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What Year do you feel it will happen..

select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,482 ✭✭✭✭
When all the guns are confinscated ? Just your theory but how long are we talking..years???
«13

Comments

  • CJ7nvrstkCJ7nvrstk Member Posts: 678 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    If hillary were to win in 08 we all need to become very concerned. [V] She would push hard for it. Maybe I am being too optimistic, but I don't see it happening in my lifetime. Let's pray I'm right and continue fighting for our rights. (do not pray for hillary to win in 08)

    Lord, grant me the serenity to accept the things I can not change, the courage to change the things I can, and the weaponry to make the difference.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    20 years max if things continue like they are now.

    Never if even 1/4th of American gun owners would join together and give of their time, money and effort to reverse the anti-gun, anti-selfdefense attitude that is creeping across America.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    When we least expect it.

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • jack85jack85 Member Posts: 211 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    jack85, with the many ways I gun rights have been shredded over the last hundred years, and with the countless powerful and influencel people and groups who's only goal is to limit or outlaw gun ownership, I truly don't see how you can believe your statement.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Me either, fox.

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • jack85jack85 Member Posts: 211 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    TrFox;
    just look at the native Indians,

    native_shirt.jpg

    ...after 500+ years they're still kicking!


    We gotta learn from them.
  • JamesRKJamesRK Member Posts: 25,672 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Ask the folks in England, Australia, Canada, Mexico, Washington, D. C., New York City, California.
    The road to hell is paved with COMPROMISE.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by jack85
    TrFox;
    just look at the native Indians,

    native_shirt.jpg

    ...after 500+ years they're still kicking!


    We gotta learn from them.


    Interestingly enough, the American Indians, with their soverign nation and reservation claims, may be our last hope that the US Govt. can never outlaw all guns. If the govt. tried it, I think the Indian nations would fight that law to the death. And they would have a good point as evidenced of how the Indians can do things on their Indian property that we non-Indians cannot. Like make their own laws, have their own courts and police, levy their own charges and taxes, have gambling, etc.

    I would hope that if our Govt. outlawed all guns, the Indians would make the claim that they still have the right to own guns on their own reservations. And as long as there are pepetual pockets of American people, who are rreally just citizens like the rest of us, who can still own guns even after our federal (or maybe even the states that have Indian rreservations) govt. outlaws guns for the rrest of us, it will create a "double-standard" or two levels of "citizen rights" and that might just be enough of a disparaity for us gun people to use to re-instate our own gun rights.

    Whadda think gunphreak and JamesRK?

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • longhunterlonghunter Member Posts: 3,242
    edited November -1
    Weren't we gonna look into somethin like this afore fox??Seems so long ago...One would hope and expect that they would fight.......perhaps its time to prove my heritage.........
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    longhunter: I vaguely remember something about that, but I don't know any Indians whom I could ask.

    Although if it turns out when they outlaw guns, only Indians will have guns, then I may want to check out which tribe my great-great-granduncle Flingingdabull came from [:D]

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    I would expect...just one more terrorist incident away from.

    Remember the retired General..stating that the Constitution WILL be suspended..upon the next incident ?
    This statement from the authorities SHOULD tell all concerned whom THEY consider to be the enemy....

    Other then that..it depends on the resistance met..each time the Socialists up in Washington advance their agenda.

    Naturally...I want all gun people to convince Washington we would WELCOME a gun ban.....
  • HokkmikeHokkmike Member Posts: 577 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    We must always reject the notion that gun confiscation is inevitable. Having said that we must conduct ourselves as though it is imminent.

    Having done nothing, I think they will be gone in only a few more generations.
    My great, great, grandchildren.

    Hunting is already on a HUGE downswing in PA.

    And YES, I know one does not have to justify gun ownership with hunting; but it is an indicator!

    Sako Fan
  • flat8flat8 Member Posts: 887 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I truly hope it happens sooner - MUCH sooner than later. There are still free men in this country who will stand on the side of good in this fight if it happens soon. In 10 years there won't be any free-thinkers left - they will have been doped up on Ritalin, Zoloft, or Xanax at the first exercise of independent thought in a gov't school.

