.

Food For Thought

Old 7x57Old 7x57 Member Posts: 10 ✭✭
A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take every thing you have. Thomas Jefferson

Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.

All gun owners from one state to another should work and stand together.
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Comments

  • Old 7x57Old 7x57 Member Posts: 10 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by alledan
    On the T.V.,radio, in newspapers,magazines etc. every pro-gun advocate is continuing to repeat the same old thing..."the AWB wasn't any good to begin with...all it was is cosmectic....there was alwyays AWs out there".

    The question is....isn't this working for the other side?

    Knowing the anti-gun crowd like i do, when the next AWB bill comes along I think they will be saying the same thing and having pro-gun advocates to back them up which may make it easier to get a more hard hitting ban thru congress. All they would have to do is roll the T.V. footage with us cutting our own throats.

    Maybe it's my own paranoia but i think we may have become our own worst enemy.

    Seems almost like a set-up to me!

    JMHO!





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    Extreme moments of horror should be met with extreme actions of preventive retribution



    Of all the things I've lost, I miss my youth the most!



    You make a good point. When the AW ban renewal was tacked onto the bill to prevent gun manufacturer's from being sued, we played right into their hands. Many said the the AW ban extension would have been stripped from the bill in conference committee.

    It also irks me when the anti-gunners are doing a petition and someone says, "Let's sign it with funny names" or "let's overload their servers" You know that they will just use the raw numbers to crow about their cause and not mention that "Strong Arm Robber" wants to see more gun control.

    If we could just get 80% of the pro-gun people to sign up for the NRA and the GOA for one six year election cycle, we could do some political good.

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    Semper Fi

    Remember Ruby Ridge.

    Experience is the best teacher and usually charges accordingly.

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  • LaidbackDanLaidbackDan Member Posts: 13,143 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.


    BULL SNOT
  • LaidbackDanLaidbackDan Member Posts: 13,143 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm sorry, I posted before I read your past threads.
    I should be more tolerant of the mentally impaired.
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by LaidbackDan
    quote:Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.


    BULL SNOT
    AND BULL SNIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Horse Plains DrifterHorse Plains Drifter Member Posts: 35,685 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.
    WRONG ANSWER!!!!!You sure ain't off to a good start here. I think you are a Californian that was on here with a first post bich about sellers on GB not selling to CA, correct? Lines like you just posted is exactly why.
  • NeoBlackdogNeoBlackdog Member Posts: 12,560 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Need to go back and reread your Constitution, Old 7x57. 2nd Amendment says gun ownership is a RIGHT, not a privelege. Do you know the difference?
  • He DogHe Dog Member Posts: 48,597 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Last I heard the RIGHT to bear arms (Read: own firearms) was a right not a privlege. Are you a BATF agent by chance?
  • guntech59guntech59 Member Posts: 23,193 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take every thing you have. Thomas Jefferson

    Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.

    All gun owners from one state to another should work and stand together.


    You, Sir, are an idiot!

    IBTL.
  • cahascahas Member Posts: 4,064
    edited November -1
    Big difference in a privilege and a right and as of now we have the right to carry.
    Most gun owners do stand together, we fight and bicker but all share a common affiliation that this right to gun ownership should not be infringed upon.
  • EhlerDaveEhlerDave Member Posts: 5,158 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Just who is it that enforces the Constitution ?
    Just smile and say nothing, let them guess how much you know.
  • cahascahas Member Posts: 4,064
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by EhlerDave
    Just who is it that enforces the Constitution ?
    Us backwoods Redneks enforce it out here [8D]
  • montanajoemontanajoe Member, Moderator Posts: 51,122 ******
    edited November -1
  • 35 Whelen35 Whelen Member Posts: 15,200
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57

    Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.




    Sluuurrrpppp, sluuuuurrrrpppp, baaaaaaaaaaa. Good boy, that koolaid's looking good this year, and so is the wool.[}:)][:(!]
    An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.
  • CubsloverCubslover Member Posts: 18,601
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take every thing you have. Thomas Jefferson

    Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.

    All gun owners from one state to another should work and stand together.


    Who is going to come take said gun?
    Half of the lives they tell about me aren't true.
  • cccoopercccooper Member Posts: 4,044
    edited November -1
    WOW.

    Yet one more reason there will be blood.

    Brainwashed sheeple like this that spew crap like the above.

    Sad beyond words[V]
  • jpwolfjpwolf Member Posts: 9,164
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take every thing you have. Thomas Jefferson

    Owning a gun is a privilege...they can be taken away.

