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Feeding deer is considered baiting--unless your job is with the state agency. Wildlife is under a lot a pressure because they are losing habitat and that means food. That's why wildlife not normally seen in cities and on highways are there. They may have found a source of food (like garbage, pet food left out, etc). They aren't really wild any more. Like shooting a neighbors dog. Day or night feeding doesn't mean anything--they move to a known food source when they are hungry. Just like you. [:D]
FYI--Colo Law is the following: "Use dogs or bait to hunt bear deer pronghorn or moose. Bait means to put, expose, distribute or scatter salt, minerals, grain, animal parts or other food as an attraction for big game. Scent sticks that smell like food are illegal for bears"
Some hunters unfairly take advantage of artificial feeding to establish a pattern attracting deer to an area they have "staked out". When the deer shows up the lazy gunner pops it and the real hunters are screwed wondering where the game is.
Some small game (furbearers) can be baited because they are usually trapped, not shot.
Most states do have a point system impacting whether you qualify for a license. Similar to the system used on drivers licenses but the total points allowed vary. Poaching is usually the max. Hunting under the influence is another.
Easiest thing is to contact your Dept. of Wildlife or whoever issues licences (not Walmart but the State agency). Sometimes it takes a little digging to learn how many points are allowed--or even what is considered a no-no.
Finally, the Feds have forced States to take your SS number. Part of the child support enforcement program. They don't want a child to go unsupported or tax supported while a parent is out fishing.
In Colo the DOW is totally self supporting through license fees and some other little things they call habitat stamps. It was around $70 million last year. Enough? Tyr
Aren't deer urine and clanking antlers together still legal? Aren't they methods of BAITING deer to your position? What's the definition of baiting anyway?
I understand there has to be regulations in hunting and wildlife preservation, but come on...feeding the deer on your property doesn't sound like a form of domestic terrorism to me.
But then again we all need to watch out for that guy that feeds the deer. he must be some sort of anarchist exploiting nature to his perverted desires. On top of that, HE HAS GUNS. We really need to inconvenience him today.
I personally like to feed pigeons at the park on Sundays before Church..OH NO!! I hear them coming for me!!!
Good luck with your tickets. Tell the judge it was an accident and you were just trying to make lush compost for your new flower bed of Pansies you're putting in, and the deer came and ate it.
He will forgive you.
Antlers are OK (not many really know how) and urine, camo, tree stands, etc. are usually accepted in most states.
The way to wrap your head around this is to remember that we a talking about wildlife--emphasis on wild.
Nobody is saying you have to be wearing clothing that will make you stand out from mother nature, bang on a cow bell, and sing. Baiting with food is entirely different especially considering the loss of habitat that takes the "wild" out of wildlife.
If you don't want to hunt why not plug ole bessie grazing on your neighbors property. Because you would be "taking" something that belongs to your neighbor--and go to jail.
Wildlife don't belong to a property owner because thay step across an invisible property line, or fly over it during migration. They belong to the state and most states manage wildlife to accomplish a number of things. One is revenue from licenses. Out of state hunters pay more, eat in restaurants, gas up, stay in motels, and spend money doing other things in the state. All those restaurants, gas stations, motels, etc. depend on the revenue.
Most Depts of Wildlife are not tax supported. Those that want to participate (under the rules) pay--otherwise, it's no burden on you.
We used to have herds of buffalo that were practically killed off because there were no limits. Don't repeat that mistake or get so whacked to call it domestic terrorism. Stick to the issue.
Gun use is promoted by wildlife departments because it brings people to the state for hunting. All those that benefit from dollars spent would be pretty stupid if they were anti gun because business would shrivle up and THEY couldn't go to Disneyland (they won't find me there--I took my kid out of school (gasp) to hunt deer and live in the woods.
I wondered who kept feeding those pigeons that dumped all over the walk into the church. FYI I worked in a little town where they wanted to plink them off the church roof with a .22--so a state trooper got permission to shoot within city limits and never broke a tile on the roof.
addpillz--nyforester defended himself and the whole thing was finished Decembr 5th. Might want to update yourself.