    But to answer the question, 2008 to 2010 is my time frame. I pray that if it happens, I will be called upon to deal with it, and not my (yet concieved and unborn) children.



    JPFO Life Member
    www.jpfo.org
  • pickenuppickenup Member Posts: 22,846 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    IF slick Willie gets control of the UN, and Hillary gets elected in "08" there will be a MAJOR push for it before the decade is out.

    If there is another MAJOR terrorist attack on our soil, you can throw the Constitution out the window.
    Oh wait, they already did that.....never mind......[:(]

    The gene pool needs chlorine.
  • Colonel PlinkColonel Plink Member Posts: 16,460
    edited November -1
    You don't have to wait fot Bill Clinton to take the reins of the UN, Your current POTUS and his gibbering henchmen are already formulating their plans to strip us of our rights. They hired Colin Powell's son to work on our First Amendment rights, something his hand-picked successor will contine, I'm sure. The Second Amendment has been under fire for decades, The Fourth Amendment has all but been eviscerated. The United Stated we live in today would make Stalin clap his hands in glee. We have not MET the enemy, gentlemen. We ELECTED him.

    "When the going gets weird, the Weird turn pro"
    Hunter S. Thompson"
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    I didn't vote for Billy Klinton.

    And if I still can be considered to "have elected our enemy" it is only because I had to chose between merely a "bad" choice or the unwanted "worst" choice.

    We need more national political parties to give us more choices.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • Colonel PlinkColonel Plink Member Posts: 16,460
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    I didn't vote for Billy Klinton.

    And if I still can be considered to "have elected our enemy" it is only because I had to chose between merely a "bad" choice or the unwanted "worst" choice.

    We need more national political parties to give us more choices.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"


    Great point. I hate that we're relegated to the "lesser of 2 evils"

    "When the going gets weird, the Weird turn pro"
    Hunter S. Thompson"
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    One day, voters won't even bother turning out, simply because there is no "none of the above" options.

    And why waste your time with it, even if there was?

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • codenamepaulcodenamepaul Member Posts: 2,931
    edited November -1
    Watch for the first state to outlaw guns altogether. The ball will roll from there. I hope it happens soon.

    Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my gun.
  • bells_onbells_on Member Posts: 13 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hello All,

    My 2 cents:

    It took almost 400 years for Rome to fall, but it really didn't go away. If history is any indicator, we sit at about 50 years from "the end". There are a few things that I notice in these posts that maybe all of you should consider.

    1. The antis only have that power that we cede to them.
    2. The politicians can only exercise thier power at our pleasure.
    3. We (the gun folks) need to take a lesson from those who have already affected real change and GET ORGANIZED!
    4. Hate the ACLU? Maybe if enough of us joined the ACLU, we could get better representation in D.C.
    5. What is the NRA doing? Playing a lot of politics...They are in this for the long haul but they are not afraid to deal away small pieces of our rights.
    6. Bush is not the devil, neither is either Clinton. If there is a devil, it is the antis stupidity, and our laziness.
    7. Want converts to "our" cause, take some folks shooting who have no experience. Just take one little .22, and have a lot of fun while ADVOCATING and DEMANDING SAFETY AT ALL TIMES! Our greatest weapon is INFLUENCE over the public perception of US as a "fringe" segment of society.
    8. Talking about (or posting) the desire to take up arms against our nation, or our Neighbors is not going to do anything to change the perception of US in the eyes of those who willingly drink cool-aid.
    9. Look for and DEMAND that your local newspaper and Radio / TV stations report the news correctly as it relates to Firearms.
    10. Remember "Eddie Eagle"? Demand that your local school district include an "Eddie Eagle" program at least once a year in EVERY school! If we can disarm the antis with truth and fact that is self-evident for all to see, then that dreaded event-horizon will push further and further away.

    Last bit. School yourselves on how to make your own firearms. That may be your only recourse someday.
  • codenamepaulcodenamepaul Member Posts: 2,931
    edited November -1
    Right on bells-on. Any person serious about this is working to learn how to build/repair their or other firearms, as well as other improvised weapons. Think Liberator pistol....




    Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my gun.
  • shooter93shooter93 Member Posts: 322 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I guess this one has been beat to death ...but a few thoughts from an old guy. They will be confiscated when we allow it. People forget that the last revolution started when the British moved to seize an armory at Lexington-Concorde. Afriend of mine once asked, knowing how much I enjoyed firearms, what will you do when they take them from you?...I replies...it won't happen in my lifetime...He said...I'm not so sure...I replied..I am...this went around and around for a bit and he finaly said....they could just bring a 100 guys and take them...I replied....I didn't say they couldn't kill me to get them...I said...they won't get them in my lifetime. I pray this republic never has to endure another time of internal strife but if we do it will be for the same reasons...Govenment intrusion into free men's rights. I hope if it ever happens we have the resolve of our founding fathers.
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    Some do.

    Why do you suppose the intense scrutiny on American citizens by our oh so benevolent government ?

    Those on top are gathering information just as fast as they can..on AMerican citizens.

    The borders,of course,remain open...one really shouldn't have to wonder whom the elite consider to be enemies...
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'd be willing to bet if 11 Sep 2001 was carried out, even by a single gun, we would have faced the possibility of a firearm ban. Should another one happen, even without firearms in the mix, you can bet it will be on the table, and I believe even our President may sell us out.

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • allrndcowboy123allrndcowboy123 Member Posts: 318 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Welcome bells! I couldn't agree with you more. As a whole, gun owners complain more to one another about the problems and do so little to solve them! Screw the NRA! What have they done to help our cause? Its a waste of money. We need to do more ourselves. People who agree with the banning of guns are just affraid. They are affraid because of the seemingly neverendless rhetoric they see on TV. We just need to show them the truth.
  • dsmithdsmith Member Posts: 902 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have to say I have a degree of optimism on this one. I don't believe it will ever fully happen. TR pointed out how few people are doing anything about their rights. However, most of the people are sympathetic to gun owners to some degree.

    For example, I talked to some of the democrat supporters at my college. Most of them claimed to be at least somewhat pro-gun, but they were supporting the democrats over other issues. In one of my classes, at least 95% owned at least one firearm, regardless of political party. The GOA's fact sheet shows that most Americans are pro-gun.

    One other thing. The NRA frequently says that they have to be careful about becoming too pro-gun because they might lose the support of the voters. I don't believe this to be the case. As the GOA says, people don't generally go from being pro-gun to anti-gun. People who realize that guns don't cause problems generally can't be convinced that they should be banned. However, if people are anti-gun, their minds can be changed when they realize that gun owners in general are responsible citizens. Maybe if someone took them shooting, more would realize this. The point is, if someone supports owning guns up to the semi-auto handgun level, he won't suddenly decide to ban all guns just because the gun groups are trying to legalize full autos. He will continue to support handgun owners.

    The media claims that most Americans favor the "assault weapons" ban. However, after it expired, in full protest of the media, George Bush and the Republican party still annhilated the democrats.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by allrndcowboy123
    Welcome bells! I couldn't agree with you more. As a whole, gun owners complain more to one another about the problems and do so little to solve them! Screw the NRA! What have they done to help our cause? Its a waste of money. We need to do more ourselves. People who agree with the banning of guns are just affraid. They are affraid because of the seemingly neverendless rhetoric they see on TV. We just need to show them the truth.


    [:o)][:o)][:o)][:o)]

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by bells_on
    Hello All,

    My 2 cents:

    It took almost 400 years for Rome to fall, but it really didn't go away. If history is any indicator, we sit at about 50 years from "the end". There are a few things that I notice in these posts that maybe all of you should consider.