    All gun owners from one state to another should work and stand together.
    No wonder you lost all your rights in cali, you are a perfect example of not knowing what a "right" is. Born gelded or taught?

    Privilege? Pfftttt.

    They can be taken.... by a thief.

    Based on the title of your thread and the subsequent content, it would be safe to assume you are starving, no?

    Stay there, please. And do not vote, you don't know how, please.
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by cahas
    Big difference in a privilege and a right and as of now we have the right to carry.
    Most gun owners do stand together, we fight and bicker but all share a common affiliation that this right to gun ownership should not be infringed upon.

    Demonstrably untrue.

    Many 'gun-owners' and purported 'gun-rights' proponents are desirous of government infringement of that which Amendment II prohibits government from doing.

    Very few, likely as few as 3%, gun owners are supportive of Amendment II.

    As to the original poster, he is mouthing in a direct manner what many GB forum members try to disguise via diversionary terminology, rationalization and justification.

    It is that simple.
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by EhlerDave
    Just who is it that enforces the Constitution ?
    Well, looking at the state of government 'limitations', foreign adventurism (empire), erosion and abrogations of the Bill of Rights and the state of individual liberty in general, I'd have to say nobody is enforcing the Constitution.
  • COBmmcmssCOBmmcmss Member Posts: 1,174 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    If you all look back to the days when then "Mayor Feinstein" tried to outlaw guns in SanFran, the courts found she overstepped her bounds DIRECTLY DUE to the realization that the California State Constitution (Not to be confused with the Kalifornia Manifesto of Self Destiny from liberals like her or Boxer) clearly states the same right (not a privilege) to the California Citizens as the US Constitution 2nd Amendment.

    As much as the liberal weenies want to outlaw guns, until they eliminate their own Constitution, they can't achieve their goal.

    COB
  • Flying Clay DiskFlying Clay Disk Member Posts: 35,167 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Dood...you're on a roll!!

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  • armilitearmilite Member Posts: 35,195 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    And here I was just thinking about some thing to eat and I read this. I guess I'm not hungry any more.
  • gesshotsgesshots Member Posts: 14,267 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Do-not-feed-the-troll.PNG

    [;)][^]
    It's being willing. I found out early that most men, regardless of cause or need, aren't willing. They blink an eye or draw a breath before they pull the trigger. I won't. ~ J.B. Books
  • COLTCOLT Member, Moderator Posts: 12,620 ******
    edited November -1
    Its a RIGHT, and before you get hammered to death, we pack up & move to a more appropriate forum...[;)]
  • Old 7x57Old 7x57 Member Posts: 10 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am amazed at such a negative response to the statement I made.
    Back in the eighties a close friend of mine, his home was robbed and most all his gun collection was taken never to be seen again. A lot of those guns had s strong sentimental value. My friend made a statement that stuck with me...."never take anything for granite and that includes your guns". Well, I guess I have taken that thought to a step further. I didn't mean to step on my fellow gun owners toes....actually I was trying to stress the importance of gun owners working together.
    As far as, No Sales To California....I found a Browning Citori listed on Gunbroker that had every thing I was looking for, and then I came to the Sorry No Sales To California....my thought was, the politicians win again. Anyway, I will put this behind me and move on. The Old Man 7X57.
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    I am amazed at such a negative response to the statement I made.
    Back in the eighties a close friend of mine, his home was robbed and most all his gun collection was taken never to be seen again. A lot of those guns had s strong sentimental value. My friend made a statement that stuck with me...."never take anything for granite and that includes your guns". Well, I guess I have taken that thought to a step further. I didn't mean to step on my fellow gun owners toes....actually I was trying to stress the importance of gun owners working together.
    As far as, No Sales To California....I found a Browning Citori listed on Gunbroker that had every thing I was looking for, and then I came to the Sorry No Sales To California....my thought was, the politicians win again. Anyway, I will put this behind me and move on. The Old Man 7X57.
    Have you grasped the concept of a fundamental, constitutionally enumerated right -vs- a privilege, revocable by government?

    When there are 'gun owners' who approach fundamental rights as if they are privileges, you will find that those who DO know the difference are less than enthusiastic about 'working together'.

    Perhaps you should join the NRA, they also fail to grasp the privilege -vs- right issue and the actions and advocacy they take will likely suit your ethic just fine.
  • cccoopercccooper Member Posts: 4,044
    edited November -1
    Guess this another fine example of the uninformed,under-educated, and almost clueless populace we have in the US today.