My bad, must have missed that post. I fully agree with you Tyr, I was just posing the question "What is the definition of 'Baiting'"? I ask this because "baiting" can come in many different forms other then using food as you made clear in your previous post. I know in South Carolina the DNR states: In Game Zones 1 and 2 it is unlawful to pursue deer with dogs, and it is unlawful to bait for deer (50-11-310). I think lawmakers need to be more critical in the description of their laws.
I don't agree with using food to bait critters to me for me to gun down. I agree wildlife must be preserved for future generations and preservation laws must be followed. I just can't believe two ECO officers can ticket a guy on secondary evidence from a neighbor. Then again he did admit to feeding them. They should have just issued him a warning. I think they should be putting their priorities on pollution and litter other then some guy feeding deer. Congrats on the low ticket though, it could have been worst.
Ny - our once great nation is going down the tubes because we the people have not demanded our leaders be bound by the constitution like our forefathers did. Those ECO's probable were trespassing our your property, and even if they weren't they still committed a 4th amendment violation of illegal search of your vehicle. Now you can file a petition (sue) them for violating your U.S. Constitutional rights, and in the process teach them about Constitutional law. They will have to hire an attorney and defend against your allegations. The judge if he does not see it your way and dismiss the charges, as well as the prosecutor, you can also name them in the suit for vacation or your rights, and the judge (42 USC 1986 for failure to correct a wrong), and numerous other charges. It could get sticky for them especially if you have a good attorney that also loves the outdoors and hunting. I'm not in New York but in Missouri I do it just to prove a point that the Constitution should still prevail.
I have met too many tyrants sitting on judicial benches or in the prosecutors offices. I guess that is why our forefathers gave us a remedy for that situation.
"The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and the blood of tyrants." Thomas Jefferson
"Each time a person stands up for an ideal or acts to improve the lot of others....they send forth a ripple of hope, and crossing each other from a million different centres of energy and daring, those ripples build a current that can sweep down the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance." Robert F. Kennedy
"[L]et there be no change [in Constitutional powers] by usurpation; for though this, in one instance, may be the instrument of good, it is the customary weapon by which free governments are destroyed." -George Washington
"There is no crueler tyranny than that which is exercised under cover of law, and with the colors of justice .." United States vs Jannottie, 673 F.2d 578, 614 (ed Cir. 1982)
I believe Thomas Jefferson is right, it is now time for the Tree of liberty to be refreshed! Where the people stand together - they are the law, regardless what is written on the lawbooks.
Platinum01w--Quite a screen name you have there. Those quotes are pretty impressive. Maybe I might borrow one--if that's OK.
It is too bad that things have progressed/regressed the way they have. Too many people have become urbanized and the thought of meat is limited to a grocery store and roughing it means spending the night in a motel.
I doubt whether we locked the door much growing up. As cops we BS'd about nailing a burglary or robbery in progress. Fact is, it took minutes to respond when seconds counted. I now have bars and locks everywhere--good thing I learned to weld.
Some progress is being made. More than half of the states have procedures for people to get CCW's. Considering the "drive by gang banger shootings" (more of that progress) I like the idea of being able to shoot back--its a deterrent also.
The US Supreme court finally interpreted that the 2nd Amend applied to individuals--not a militia. The case was in DC so it should be interesting if it applies in states (probably take an incident from a state that gets appealled to the Supreme court to find out)
Some stretches of water around here (Colorado) prohibit bait--must be artificial lures. So feeding fish is also restricted.
lordmegatron--I always wear my daylight fluorescent orange. When I hunted during the regular rifle season there were so many people out there (some known to make "sound shots") I didn't want to get blown away by some itcy trigger finger. Muzzleloading was the way to cut back the number of people.
I called our Dept of Wildlife (DOW) a few days ago and asked if there was any way for them to search a vehicle without a warrant (which means probable cause) He said no, all the constitutional restrictions applied to them too. I would take that with a grain of salt--and look at the fine print on a license application--you might waive some rights by getting a license.
I've been stopped just driving down a 4X4 road by wildlife officers. A cop on a city street needs more PC to stop you but it happens all the time. We were in a National Forest, it was hunting season, and everyone in the cab was wearing orange--I think that was the difference. They saw muzzleloaders in the window rack and wanted to check them to see if the caps were off (defined as being unloaded).