    1. The antis only have that power that we cede to them. If this naive statement was true, wouldn't the reverse also be true? The pro-gun people would only have the power that was "ceded" to us by the antis?
    2. The politicians can only exercise thier power at our pleasure. Do you ever notice what happens around you almost every day? The politicians frequently "excerise their power" without our pleasure
    3. We (the gun folks) need to take a lesson from those who have already affected real change and GET ORGANIZED! Here is a clue. WE ARE ORGANIZED! There are several great pro-gun organizations out there trying to help. But they need money, members and active participation by those members. Knowing this, what have you done lately?
    4. Hate the ACLU? Maybe if enough of us joined the ACLU, we could get better representation in D.C. I question whether you have paid the money or time to even join even one of the pro-gun organizations, so I doubt you would join the ACLU, even if that wasn't a bad idea.
    5. What is the NRA doing? Playing a lot of politics...They are in this for the long haul but they are not afraid to deal away small pieces of our rights. Welcome Sarah Brady
    6. Bush is not the devil, neither is either Clinton. If there is a devil, it is the antis stupidity, and our laziness. Interesting. Until now I hadn't realized the whole problem was nothing but the "antis stupidity" and our "laziness".
    7. Want converts to "our" cause, take some folks shooting who have no experience. Just take one little .22, and have a lot of fun while ADVOCATING and DEMANDING SAFETY AT ALL TIMES! Our greatest weapon is INFLUENCE over the public perception of US as a "fringe" segment of society. Some good common sense here.
    8. Talking about (or posting) the desire to take up arms against our nation, or our Neighbors is not going to do anything to change the perception of US in the eyes of those who willingly drink cool-aid.
    9. Look for and DEMAND that your local newspaper and Radio / TV stations report the news correctly as it relates to Firearms.
    10. Remember "Eddie Eagle"? Demand that your local school district include an "Eddie Eagle" program at least once a year in EVERY school! If we can disarm the antis with truth and fact that is self-evident for all to see, then that dreaded event-horizon will push further and further away. Your superfical involvement in the pro-gun rights movement is showing. Above you bashed the NRA. Well, guess who invented, runs and funds Eddie Eagle? The NRA. It is a great program but it is not free nor easy. It takes constant planning, man-power and money. Such stuff as my family and I take a hands-on, frontline effort in trying to help. Perhaps you should also.

    Last bit. School yourselves on how to make your own firearms. That may be your only recourse someday. we're too "lazy" remember? [:)]


    While I like your enthusiam, and if you are a gun owner/supporter I consider you at least a cousin, you probably should slow down, calm down and start thinking before you post such foolish thought, charges, ideas and suggestions.

    For just one example, you severly criticized the NRA without telling us which of the progun organizations you DO support. Plus with a new person such as you coming on and slamming the NRA you are sure to unnecessarily anger some members; such as me. My entire family is NRA and we not only pay what we can but we volunteer when we can. If you don't like the NRA, fine. But I will tell you that Handgun Control, Inc. and the antigun politicians don't like the NRA anymore than you do. But just stop and realize how your rantings against the NRA move you closer to people like Sen. Ted Kennedy than they do to someone like me and other gun rights supporters.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • allrndcowboy123allrndcowboy123 Member Posts: 318 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hey TR, man I agree with most of your posts. I am a lifetime member of the NRA, but what do they do? They say they win a small battle here and there or they project "fear" or whatever. But on a whole, how much is it helping? We never hear anything. We never see anything but the anti propaganda. They could take some of those millions and start doing something to educate the public. At least see to it the truth is out there.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Thanks for your supportative post, but frankly my typing fingers and my mind are just too tired to give you a fair and honest answer to your question of "What does the NRA do"? Not trying to insult you, but if you have been a life-long member and what with receiving your monthly NRA magazine and reading about what the NRA does, along with receiving requests for money with the NRA desperately begging for money and explaining why they need it and what they are going to do with it, then it would take me pages and pages of typing to convince you that the NRA, while not perfect (no one is) still does a whole lot for gun rights.

    Again, not to insult you, but to post a quick and easy point, if anyone here truly wants to know what the NRA has done, is doing and will do, then contact the NRA directly and ask. If you are polite about it and they still won't tell you, then by all means take/continue a stance against the NRA.

    You will get much more and better info by directly asking the NRA your question rather than asking me as I am not much more than a front line member.

    But in the mean time, be aware that for various reasons, there are numerous lies, exaggerations, half-truths and anti-NRA propaganda floating around out there. That is easy to understand because the NRA is the most hated pro-gun organization in the world in regards to such anti-gun groups such as The Brady Campaign, Sen. Ted Kennedy, the anti-gun liberal media, etc.