    Still, very, very sad. [V]
  • jpwolfjpwolf Member Posts: 9,164
    edited November -1
    I doubt he will be back. Sounds pretty set in his wrong-headed cali ways.
  • RTKBARTKBA Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You do realize that technically Old 7x57 is right. Firearms and ammunition ownership right now is a privilege. Have you forgotten what happens when you get a felony conviction.
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by RTKBA
    You do realize that technically Old 7x57 is right. Firearms and ammunition ownership right now is a privilege. Have you forgotten what happens when you get a felony conviction.
    A right not exercised...

    It is only a privilege if one personally allows it to be so, regardless of what the anti-constitutional government's commonly-accepted 'infringement' is.
  • RTKBARTKBA Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    [/quote]A right not exercised...

    It is only a privilege if one personally allows it to be so, regardless of what the anti-constitutional government's commonly-accepted 'infringement' is.


    [/quote]

    Well said!
    I spent 10min staring at my screen trying to come up with an argument for this and I can't.
  • jpwolfjpwolf Member Posts: 9,164
    edited November -1
    Until the constitution is "officially" abandoned, it is only a privilege if one "believes" it is. In Cali, that's what they "believe".[V]

    Can't help but wonder what gems HB would have dropped on that guy.[V]
  • RogueStatesmanRogueStatesman Member Posts: 5,760
    edited November -1
    Obviously the two decenters here in this thread have NO EARTHLY IDEA of what our beloved Constitution's Second Amendment says.

    May I suggest to Old 7x57 and RTKBA: Pick up a copy of this document and READ IT!! There you will find YOUR RIGHT to keep and bear arms. It is NOT a privilege, it is a RIGHT. If you allow it to be your privilege, then your right will fade away like a migrating monarch. Get with the program and learn your rights so you can help protect them from becoming a memory.

    I'm really tired of dealing with ignorant-turned stupid people who fail to understand basic principles. Its just MADDENING!!![:(!][:(!][:(!]






    [:)]
  • RTKBARTKBA Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by RogueStatesman


    Obviously the two decenters here in this thread have NO EARTHLY IDEA of what our beloved Constitution's Second Amendment says.

    May I suggest to Old 7x57 and RTKBA: Pick up a copy of this document and READ IT!! There you will find YOUR RIGHT to keep and bear arms. It is NOT a privilege, it is a RIGHT. If you allow it to be your privilege, then your right will fade away like a migrating monarch. Get with the program and learn your rights so you can help protect them from becoming a memory.

    I'm really tired of dealing with ignorant-turned stupid people who fail to understand basic principles. Its just MADDENING!!![:(!][:(!][:(!]






    [:)]


    Actually I have studied the constitution for years RugueStatesmen. The point I was making is that in today's world it is treated as a privilege by our Government. And unless you plan on spending a lot of time in prison you yourself will have to treat it as a privilege.

    And if you insist it is still a right today, than perhaps you can point me in the right direction to get an MP7-A1 or maybe an MG4. How many unregistered machine guns do you own?

    lt496 got right to the hart of the issue with
    "A right not exercised...
    It is only a privilege if one personally allows it to be so, regardless of what the anti-constitutional government's commonly-accepted 'infringement' is."

    The Government has made it impossible to exercise your right with out spending most of your life behind bars. So yes, read the constitution and than take a long look around you and you will realize that most of our cherished rights have been lost for a very long time.
  • RogueStatesmanRogueStatesman Member Posts: 5,760
    edited November -1
    If you have been studying it for years, then you're not entirely believing what you studied.

    I believe I understand what you're saying. But its a foolish mind and a soft heart that considers the 2nd a privilege in ANY ASPECT. I follow the gun laws even though they're unconstitutional; that keeps me out of jail. HOWEVER, you will never convince me in any form that this right is any kind of privilege. Possessing a 'driver's license' is a privilege but keeping and bearing arms is a Right.

    You're getting into legalities outside the amendment itself and that's where you're wrong. Just because you can't legally own a mp5 select fire doesn't mean your privilege is infringed, it means your right has been violated. Follow me? Just because an item is not 'legal' to own, doesn't mean you don't have a right to have it.

    The Fed has watered down our rights like you said "for a very long time", but they are still rights under the Constitution. And until that document is suspended and some far more restrictive government is imposed or the SCOTUS says that right is unconstitutional, its still a right, not a privilege.

