't much care whether you think I am "part of the problem with the GOP" whatever that's supposed to mean. quote:Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    If you are so concerned about these votes "taking away from the GOP candidate" then maybe you should pressure the GOP to proffer a candidate that supports liberty and freedom. Until you do, you're part of the problem with the GOP.

    Ok, so then please clarify your position: are you not a voting republican that will support whichever candidate the GOP puts forth or what? Because you don't seem to be liberty minded and you don't appear to be helping to improve the system. Or are you just one of those who truly thinks that Trump would be a great president that thinks everything is fine and dandy?
  • GuvamintCheeseGuvamintCheese Member Posts: 38,932
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    by all means rally the troops behind Trump and be happy with the further degradation of your liberties and the further entrenchment of big government

    This is where your argument loses all credibility, at least with me. You talk about what he is going to do like you really know, and the truth is you have no clue if he is going to try to further degrade this country, in a way I think that's just what you want so you can say "See, I told you he was _________(fill in the blank).

    I do however believe that you have convinced yourself that you are right, so what is the real use of a debate?
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,184 ******
    edited November -1
    I have never known a candidate to deviate significantly from their historical record in a mode that was more favorable to constitutional freedom. Can you point to such an individual? Why start from a vantage that includes a history that already disparages it? Nonsensical if you ask me.
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • reload999reload999 Member Posts: 3,079 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I don't particularly want Trump or Cruze, but like I said before, the new prez will be either a "D" or an "R"." This is a FACT!

    I cannot argue with the desire to vote "L" in an effort to foster liberty, but the fact (as I see it) is that this country will not elect a "L," and another "D" will probably be the final nail in the coffin of any degree of liberty (if it isn't already too late) so I will vote for the "R," whomever it is.
  • casper1947casper1947 Member Posts: 1,147 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Does anyone recall what the original topic was........oh ya "Trump releases his 2nd amendment stance"
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,460 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by GuvamintCheese
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by reload999
    I respectfully disagree and submit that a vote for Johnson is nothing more than a vote for Hitlery, because Johnson (or any other "L") cannot and will not win, and voting for the loser in this way helps no one but the "D."

    The "L" ls relevant only to the extent to which he siphons votes away from the "R" candidate, thereby tipping the scale toward the "D" candidate. As one who leans more toward "L" than "R", I don't like it, but these are the cold hard facts as I see them. The deck is stacked against us and we have 2 choices..."R" or the dreaded "D." quote:Originally posted by Don McManus


    You can wring your hands and pretend that a vote for Johnson is like a vote for Hilary, but it is, in fact, a vote for your children, grandchildren and the future of this country.

    by all means rally the troops behind Trump and be happy with the further degradation of your liberties and the further entrenchment of big government

    This is where your argument loses all credibility, at least with me. You talk about what he is going to do like you really know, and the truth is you have no clue if he is going to try to further degrade this country, in a way I think that's just what you want so you can say "See, I told you he was _________(fill in the blank).

    I do however believe that you have convinced yourself that you are right, so what is the real use of a debate?


    I am just taking Trump at his word, Mr. Cheese. I don't believe Trump will try to degrade this country at all, and have never stated such a silly thing. I do believe, from his words, that he does not have a strong belief in the Constitutional limitations place upon the Federal Government and that he does not believe in the individual liberties and freedoms those limitations protect.

    If you don't wish to consider such a possibility, so be it. There is nothing Trump has ever stated that suggests to me he understands or even has read Article 1, Section 8 of the U.S. Constitution, or the Bill of Rights for that matter. Not sure what your criteria are for a President, but I would think a good place to start is to have one who at least understands what he is affirming while take his oath of office.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,184 ******
    edited November -1
    How an independent vote gets counted (for the bad at math):

    GOP (Trump?): 0
    DEM (Clinton?): 0
    Indep (Johnson?): 1


    Now, I went to public school so I may be bad at counting, but if you can, from those numbers explain to me how a Democrat gets a single vote from me, if I vote independent. I will be glad to have the correction.
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • rambo rebelrambo rebel Member Posts: 4,028
    edited November -1
    I think you trump haters are really latent anti ginger comb over haters. I think they need their on bathroom.
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