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los angeles police illegally siezed 30 guns my 30

kevin redrickkevin redrick Member Posts: 30 ✭✭
hello again from kevin redrick,

this is part 2, of my incident, with the los angeles police chief, william bratton, illegally seizing my 30 piece firearms collection, ive owned for 18 years.

on feb 24, 2006
i won a small victory, in the los angeles superior court.
i had my case transfered, to another court, div 134 15th floor
my trial date is march 10, 2006.

i also proved that the los angeles police dept, fabricated a false ex-felon drug sales conviction, against me.

i informed the court, D.A., and the assigned deputy public defender mr. salvador salgado, that i had contacted my state senator dianne feinstein, and informed her about the false fabricated drugs sales charge,
that lapd claimed was the reason for my arrest, and the d.a.,s order to have me re-submitt my finger print fis card, due to my denial of this drug charge.
i also presented the court, with the senators reply.

well, after my preliminary hearing, the D.A, decided to drop, the drug sales charge.
the D.A, now claims that the court discovered, that some one in 1993, got arrested for saling drugs, and used my name after this person got arrested.

that was a bold face lie.
they needed my new set of finger prints, to fabricate a criminal record file, but the senator,s response letter, blocked their
plot to frame me.

i have now, discovered how the los angeles police dept, are able to fabricate false criminal charges, against citizens.

this is done by simply diverting criminal cases, to the court room
of superior court judge marcelita v haynes.
this unjust corrupt court room, div 33, dept 633 continues to allow lapd, and the D.A.,s office
to get favorable unjust rulings, on their behalf, and gain unjust legal advantages, over
defendants, and their attorneys
during legal proceedings.

i also filed a complaint, with the
california commission on judicial performance, against superior court judge marcelita v haynes.

be advised, that the court has now charged me with 5 felonies.

1 for possession of a $4.00 pen knife, i purchased in 1994 from a mail order catalog/ smoky mountain knife works(1-800 251-9306

2 for possession of a under taker bowie knife, that had a knuckle guard, purchase from smoky mountain knife works in 1994.

3 for possession of 10 rounds of
12 gauge starburst bird bombs, which are used to scare pest birds.
the los angeles police dept, has declared these as explosives.
the bird bombs were purchase from a mail order catalog company called cheaper than dirt/ {elsewhere}.
these bird bombs are $6.49 per box of 5 !

4 for owning 6 rifles that lapd have declared as illegal assult weapons, which are

1 ruger mini 14

2 fal 308 sporter rifle

3 sar1 romanian 7.62x39

4sar1 romanian 7.62x39

5feg sporter 7.62x39

6 eagle arms m15a2 cal 223 remington.

the deputy public defender and the D.A. claim i am facing 5 years if convicted.

i told them ill take that chance.
i am looking foward to my day in court, since i have already spent 34 days in la,s deplorable jail system. conditions at this facility was shameful.


inmates slept on the floors, due

to a bed shortage, with vermin,

rodents, trash on the floors.

mentally ill inmates, were housed

with the general population, gang

members beat non-gang members,

inmates were forced to eat their

food standing up, on the floors,

or on their beds. no

dis-infectants was used in the

living quarters, many inmates were
ill,suffering from extreme cases

of athletes foot infections,

respiratory problems, un-treated

sores, rashes. sub-standard food

was served to the inmates, which

forced inmates to purchase food

products, from the pitchess

detention center canteen store, at
inflated prices. some inmates

often spent up to $200.00 per

month on food products to maintain


a healthy existence. the los

angeles sheriff,s deputies, which

operated this jail were often

rude,verbally abusive, poorly

trained, under-staffed. shortly

after i posted bail, a very

violent prison riot occured,

involving 2,000 inmates, which

resulted in the murder of 2

inmates. this jails deplorable

conditions, was a contributing

factor, to the 2 inmates death.

i contacted the secretary, in

charge of the california

department of corrections, mr.

roderick q. hickman, and informed

him about the deplorable

conditions, at this jail. he wrote

me back on a piece of stationery

paper, simply saying/ not cdcrc

issues thanks!

while i was in custody, the sheriff,s moved me from cell, to cell,often for unknown reasons.
this was done to prevent, anyone from finding me.

when i arrived at the jail, for processing, the on site officers were
confused as to why i was arrested, and
did not know what criminal charge, to book me for.

they and the male asian detective, who transported me to the jail, began searching the california penal code manual, in order to find the desired
criminal offense charge for me.