    So I still accurately and correctly maintain that a Constitutional Right is a "RIGHT" and not a privilege. You can choose otherwise at your own 'privilege'.[;)]





    [:)]
  • RTKBARTKBA Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by RogueStatesman


    If you have been studying it for years, then you're not entirely believing what you studied.

    I believe I understand what you're saying. But its a foolish mind and a soft heart that considers the 2nd a privilege in ANY ASPECT. I follow the gun laws even though they're unconstitutional; that keeps me out of jail. HOWEVER, you will never convince me in any form that this right is any kind of privilege. Possessing a 'driver's license' is a privilege but keeping and bearing arms is a Right.

    You're getting into legalities outside the amendment itself and that's where you're wrong. Just because you can't legally own a mp5 select fire doesn't mean your privilege is infringed, it means your right has been violated. Follow me? Just because an item is not 'legal' to own, doesn't mean you don't have a right to have it.

    The Fed has watered down our rights like you said "for a very long time", but they are still rights under the Constitution. And until that document is suspended and some far more restrictive government is imposed or the SCOTUS says that right is unconstitutional, its still a right, not a privilege.

    So I still accurately and correctly maintain that a Constitutional Right is a "RIGHT" and not a privilege. You can choose otherwise at your own 'privilege'.[;)]





    [:)]


    LOL...
    I think we are very close to the same page but not quite there.
    First I think we can all agree that the Bill Of Rights are unalienable rights. Rights granted by a higher power (or what ever you would like to call it) that are necessary for any free man to consider himself free.

    Now take a look around you, how many laws, ordinances and regulations have been written to circumvent, go around and outright strip you of these rights. And now I will ask you, How can you call something a right if when you exercise it you become a criminal?

    My point is this, you can scream IT'S MY RIGHT all you want while they drag you off to jail. Or people can start to wake up and realize that the Rights they hold so dear are now a mere privilege. Then just maybe enough people will come together and steer this unconstitutional government back on the correct path. Where good people can exercise a right without becoming a criminal.

    And for the record, I can debate the drivers license being a privilege. Another time.[:D]
  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by RTKBA
    quote:Originally posted by RogueStatesman


    If you have been studying it for years, then you're not entirely believing what you studied.

    I believe I understand what you're saying. But its a foolish mind and a soft heart that considers the 2nd a privilege in ANY ASPECT. I follow the gun laws even though they're unconstitutional; that keeps me out of jail. HOWEVER, you will never convince me in any form that this right is any kind of privilege. Possessing a 'driver's license' is a privilege but keeping and bearing arms is a Right.

    You're getting into legalities outside the amendment itself and that's where you're wrong. Just because you can't legally own a mp5 select fire doesn't mean your privilege is infringed, it means your right has been violated. Follow me? Just because an item is not 'legal' to own, doesn't mean you don't have a right to have it.

    The Fed has watered down our rights like you said "for a very long time", but they are still rights under the Constitution. And until that document is suspended and some far more restrictive government is imposed or the SCOTUS says that right is unconstitutional, its still a right, not a privilege.

    So I still accurately and correctly maintain that a Constitutional Right is a "RIGHT" and not a privilege. You can choose otherwise at your own 'privilege'.[;)]





    [:)]


    LOL...
    I think we are very close to the same page but not quite there.
    First I think we can all agree that the Bill Of Rights are unalienable rights. Rights granted by a higher power (or what ever you would like to call it) that are necessary for any free man to consider himself free.

    Now take a look around you, how many laws, ordinances and regulations have been written to circumvent, go around and outright strip you of these rights. And now I will ask you, How can you call something a right if when you exercise it you become a criminal?

    My point is this, you can scream IT'S MY RIGHT all you want while they drag you off to jail. Or people can start to wake up and realize that the Rights they hold so dear are now a mere privilege. Then just maybe enough people will come together and steer this unconstitutional government back on the correct path. Where good people can exercise a right without becoming a criminal.

    And for the record, I can debate the drivers license being a privilege. Another time.[:D]


    You mean your freedom to travel? And your freedom to choose the means of travel? And we can liken the "travel" to blackpowder firearms and say an AR in the rights arena? [;)]
  • RTKBARTKBA Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    "You mean your freedom to travel? And your freedom to choose the means of travel? And we can liken the "travel" to blackpowder firearms and say an AR in the rights arena?"

    I think you lost me on this Freemind.

    The right to travel, although not enumerated in the Bill Of Rights is certainly implied in the constitution. And are you aware of the history concerning the drivers license? How it came to be and why it was implemented?