There was no place to hide game out of sight except my side tool boxes but nobody demanded that I unlock them. If they had I would have refused. I never have seen a cop ask for permission to search something and then give the old TV line, "If you have nothing to hide what difference does it make". I would say, "no comment, read the Constitution". But then I'm generally pretty ornery anyway.
addpillz--I was probably the king of warnings-written or verbal. Got chewed out regularly for it. Different philosophies I guess. Sometime if I had to write a ticket I would tell them how they could plea bargin it down unless they had so much money or were making enough that going to court wasn't reasonable.
Being a good hunter is a year round thing for me. Practice at the range, made my own down bag, and just found an Army tent that needs poles I'd like to try out. Then I'm always scouting areas in the summer that might be good to hunt--if they are next to a stream big enough to go fishing it just makes my day. (Colo has a "make my day law" after Clint Eastwood said that in a movie) I'll tell you about it some other time. Tyr
In NY it is illegal to feed the deer even outside of hunting season. Feeding wildlife is one offense, hunting over bait is another offense, and what I hear they do is they wait until 4:38 when sunset is legally 4:37 and bust you for poaching or hunting after legal hours. Planting a foot plot is perfectly legal, picking the corn from your plot and leaving the ears scattered on the ground is baiting. The problem with feeding deer is they eat so much it gets expensive.
Michigan just this year made baiting deer illegal because 1 or 2 deer in a private herd had CWD. They immediatly began issuing tickets to people who did not tear down their feeders a friend of mine got one within 36 hours of the law passing. He unfortunately was already on their radar from an earlier issue. As for being made to unload a sidearm if you are carring under CCW conditions in Michigan they cant even search you or your vehicle for the weapon you just have notify them you are carring and present your CCW. as for the DEQ (Department of Enviromental Quality) they must follow the law too. If your on the level your ok if not say goodbye to guns,vehicles,property,and your hunting rights.
Mike--Each state has variations in its laws--including CCW. For instance in CO there is no requirement that someone with a CCW permit notify cops they have a weapon. There is no restriction on carrying into a bar here either.
You may have heard about the Hells Angel getting shot after starting a fight with some off duty copys in a bar in Stugis. The local cops and the DA filed charges against the off duty cops (also bikers) because a CCW can't carry in a bar there. But the case was overturned because the cops (out of state) are exempt due to a federal law passed about 2005.(LEOSA)
Everyone is not equal in all things. You may have an opinion about a subject but it is not equal to that rendered by a court recognized expert.
A true hunter buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
If you are young enough one regulation is taking and passing a hunter safety course. You learn what you may or may not do.
ECO's (enviromental conservation officers) may not have much experience and usually are not lawyers. They need degrees in CO with majors in biology, wildlife management, etc. Not law enforcement. They usually have to be certified by POST (police officers standards and training) within 6 mo--1 year of hire.
Constitutional law is not their forte. Confiscation of personal property was started as a remedy against organized crime. Anything used during the commission of a crime could be siezed (but got carried away for a while). Things a swinging the otherway after citizens not in organized crime had things taken. It moves slow. The real organized crime dudes changed to avoid things being taken. (They rent a house--not own it, etc)
One thing. Make sure one NEVER pleads guilty to anything. You can never appeal it. If a plea bargain is reached plea nolo contendre. You can appeal that to a higher court. Tyr
quote:A true hunter buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
An obedient servant of authority buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
`True hunter' is a state of mind having nothing to do with obedience to the police powers of the state.
quote:Originally posted by Tyr
Mike--Each state has variations in its laws--including CCW. For instance in CO there is no requirement that someone with a CCW permit notify cops they have a weapon. There is no restriction on carrying into a bar here either.You may have heard about the Hells Angel getting shot after starting a fight with some off duty copys in a bar in Stugis. The local cops and the DA filed charges against the off duty cops (also bikers) because a CCW can't carry in a bar there. But the case was overturned because the cops (out of state) are exempt due to a federal law passed about 2005.(LEOSA)
Everyone is not equal in all things. You may have an opinion about a subject but it is not equal to that rendered by a court recognized expert.
A true hunter buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
If you are young enough one regulation is taking and passing a hunter safety course. You learn what you may or may not do.
ECO's (enviromental conservation officers) may not have much experience and usually are not lawyers. They need degrees in CO with majors in biology, wildlife management, etc. Not law enforcement. They usually have to be certified by POST (police officers standards and training) within 6 mo--1 year of hire.
