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gunpreak: If you feel that that the best way to fight what is happening to our gun rights is to tell everyone you're not going to comply and/or physically resist any anti-gun legislation, that's fine. I'd prefer that it not reach that point. I would like to roll the antis back through laws, as opposed to shooting it out in the streets. The only way we beat them with laws is get more folks to the polls than them. The way we get more to the polls is introduce more to people to guns and shooting. You can prepare for Armageddon, I'll take my nephews to the range....
As to your perception that all antis are evil folks hell bent on taking our guns so they can "make us equal so they can gather together and force more stuff on you" all I can say is that this is wrong. Do you really think that the average 30 something suburban housewife who believes guns should be outlawed believes taking our guns away will make her "equal" to the guy across the street who owns a .45 and therefore would make easier to push her liberal agenda on him???? Of course its not. She believes that the gun itself is "evil". She's anti-gun because she's afraid that her neighbor's .45 will kill her or one of her kids. She doesn't believe that he needs to have it, because the police are there to protect her neighborhood. She doesn't understand hunting, because she's never been and the concept of resisting a tyrannical government is as absurd to her as a pig flying. People like this can be converted to our side, and once they are they are some the most vocal proponents of gun rights, because they bring a new prospective to our side.
I like the "high volume of sense and reason" I just read.[:)]
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
I always enjoy watching intelligent people struggle to think their way thru a problem. Always constructive..a learning experience.
For about 20 years before the Revolutionary War, good men tried endlessly and patiently to reform the Kings' policy towards America.
Other men saw the handwriting on the wall.
The end result will be the same..the British will march on Lexington...again....History repeats itself because the bulk of the people are too stupid,too trusting, too subservient.......
What never fails to amaze me is that, during the Colonial times, the people had only the printed press to derive any of their conclusions from, and they all saw the writing on the wall, when it come time. We have all the luxuries of a modern society that would have the colonists struck with awe to witness them, but yet, so many of us are dumb as a brick.
As for that "not all antis are evil" line, those who have railed against our rights as "antis" are specifically evil. Those who eat up those lines are either ignorant or just stupid. The ignorant ones or the plain neutral ones (the ones who don't care, one way or the other) are potential targets for learning, but what are we going to do about our children, who have every outlet of indoctrination passed before them through school and public influence, who are conditioned to abhor things that relate to firearms and violence?
The system cannot be changed, because it simply does not have, nor does it want our best interests taken into consideration. Lots of things are happening to us right under our noses and most of us don't see it.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
I DON'T THINK THAT THEY WILL CONFISCATE THEM I THINK THAT THE GOVERMENT WILL BAN ALL AMMO AND ALL AMMO RELOADING SUPPLIES CONFISCATING GUNS WOULD BE TOO MUCH OF OF A UNDERTAKING FOR THEM TO DO I THINK ITS TIME WE ALL STOCK UP ON AMMO...JUST MY THOUGHTS
" the milita of the United States consists of ALL able-bodied males at least 17 years of age" title 10, section 311 of the U.S code
Nighttrain: Stocking up on ammo doesn't help the current situation, any more than burying your guns will. You'll run out of ammo eventually, no matter how much you stock up on now. Making sure that the law to ban ammo or reloading supplies isn't passed is the best solution
The answer to this is obvious. The anti-freedom politicians and their supporters will continue in their quest to ban guns and curtail other rights. Eventually, owning a gun of any type will be so complicated and costly that only the government and the rich folks will have them. Everyone else will only have left what they have hidden away and didn't get confiscated. If William Cooper (the former Naval Intelligence operative is accurate in predicting what lies in store for us in the future then I am really scared). Read "Behold a Pale Horse" to see what he said. Some of his stuff may be off but what he says about government and the way they think and operate is pretty right on.
One more important thing. If massive gun confiscation happens, it won't be done by your local cops. You would be facing main battle tanks, Bradley fighting vehicles, troops in heavy body armor, check points, etc. Who thinks they can mount a long term battle against the organized military? William Cooper says in his book that some of the military has ALREADY trained to take over all aspects of local government. They also have built a lot of large concentration style camps for anyone dumb enough to organize with others and get their names on lists maintained by the government. That is one reason that any sort of gun permit system is no good. It just shows who owns firearms and where to find them.
The military will not be so organized when it comes to shooting their brother.
When the final act is rung up..do you want to live as a slave..? Or die a free man. The decision will be brought to each of us...some will do the honorable thing...some won't.