3 days later, i was given a strip search, and my inmate booking slip, was taken from me.

this allowed, the los angeles sheriff,s to alter my original arresting charge, to the new standing
charge of 12021 ca 1pc.

i have also discovered a document, that was left at my residence, by one of the officers, who had participated
in the search warrant.

this was a (receipt for property taken into custody.
it list my criminal charge as ( 12280 (b) pc, signed by lapd officer teresa
daugherty badge number (26859 .

this means, the criminal charge against me was changed 3 times, before my release from jail ?

the return to my residence, after bailing out of jail was indeed painful.

i came home, only to discover my residence, was left a complete mess.
lapd basically, decimated my residence.

i did video tape, the condition of my residence, after lapd,s departure.

i cant tell you my anger at the
national rifle association.
i have been a member of this organization for 15 years.
yet after repeated replys to them, letters, emails, etc, they never reponded, or wrote me back.

yet the california rifle, and pistol association responded immediately, and even refered me to a attorney.
my problem i cant afford the legal fees.
i have been out of work, for 1 year now.

im a 17 year licensed security guard, however i cant work until i solve these pending criminal charges.

lapd also illegally seized 2, of my bullet proof vest, ive owned for 10 years, which were owned, and used legally in my job profession.

these vest, brands were a paca =protection armor corporation of america, and a second chance level 3A, both included trama plates, which costed me an additional $123.00.

strangely, lapd removed the slings from 14 of my rifles, scopes from 3 of them, and took only 2 soft gun cases.

i asked lapd to please, store the handguns, in their cases, this would ensure that the firearms, are protected, from any future damage.

however the, lapd detective in charge, of my arrest, jerry kowalsky stated that no handgun cases, will be used to store my weapons, during the seizure,
and transport ?

strangely before my arrest, on nov 14 2004, i arrived at my residence
and discovered, that someone had entered my residence, and conducted a search?

foot prints, were left on my carpet, my sofa seats, were moved out of placement, food in my cabinet had been moved about, my 650lb american security safe, had been moved slightly

i reported these findings to my building manager Michael Retena, at the Park Wilshire Apartments,
who immediately had my locks changed.
however at that time, i did not detect, any items missing from my residence!

in the month of dec 2004, while at my security officer job, located at the Sun America center 1999 avenue of the stars, century city california, 2 co-workers approached me, and informed me that they heard, the los angeles police department, had searched my residence.

well, i asked these 2 employees, javier santoya, and alexander volkov, where did they obtain this information from?
co-worker javier santoya, stated that the police, made that statement.
co-worker alexander volkov, also gave me details, as to the contents, of my home, such as the type of video camera i owned,and 2 types of handguns i owned.

strange, because i never reported the intrusion on nov 14 2004, into my residence, to my co-workers, or the police at that time?

jan 2005, i discovered $200.00 cash, was missing from my safe.
at the time, i simply thought it was an accounting error, on my behalf.

march 11 2005,
as i was doing some laundry, in the building,s laundry room, a elderly tenant named miss bonnie apt unit 702, informed me
that if i did,nt want the police searching my apartment every month, i better stop doing bad things.
she would not give me more details.

march 24,2005
i conducted, an inspection of my firearms collection, only to discover, that 6 of my new unfired hadguns, had been recently fired/dis-charged?

march 30 2005
i wrote a letter to the los angeles police chief william bratton,informing him on all of the above events.
i also asked him why, would his officers, be entering my residence, conducting an unlawful search,and dis-charging my handguns, without my knowledge, or permmission?