    Turning any right, from the 2A to the ability of someone to go to the store to feed there family into a privilege is not okay in my book.
    Just saying.[;)]
  • Old 7x57Old 7x57 Member Posts: 10 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I understand as per the constitution we have the right to gun ownership. As RTKBA stated we are slowly losing constitutional rights all the time. One example would be the right to pray in our schools...that's gone. The point I was making is that our gun ownership right can be taken away...we as gun owners need to take a stand and work together and not let this happen. What I got from the responses to my statement, was a negative Macho attitude...a lot of the responses took me back to the eighth grade. It was a relief to read RTKBA's comments...he put the Macho attitude to the side and told it how it really is.
  • RogueStatesmanRogueStatesman Member Posts: 5,760
    edited November -1
    There ... fixed it for you. That's the proper terminology and any BORs or COTUS student would have known the difference.

    As a sidenote: The definition of "inalienable" refers to rights rights that cannot be surrendered, sold, transfered to another or capable of being repudiated. Even though its suggested, it doesn't however, directly reflect that those rights are granted by a "higher power".

    My correct points concerning right vs. privilege stands. Please refer to any true Constitutionalist who actually believes the document in its entirety and you will discover that the COTUS and BOR are rights, even when specific laws violate those documents.

    And the driver's license debate ... its waiting for you.[;)][;)]





    [:)]
    quote:Originally posted by RTKBA
    quote:Originally posted by RogueStatesman


    If you have been studying it for years, then you're not entirely believing what you studied.

    I believe I understand what you're saying. But its a foolish mind and a soft heart that considers the 2nd a privilege in ANY ASPECT. I follow the gun laws even though they're unconstitutional; that keeps me out of jail. HOWEVER, you will never convince me in any form that this right is any kind of privilege. Possessing a 'driver's license' is a privilege but keeping and bearing arms is a Right.

    You're getting into legalities outside the amendment itself and that's where you're wrong. Just because you can't legally own a mp5 select fire doesn't mean your privilege is infringed, it means your right has been violated. Follow me? Just because an item is not 'legal' to own, doesn't mean you don't have a right to have it.

    The Fed has watered down our rights like you said "for a very long time", but they are still rights under the Constitution. And until that document is suspended and some far more restrictive government is imposed or the SCOTUS says that right is unconstitutional, its still a right, not a privilege.

    So I still accurately and correctly maintain that a Constitutional Right is a "RIGHT" and not a privilege. You can choose otherwise at your own 'privilege'.[;)]





    [:)]


    LOL...
    I think we are very close to the same page but not quite there.
    First I think we can all agree that the Bill Of Rights are unalienable inalienable rights. Rights granted by a higher power (or what ever you would like to call it) that are necessary for any free man to consider himself free.

    Now take a look around you, how many laws, ordinances and regulations have been written to circumvent, go around and outright strip you of these rights. And now I will ask you, How can you call something a right if when you exercise it you become a criminal?

    My point is this, you can scream IT'S MY RIGHT all you want while they drag you off to jail. Or people can start to wake up and realize that the Rights they hold so dear are now a mere privilege. Then just maybe enough people will come together and steer this unconstitutional government back on the correct path. Where good people can exercise a right without becoming a criminal.

    And for the record, I can debate the drivers license being a privilege. Another time.[:D]
  • RogueStatesmanRogueStatesman Member Posts: 5,760
    edited November -1
    Yes, it can be taken away. But until then, its a right and not a privilege, even if a law waters it down or whitles it somehow.

    Our inalienable rights are written in black and white and its our stupidity as a human race to have allowed those who wish control over us to take those rights. I agree with you too, a stand must be made against those who will take our rights.

    One problem with your post is that you didn't provide a solution to the problem. How do we stand together when certain gun 'rights' organizations are not standing for us after being entrusted with this task? What work would you suggest that could be accomplished to ensure our rights to keep and bear arms is not infringed? Any suggestions??





    [:)]
    quote:Originally posted by Old 7x57
    I understand as per the constitution we have the right to gun ownership. As RTKBA stated we are slowly losing constitutional rights all the time. One example would be the right to pray in our schools...that's gone. The point I was making is that our gun ownership right can be taken away...we as gun owners need to take a stand and work together and not let this happen. What I got from the responses to my statement, was a negative Macho attitude...a lot of the responses took me back to the eighth grade. It was a relief to read RTKBA's comments...he put the Macho attitude to the side and told it how it really is.
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