Highball hit the x-ring about the military breaking down somewhat in that situation. Even if he was wrong, and all the troops obeyed orders, there aren't enough of them to occupy the U.S. Look at Iraq if you think otherwise. 140,000 US troops on the ground there, and another 200,000 Iraqis supporting them. The situation is getting better, I think, but Iraq is ALOT smaller than the US
That being said, I still don't believe it will ever come to that. At least I hope it doesn't
The " Military is invulnerable" ploy is used often by folks that really want to go along with whatever the " Authorities" suggest...up to and including Martial Law.
The military is VERY good...indeed.
Was listening to the radio today...some sub for Rush Limberger. He was talking about China...seems to feel that the chinks represent some real danger to America,militarily. Seems the Chinese are far advanced in black box technology..working on knocking out our computers.
Knock out our military computers..we have no effective fighting forces any more. I expect we could not field 5000 rifleman , today..the Marines still supposedly teach the rifle..but I have heard nothing but bad about the training they are allowed to do..in this kinder,gentler age......
Some of us have never accepted the common wisdom...that China only wants to be trading buddies, and to make money. The part that IS true..is the 'making money' end...making money so they can buy and develop hardware to launch an attack on America....
Holy cow some of you guys are really into doom and gloom. I too am concerned about my rights and vote, and support XYZ organization, but I don't believe that COPS, or Tanks are going to show up in my suburbia america neighborhood just to get my guns. I think more likely is another terror attack or invasion which may cause the government to fall apart for a while. The result would be looting, panicked citizens, riots... complete pandemonium. In this situation, I'm more worried about my fellow americans who do not have the slightest interest in survivalism today(ie. gun ownership/marksmanship, hunting skills, fishing, alternative heat sources, food in storage, etc), and would be therefore less prepared and therefore desperate to survive by any means necessary than someone like me who could survive for a longer period of time without trying to rob, cheat, steal and lie. That's a bit off topic, but I certainly don't feel that the government as a whole is out to get me or my guns. Sure, some factions are but that's why there are checks and balances. Americans are much different than they were even 50 years ago. It's no longer a land of opportunity, it's a land of government hand outs and the people coming into our borders are not coming here for freedom - they are coming for greed and to exploit our government aid programs. Woops, even more off topic. Some things just need to be said. ANyhow, back to the gun rights topic - seriously why if all indicators are pointing to confiscation are more and more states passing CCW laws? Also, the brady bill came and went.. It seems like over the last 15 years there has been a swing to the antis viewpoint, but it appears now that it's starting to swing the other way. There will always be someone to oppose guns, and there will be always be someone pro guns. As I said at the beginning of this post, that's where the checks and balances come in. Yeah we have gun rights, but not wide open rights. I think I can live with that, and so can most people who are not extreme pro, or extreme anti.
jb6884: You said:seriously why if all indicators are pointing to confiscation are more and more states passing CCW laws?
I too pin my hopes on citizens always having the right to own handguns because the majority of states have passed laws which allow citizens to CCW. However, laws passed can be voided by new laws. Or, one federal law outlawing all gun ownership would automatically void all those state CCW laws.
It seems like over the last 15 years there has been a swing to the antis viewpoint, but it appears now that it's starting to swing the other way.
You act like that "swing to and swing back" just happened. Kinda like a normal change in climate. And that is not true. These changes come about because of lots of money and hard work being exerted on both sides of the gun argument. We pro-gun people are doing relatively well (for now and on a federal level only) but that can change in the next election. I hope you have been and will continue to be one of those people who actually works to keep our gun rights.
There will always be someone to oppose guns, and there will be always be someone pro guns.
there are more and more anti-gun people and fewer and fewer pro-gun people. At some point you might find yourself as being the only pro-gun person in America.
Also, the brady bill came and went..
I get the impression you did nothing to try and stop that bill in 1994 and did nothing to be sure that it really did expire in 2004.
tr fox comments in blue
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
there are more and more anti-gun people and fewer and fewer pro-gun people. At some point you might find yourself as being the only pro-gun person in America. I don't know if I agree with this. After 9/11 - I saw a whole new crowd at the gun shops here around St. Louis, and for the first time ever I found myself waiting in line to talk to someone. After our CCW law was passed, I find even more people consistently at the gun shops. What really struck me is how many women, and people other than white men are at the gun shops wanting to purchase a handgun. The same thing is true at the public shooting ranges. 10 years ago it was only busy around hunting season, but nowadays it's full almost all the time. I've had to wait for a booth there too, and walking down the line I see more women, and younger people than I used to, as well as small handguns. I am sure you are basing your statement on your own experience, but around here it sure seems like there are more people than ever getting into guns.
Also, the brady bill came and went..