Constitutional law is not their forte. Confiscation of personal property was started as a remedy against organized crime. Anything used during the commission of a crime could be siezed (but got carried away for a while). Things a swinging the otherway after citizens not in organized crime had things taken. It moves slow. The real organized crime dudes changed to avoid things being taken. (They rent a house--not own it, etc)
One thing. Make sure one NEVER pleads guilty to anything. You can never appeal it. If a plea bargain is reached plea nolo contendre. You can appeal that to a higher court. Tyr
Aaaaaaaannnnnnnnnn! Wrong answer.
You may carry in a bar but (restriction coming up) you may not partake of ANY alcoholic beverage.
quote:Originally posted by nyforester
I defended myself pretty good !
The judge fined me $25.
I guess it could have been much worse.
Case closed !
Is it possible that the crime you were found guilty of is a disqualification for owning or buying a firearm under NY law? You might now be unable to purchase or possess.
jpwolf--I'll save you the trouble. Here is Colo law
18-12-214. Authority granted by permit - carrying restrictions.
(1) (a) A permit to carry a concealed handgun authorizes the permittee to carry a concealed handgun in all areas of the state, except as specifically limited in this section. A permit does not authorize the permittee to use a handgun in a manner that would violate a provision of state law. A local government does not have authority to adopt or enforce an ordinance or resolution that would conflict with any provision of this part 2.
(b) A peace officer may temporarily disarm a permittee, incident to a lawful stop of the permittee. The peace officer shall return the handgun to the permittee prior to discharging the permittee from the scene.
(2) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.
(3) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvements erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school; except that:
(a) A permittee may have a handgun on the real property of the public school so long as the handgun remains in his or her vehicle and, if the permittee is not in the vehicle, the handgun is in a compartment within the vehicle and the vehicle is locked;
(b) A permittee who is employed or retained by contract by a school district as a school security officer may carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvement erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school while the permittee is on duty;
(c) A permittee may carry a concealed handgun on undeveloped real property owned by a school district that is used for hunting or other shooting sports.
(4) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a public building at which:
(a) Security personnel and electronic weapons screening devices are permanently in place at each entrance to the building; (Interestly enough the S/O doesn't have both of these at his entrance) A "non-public" building only requires a sign. As a former LEO I wouldn't recommend pushing the issue.
(b) Security personnel electronically screen each person who enters the building to determine whether the person is carrying a weapon of any kind; and
(c) Security personnel require each person who is carrying a weapon of any kind to leave the weapon in possession of security personnel while the person is in the building.
(5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.
(Note: No mention of tavern, bar, alcohol)
I'll double check this however because statutes are sometimes linked to other statutes.
quote:Originally posted by Highball
An obedient servant of authority buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
`True hunter' is a state of mind having nothing to do with obedience to the police powers of the state.
Semantics. If you are engaging in the taking of wildlife it is most certainly "hunting" and should you not be in compliance with regulations you will quickly experience the police powers of the state.
If you want to tap dance around the use of the word "True" I won't argue with you. The thread addressed illegal baiting that a hunter elevating the overall experience would/should not use--regardless of law.
An urban hunter truely in the woods/mountains without the pressure of hunting for survival (like 2 weeks) must adhere to the regs. Some for safety, some to discourage trophy hunters, all falls into wildlife management.
In CO it brings a value of $75 million to various private enterprises within the state. I enjoy stepping back in time, being self reliant, respecting other hunters territory and sharing friendship around a fire. I have winched other hunters trucks out of the mud, helped pull their kills out of the woods and even skinned their game.
We don't communicate throughout the year but meet in the forest, cook and share food, watchout for each other hunting and enhance the whole experience. TRUE HUNTERS End of story
Comments
FYI--Colo Law is the following: "Use dogs or bait to hunt bear deer pronghorn or moose. Bait means to put, expose, distribute or scatter salt, minerals, grain, animal parts or other food as an attraction for big game. Scent sticks that smell like food are illegal for bears"
Some hunters unfairly take advantage of artificial feeding to establish a pattern attracting deer to an area they have "staked out". When the deer shows up the lazy gunner pops it and the real hunters are screwed wondering where the game is.
Some small game (furbearers) can be baited because they are usually trapped, not shot.