    The fact that the NRA is considered to be the number one enemy by such anti-gunners should tell all of you something good about the NRA without you even having to ask me.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • needmygunsneedmyguns Member Posts: 2,264 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    cold day in h/ll before they ever get mine

    JESUS SAVES
  • egatimraegatimra Member Posts: 469 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    someone said something about joining the ACLU. I have heard that the ACLU is antigun. They do not beleive the 2nd is an individual right, that it only grants the govn't the right to own guns. So, it might not be a good idea joining up with them.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by needmyguns
    cold day in h/ll before they ever get mine

    JESUS SAVES


    Well of course I side with you on that, but just for conversation let me ask you exactly how that will work. Tell me what you will do if it is not a cold day in h/ll and one of the following happens:

    Congress outlaws all guns in civilian hands. Provides penalty of mandatory 10 years in federal prison for anyone caught with even a .22 rifle/pistol. Now what will you do if:

    #1: Every minute of every day you know that if someway, somehow (there are many such ways)the feds learn you have guns you are going to the big house for a minimum of ten years.

    #2: Feds learn you have guns and kick in your door, hold you and your family at gunpoint, handcuff all of you and demand to know where your guns are hidden. With the prospect of a 10 year prison sentence for when you tell them where your guns are hidden.

    I'm just curious what you will do as it might help me decide what I will do.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • rkd3rkd3 Member Posts: 14 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I hope that I never see the day that guns are outlawed. this would just be one step closer to making our country more like a communist one.
    registration is the first step in confiscation.
    and, I hear that some states are already registering longguns as well as handguns.

    COLD DEAD FINGERS
    'nuff said
  • Rack OpsRack Ops Member Posts: 18,597 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    quote:Originally posted by needmyguns
    cold day in h/ll before they ever get mine

    JESUS SAVES


    Well of course I side with you on that, but just for conversation let me ask you exactly how that will work. Tell me what you will do if it is not a cold day in h/ll and one of the following happens:

    Congress outlaws all guns in civilian hands. Provides penalty of mandatory 10 years in federal prison for anyone caught with even a .22 rifle/pistol. Now what will you do if:

    #1: Every minute of every day you know that if someway, somehow (there are many such ways)the feds learn you have guns you are going to the big house for a minimum of ten years.

    #2: Feds learn you have guns and kick in your door, hold you and your family at gunpoint, handcuff all of you and demand to know where your guns are hidden. With the prospect of a 10 year prison sentence for when you tell them where your guns are hidden.

    I'm just curious what you will do as it might help me decide what I will do.



    TR, an actual description of what someone plans on doing in the event of the unthinkable is probably not advisable in the present day and age. If he said he would lock 'n load and shoot every cop (fed or otherwise) that came in range it would probably have him quietly sent to Gitmo for an extended stay. Telling everyone your going to bury your guns behind your house isn't the best idea either. The closer it is, the less talking people need to do.

    Molon Labe
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I agree. Letting everyone in the world know exactly what you would do is like playing Hold'em with your hand face up.

    Death to Tyrants!!!
    Lev 26:14-39

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
    "Followers of Christ, be armed."
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Well, yeah, but needmyguns might not share those feelings. I believe in giving a man a chance to speak for himself.

    Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
  • IAMAHUSKERIAMAHUSKER Member Posts: 2,479 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Every President (in my opinion) after they are elected are told what to do and what to say. Same for just about every congressman and the like. Folks don't you think it is weird how all these things come to pass and no one is ever responsible??? Seems they all loose their minds once they are elected!!!

    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." --Thomas Jefferson to Archibald Stuart, 1791. ME 8:276
  • IAMAHUSKERIAMAHUSKER Member Posts: 2,479 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I personally think that every offical should be held accountable for their VOTES. If said votes are found to be unconstitutional then they should be tried as a traitor and put to death!!!!!!!!!

    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." --Thomas Jefferson to Archibald Stuart, 1791. ME 8:276
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