I get the impression you did nothing to try and stop that bill in 1994 and did nothing to be sure that it really did expire in 2004. You're right about that, I was in High School when it was passed, and while I did own guns at that time I was too young to care. AND other than supporting my organization of choice financially, I did nothing personally to ensure it was expired. I was not trying to say that on a whim it came and went without blood sweat and tears from both sides, just stating that in terms of the gun rights "swing" it's now gone - an indicator to me that the ATF is not on their way to my house anytime soon.
jb6884, thank you for that rational and reasonable response.
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
"Fred"..is a dog,actually....but I have watched the progression over the last 6-8 years as frustration took its toll on that owner of a small business....The frustration of trying to awaken people too fat, dumb and happy to be called Americans.
A sad day in this " Land of the Free "....
The theory is simple..the world militaries no longer train riflemen. They train with minor calibers, inside 200 yards. Anything outside that is done with air support or tow missles....The ability to hit a target at 600-800 yards will be a deciding factor in any conflict,tomorrow....
The sad truth is that when the government comes for our guns the vast majority will just hand them over. Some will go underground with their collections and be betrayed by their own friends and relatives who will inform for cash rewards or help with their own legal problems.
Gun owners talk a good game of resistance but reality proves otherwise. Frankly, if gun owners had a stronger mindset and would really make confiscation both bloody and expensive the gun hating politicians and bureaucrats would leave us alone. If politicians who advocated restricting gun rights started disappearing or being executed for being the traitors they really are, gun control would become very unpopular. Gun hating politicians are real cowards who deserve to die for their attempts to steal our liberty and freedom.
Defender
Private investigator licensed in AZ & CA that specializes in self defense cases.
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Contrary as always...
I believe that the reason we don't have a gun ban TODAY is NOT because "of the NRA"...but because there are enough citizens left in America who WOULD resist...and the Elite know it.
As of yet..each time they get serious about this or that 'ban'...citizens FLOCK to the gun shows...buying ammunition and guns.Think about it....a serious number of them will take it personal..any attempt to remove these arms from their possession...
Notice my use of the word "Citizen". This is a person that believes in personal freedom...opposite "Slave"...those that believe in govenment interference in private affairs...
Never as long as free men will stand together for the Rights to Bare Arm's and it's going to be from my cold dead hand to get my gun's
There will be a day and it's soon coming that we will have the need to come to arm. [Just One More Act Of Terrorism] Will You Be Ready? quote:Originally posted by select-fire
When all the guns are confinscated ? Just your theory but how long are we talking..years???
quote:Originally posted by gunphreakI Think It's More Like Death To The Liberal's That Want To Take Away Your Rights For Self Protection, Home and Family
That about sums it all up.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
hey im not a number worshipper hell bent on killing blindly over it and claiming it was a well thought out miraculous thing, so I dunno. all I have to go on is where theres shifting movement of men and equipment that's available on the news. to be honest they can't really hide anything they're upto, it's too large an operation. like their deep underground base projects I've heard so much about. for instance the missile defenses in Turkey setting the ground for a potential US incursion. all over the news, but there's nothing you can do to stop it. Syria is a country on the US 'to topple' list and the missiles are on the Turkey-Syria border.
Comments
They play you like a flute...those hollow empty little men....
As to your perception that all antis are evil folks hell bent on taking our guns so they can "make us equal so they can gather together and force more stuff on you" all I can say is that this is wrong. Do you really think that the average 30 something suburban housewife who believes guns should be outlawed believes taking our guns away will make her "equal" to the guy across the street who owns a .45 and therefore would make easier to push her liberal agenda on him???? Of course its not. She believes that the gun itself is "evil". She's anti-gun because she's afraid that her neighbor's .45 will kill her or one of her kids. She doesn't believe that he needs to have it, because the police are there to protect her neighborhood. She doesn't understand hunting, because she's never been and the concept of resisting a tyrannical government is as absurd to her as a pig flying. People like this can be converted to our side, and once they are they are some the most vocal proponents of gun rights, because they bring a new prospective to our side.
Molon Labe
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
For about 20 years before the Revolutionary War, good men tried endlessly and patiently to reform the Kings' policy towards America.
Other men saw the handwriting on the wall.
The end result will be the same..the British will march on Lexington...again....History repeats itself because the bulk of the people are too stupid,too trusting, too subservient.......
What never fails to amaze me is that, during the Colonial times, the people had only the printed press to derive any of their conclusions from, and they all saw the writing on the wall, when it come time. We have all the luxuries of a modern society that would have the colonists struck with awe to witness them, but yet, so many of us are dumb as a brick.