Most states do have a point system impacting whether you qualify for a license. Similar to the system used on drivers licenses but the total points allowed vary. Poaching is usually the max. Hunting under the influence is another.
Easiest thing is to contact your Dept. of Wildlife or whoever issues licences (not Walmart but the State agency). Sometimes it takes a little digging to learn how many points are allowed--or even what is considered a no-no.
Finally, the Feds have forced States to take your SS number. Part of the child support enforcement program. They don't want a child to go unsupported or tax supported while a parent is out fishing.
In Colo the DOW is totally self supporting through license fees and some other little things they call habitat stamps. It was around $70 million last year. Enough? Tyr
I understand there has to be regulations in hunting and wildlife preservation, but come on...feeding the deer on your property doesn't sound like a form of domestic terrorism to me.
But then again we all need to watch out for that guy that feeds the deer. he must be some sort of anarchist exploiting nature to his perverted desires. On top of that, HE HAS GUNS. We really need to inconvenience him today.
I personally like to feed pigeons at the park on Sundays before Church..OH NO!! I hear them coming for me!!!
Good luck with your tickets. Tell the judge it was an accident and you were just trying to make lush compost for your new flower bed of Pansies you're putting in, and the deer came and ate it.
He will forgive you.
The way to wrap your head around this is to remember that we a talking about wildlife--emphasis on wild.
Nobody is saying you have to be wearing clothing that will make you stand out from mother nature, bang on a cow bell, and sing. Baiting with food is entirely different especially considering the loss of habitat that takes the "wild" out of wildlife.
If you don't want to hunt why not plug ole bessie grazing on your neighbors property. Because you would be "taking" something that belongs to your neighbor--and go to jail.
Wildlife don't belong to a property owner because thay step across an invisible property line, or fly over it during migration. They belong to the state and most states manage wildlife to accomplish a number of things. One is revenue from licenses. Out of state hunters pay more, eat in restaurants, gas up, stay in motels, and spend money doing other things in the state. All those restaurants, gas stations, motels, etc. depend on the revenue.
Most Depts of Wildlife are not tax supported. Those that want to participate (under the rules) pay--otherwise, it's no burden on you.
We used to have herds of buffalo that were practically killed off because there were no limits. Don't repeat that mistake or get so whacked to call it domestic terrorism. Stick to the issue.
Gun use is promoted by wildlife departments because it brings people to the state for hunting. All those that benefit from dollars spent would be pretty stupid if they were anti gun because business would shrivle up and THEY couldn't go to Disneyland (they won't find me there--I took my kid out of school (gasp) to hunt deer and live in the woods.
I wondered who kept feeding those pigeons that dumped all over the walk into the church. FYI I worked in a little town where they wanted to plink them off the church roof with a .22--so a state trooper got permission to shoot within city limits and never broke a tile on the roof.
addpillz--nyforester defended himself and the whole thing was finished Decembr 5th. Might want to update yourself.
I don't agree with using food to bait critters to me for me to gun down. I agree wildlife must be preserved for future generations and preservation laws must be followed. I just can't believe two ECO officers can ticket a guy on secondary evidence from a neighbor. Then again he did admit to feeding them. They should have just issued him a warning. I think they should be putting their priorities on pollution and litter other then some guy feeding deer. Congrats on the low ticket though, it could have been worst.
I have met too many tyrants sitting on judicial benches or in the prosecutors offices. I guess that is why our forefathers gave us a remedy for that situation.
"The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and the blood of tyrants." Thomas Jefferson
"Each time a person stands up for an ideal or acts to improve the lot of others....they send forth a ripple of hope, and crossing each other from a million different centres of energy and daring, those ripples build a current that can sweep down the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance." Robert F. Kennedy
"[L]et there be no change [in Constitutional powers] by usurpation; for though this, in one instance, may be the instrument of good, it is the customary weapon by which free governments are destroyed." -George Washington
"There is no crueler tyranny than that which is exercised under cover of law, and with the colors of justice .." United States vs Jannottie, 673 F.2d 578, 614 (ed Cir. 1982)
I believe Thomas Jefferson is right, it is now time for the Tree of liberty to be refreshed! Where the people stand together - they are the law, regardless what is written on the lawbooks.
wear my blaze orange, i got a violation $105
so next season i won't forget
PEACE
tom
It is too bad that things have progressed/regressed the way they have. Too many people have become urbanized and the thought of meat is limited to a grocery store and roughing it means spending the night in a motel.
I doubt whether we locked the door much growing up. As cops we BS'd about nailing a burglary or robbery in progress. Fact is, it took minutes to respond when seconds counted. I now have bars and locks everywhere--good thing I learned to weld.
Some progress is being made. More than half of the states have procedures for people to get CCW's. Considering the "drive by gang banger shootings" (more of that progress) I like the idea of being able to shoot back--its a deterrent also.
The US Supreme court finally interpreted that the 2nd Amend applied to individuals--not a militia. The case was in DC so it should be interesting if it applies in states (probably take an incident from a state that gets appealled to the Supreme court to find out)
Some stretches of water around here (Colorado) prohibit bait--must be artificial lures. So feeding fish is also restricted.
lordmegatron--I always wear my daylight fluorescent orange. When I hunted during the regular rifle season there were so many people out there (some known to make "sound shots") I didn't want to get blown away by some itcy trigger finger. Muzzleloading was the way to cut back the number of people.
I called our Dept of Wildlife (DOW) a few days ago and asked if there was any way for them to search a vehicle without a warrant (which means probable cause) He said no, all the constitutional restrictions applied to them too. I would take that with a grain of salt--and look at the fine print on a license application--you might waive some rights by getting a license.
I've been stopped just driving down a 4X4 road by wildlife officers. A cop on a city street needs more PC to stop you but it happens all the time. We were in a National Forest, it was hunting season, and everyone in the cab was wearing orange--I think that was the difference. They saw muzzleloaders in the window rack and wanted to check them to see if the caps were off (defined as being unloaded).
There was no place to hide game out of sight except my side tool boxes but nobody demanded that I unlock them. If they had I would have refused. I never have seen a cop ask for permission to search something and then give the old TV line, "If you have nothing to hide what difference does it make". I would say, "no comment, read the Constitution". But then I'm generally pretty ornery anyway.
addpillz--I was probably the king of warnings-written or verbal. Got chewed out regularly for it. Different philosophies I guess. Sometime if I had to write a ticket I would tell them how they could plea bargin it down unless they had so much money or were making enough that going to court wasn't reasonable.
Being a good hunter is a year round thing for me. Practice at the range, made my own down bag, and just found an Army tent that needs poles I'd like to try out. Then I'm always scouting areas in the summer that might be good to hunt--if they are next to a stream big enough to go fishing it just makes my day. (Colo has a "make my day law" after Clint Eastwood said that in a movie) I'll tell you about it some other time. Tyr
You may have heard about the Hells Angel getting shot after starting a fight with some off duty copys in a bar in Stugis. The local cops and the DA filed charges against the off duty cops (also bikers) because a CCW can't carry in a bar there. But the case was overturned because the cops (out of state) are exempt due to a federal law passed about 2005.(LEOSA)
Everyone is not equal in all things. You may have an opinion about a subject but it is not equal to that rendered by a court recognized expert.
A true hunter buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
If you are young enough one regulation is taking and passing a hunter safety course. You learn what you may or may not do.
ECO's (enviromental conservation officers) may not have much experience and usually are not lawyers. They need degrees in CO with majors in biology, wildlife management, etc. Not law enforcement. They usually have to be certified by POST (police officers standards and training) within 6 mo--1 year of hire.
Constitutional law is not their forte. Confiscation of personal property was started as a remedy against organized crime. Anything used during the commission of a crime could be siezed (but got carried away for a while). Things a swinging the otherway after citizens not in organized crime had things taken. It moves slow. The real organized crime dudes changed to avoid things being taken. (They rent a house--not own it, etc)
One thing. Make sure one NEVER pleads guilty to anything. You can never appeal it. If a plea bargain is reached plea nolo contendre. You can appeal that to a higher court. Tyr
An obedient servant of authority buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
`True hunter' is a state of mind having nothing to do with obedience to the police powers of the state.
Mike--Each state has variations in its laws--including CCW. For instance in CO there is no requirement that someone with a CCW permit notify cops they have a weapon. There is no restriction on carrying into a bar here either.You may have heard about the Hells Angel getting shot after starting a fight with some off duty copys in a bar in Stugis. The local cops and the DA filed charges against the off duty cops (also bikers) because a CCW can't carry in a bar there. But the case was overturned because the cops (out of state) are exempt due to a federal law passed about 2005.(LEOSA)
Everyone is not equal in all things. You may have an opinion about a subject but it is not equal to that rendered by a court recognized expert.