As for that "not all antis are evil" line, those who have railed against our rights as "antis" are specifically evil. Those who eat up those lines are either ignorant or just stupid. The ignorant ones or the plain neutral ones (the ones who don't care, one way or the other) are potential targets for learning, but what are we going to do about our children, who have every outlet of indoctrination passed before them through school and public influence, who are conditioned to abhor things that relate to firearms and violence?
The system cannot be changed, because it simply does not have, nor does it want our best interests taken into consideration. Lots of things are happening to us right under our noses and most of us don't see it.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
"Followers of Christ, be armed."
" the milita of the United States consists of ALL able-bodied males at least 17 years of age" title 10, section 311 of the U.S code
Molon Labe
The military will not be so organized when it comes to shooting their brother.
When the final act is rung up..do you want to live as a slave..? Or die a free man. The decision will be brought to each of us...some will do the honorable thing...some won't.
That being said, I still don't believe it will ever come to that. At least I hope it doesn't
Molon Labe
The " Military is invulnerable" ploy is used often by folks that really want to go along with whatever the " Authorities" suggest...up to and including Martial Law.
The military is VERY good...indeed.
Was listening to the radio today...some sub for Rush Limberger. He was talking about China...seems to feel that the chinks represent some real danger to America,militarily. Seems the Chinese are far advanced in black box technology..working on knocking out our computers.
Knock out our military computers..we have no effective fighting forces any more. I expect we could not field 5000 rifleman , today..the Marines still supposedly teach the rifle..but I have heard nothing but bad about the training they are allowed to do..in this kinder,gentler age......
Some of us have never accepted the common wisdom...that China only wants to be trading buddies, and to make money. The part that IS true..is the 'making money' end...making money so they can buy and develop hardware to launch an attack on America....
God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??
I too pin my hopes on citizens always having the right to own handguns because the majority of states have passed laws which allow citizens to CCW. However, laws passed can be voided by new laws. Or, one federal law outlawing all gun ownership would automatically void all those state CCW laws.
It seems like over the last 15 years there has been a swing to the antis viewpoint, but it appears now that it's starting to swing the other way.
You act like that "swing to and swing back" just happened. Kinda like a normal change in climate. And that is not true. These changes come about because of lots of money and hard work being exerted on both sides of the gun argument. We pro-gun people are doing relatively well (for now and on a federal level only) but that can change in the next election. I hope you have been and will continue to be one of those people who actually works to keep our gun rights.
There will always be someone to oppose guns, and there will be always be someone pro guns.
there are more and more anti-gun people and fewer and fewer pro-gun people. At some point you might find yourself as being the only pro-gun person in America.
Also, the brady bill came and went..
I get the impression you did nothing to try and stop that bill in 1994 and did nothing to be sure that it really did expire in 2004.
tr fox comments in blue
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
A sad day in this " Land of the Free "....
The theory is simple..the world militaries no longer train riflemen. They train with minor calibers, inside 200 yards. Anything outside that is done with air support or tow missles....The ability to hit a target at 600-800 yards will be a deciding factor in any conflict,tomorrow....
God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??
Gun owners talk a good game of resistance but reality proves otherwise. Frankly, if gun owners had a stronger mindset and would really make confiscation both bloody and expensive the gun hating politicians and bureaucrats would leave us alone. If politicians who advocated restricting gun rights started disappearing or being executed for being the traitors they really are, gun control would become very unpopular. Gun hating politicians are real cowards who deserve to die for their attempts to steal our liberty and freedom.
Defender
Private investigator licensed in AZ & CA that specializes in self defense cases.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
"Followers of Christ, be armed."
I believe that the reason we don't have a gun ban TODAY is NOT because "of the NRA"...but because there are enough citizens left in America who WOULD resist...and the Elite know it.
As of yet..each time they get serious about this or that 'ban'...citizens FLOCK to the gun shows...buying ammunition and guns.Think about it....a serious number of them will take it personal..any attempt to remove these arms from their possession...
Notice my use of the word "Citizen". This is a person that believes in personal freedom...opposite "Slave"...those that believe in govenment interference in private affairs...
There will be a day and it's soon coming that we will have the need to come to arm. [Just One More Act Of Terrorism] Will You Be Ready? quote:Originally posted by select-fire
When all the guns are confinscated ? Just your theory but how long are we talking..years???
Bandit1947@aol.com
That about sums it all up.
Death to Tyrants!!!
Lev 26:14-39
Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.
Luke 22:36.
"Followers of Christ, be armed."
Bandit1947@aol.com