A true hunter buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
If you are young enough one regulation is taking and passing a hunter safety course. You learn what you may or may not do.
ECO's (enviromental conservation officers) may not have much experience and usually are not lawyers. They need degrees in CO with majors in biology, wildlife management, etc. Not law enforcement. They usually have to be certified by POST (police officers standards and training) within 6 mo--1 year of hire.
Constitutional law is not their forte. Confiscation of personal property was started as a remedy against organized crime. Anything used during the commission of a crime could be siezed (but got carried away for a while). Things a swinging the otherway after citizens not in organized crime had things taken. It moves slow. The real organized crime dudes changed to avoid things being taken. (They rent a house--not own it, etc)
One thing. Make sure one NEVER pleads guilty to anything. You can never appeal it. If a plea bargain is reached plea nolo contendre. You can appeal that to a higher court. Tyr
Aaaaaaaannnnnnnnnn! Wrong answer.
You may carry in a bar but (restriction coming up) you may not partake of ANY alcoholic beverage.
I defended myself pretty good !
The judge fined me $25.
I guess it could have been much worse.
Case closed !
Is it possible that the crime you were found guilty of is a disqualification for owning or buying a firearm under NY law? You might now be unable to purchase or possess.
18-12-214. Authority granted by permit - carrying restrictions.
(1) (a) A permit to carry a concealed handgun authorizes the permittee to carry a concealed handgun in all areas of the state, except as specifically limited in this section. A permit does not authorize the permittee to use a handgun in a manner that would violate a provision of state law. A local government does not have authority to adopt or enforce an ordinance or resolution that would conflict with any provision of this part 2.
(b) A peace officer may temporarily disarm a permittee, incident to a lawful stop of the permittee. The peace officer shall return the handgun to the permittee prior to discharging the permittee from the scene.
(2) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.
(3) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvements erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school; except that:
(a) A permittee may have a handgun on the real property of the public school so long as the handgun remains in his or her vehicle and, if the permittee is not in the vehicle, the handgun is in a compartment within the vehicle and the vehicle is locked;
(b) A permittee who is employed or retained by contract by a school district as a school security officer may carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvement erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school while the permittee is on duty;
(c) A permittee may carry a concealed handgun on undeveloped real property owned by a school district that is used for hunting or other shooting sports.
(4) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a public building at which:
(a) Security personnel and electronic weapons screening devices are permanently in place at each entrance to the building; (Interestly enough the S/O doesn't have both of these at his entrance) A "non-public" building only requires a sign. As a former LEO I wouldn't recommend pushing the issue.
(b) Security personnel electronically screen each person who enters the building to determine whether the person is carrying a weapon of any kind; and
(c) Security personnel require each person who is carrying a weapon of any kind to leave the weapon in possession of security personnel while the person is in the building.
(5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.
(Note: No mention of tavern, bar, alcohol)
I'll double check this however because statutes are sometimes linked to other statutes.
An obedient servant of authority buys a license and must hunt under regulations established for the taking of the wildlife covered by the license.
`True hunter' is a state of mind having nothing to do with obedience to the police powers of the state.
Semantics. If you are engaging in the taking of wildlife it is most certainly "hunting" and should you not be in compliance with regulations you will quickly experience the police powers of the state.
If you want to tap dance around the use of the word "True" I won't argue with you. The thread addressed illegal baiting that a hunter elevating the overall experience would/should not use--regardless of law.
An urban hunter truely in the woods/mountains without the pressure of hunting for survival (like 2 weeks) must adhere to the regs. Some for safety, some to discourage trophy hunters, all falls into wildlife management.
In CO it brings a value of $75 million to various private enterprises within the state. I enjoy stepping back in time, being self reliant, respecting other hunters territory and sharing friendship around a fire. I have winched other hunters trucks out of the mud, helped pull their kills out of the woods and even skinned their game.
We don't communicate throughout the year but meet in the forest, cook and share food, watchout for each other hunting and enhance the whole experience. TRUE HUNTERS End of story