on april 14 2005
i received a reply letter, from police chief william bratton, stating my complaint, was received, and i will be informed of the disposition, of the investigation.

april 28 2005

i received a 2nd relpy letter, from police chief william bratton
signed by john f. egan, captain
commanding officer.

this letter states that the los angeles police department, is conducting an investigation into my complaint.
also, the assigned investigating officer will be, detective david millan, complaint number cf-05-1800

after, i contacted detective millian, we arranged a future date,for a home interview.

however during my phone interview
with, detective millan, he revealed, to me that my land lord
macebth apartment systems, possibly gave police officers, acess into my residence, allowing them to commit these crimes against me.

detective millan, also wanted to know, if it was possible, that these officers, may have stolen some ammunition from me.
i told, detective millan, i wasn,t sure if any ammo was missing, however i would conduct a inventory search.

6-16-05
i made now, my 3rd phone call to detective david millan, leaving voice mails, inquiring about when will, i get my home interview, with him.
also, i had discovered, additional info, that i wanted to reveal to him.

6-16-05
my building manager, michael retena, told me he remembered, lapd officers, visiting him one day.
during this visit, these officers, asked michael retena, for a personal favor.

which was, to allow these officers,acess into my apartment, only to have a look around, without my permmission.
michael, told me he told these officers NO, because giving them access, into my residence would be illegal, and he did not want any problems.

6-17-05
i left another voice mail, for detective david millan, only to discover, that his phone number now belongs, to a detective sanchez' a female, in internal affairs division?

6-21-05
i received a phone call from detective sgt.sanchez internal affairs, at 7.09 am hrs.
sgt.sanchez, states that she was told to give me a message from
detective david millan.
that message was, david millan, had asked for a leave of absence, due to some personal problems.
however, he would contact me in about 1 month.

6-21-05
i found this message, to be very strange.
so i called, sgt.sanchez,s boss
Lt.smith, at 0;836.am hrs
lt.smith, told me that detective davd millan, no longer works, for the department, he has chosen, to leave the department.
i told Lt. smith, thats odd, because, sgt. sanchez told me, 10 minutes ago, that detective millan, had asked for leave of absence.

LT.smith now claimed, yeah detective, millan took a leave of absence, however detective millan, would call me in a month.

well i never, heard again from
detective david millan, again.

6-22-05
a police officer assigned to the
rampart division police station
came to my residence, at my request, to take a burglary report.

this police officer, mr. janecck, badge number 34869, during his investigation, wanted to know how
could i tell, that my firearms, had been dis-charged/fired?

he also wanted to know if i was missing, any ammunition?

july 15 2005
i received a voice mail, from a sgt. hugo gutteriz, who stated he has been assinged, to my internal affairs complaint investigation.
also, he would be, contacting me in about 2 weeks to set up a home interview.

7-21-05
i get another call from sgt.hugo gutteriz, saying due to him be assigned additional cases, it will be another 2 weeks, before he can meet with me.

8-15-05
i was told that my building manager michael retena, had been fired/terminated.
this was confirmed, by several building tenants, and the building,s manager stephanie toscano.

9-20-05
sgt.hugo gutteriz arrived at my residence, with an unnkown male hispanic detective, to conduct my home interview.
during this interview, sgt. hugo gutteriz, continued to try, putting words in my mouth, as to what my taped testimony should be.
he, tried to manipulate me, and alter my testimony, about my complaints, to the police chief william bratton.

during the interview, sgt.hugo gutteriz,frequently would stop the tape recorder, during my interview, each time i made a statement, he objected to.
i asked him, why are you constantly, stopping the tape recorder during, this interview?
sgt. hugo g. claimed the tape recorder, was suppose, to do that.?

sgt, hugo gutteriz, altered my testimony, as to me saying lapd officers, had stolen some of my assult weapons, and fired them.
not true, i only told the chief of police that 6 of my handguns had been dis-charged.
sgt. hugo, gutteriz, also asked me to open my gun safe, so that he could view my weapons.
i did.

sgt. hugo gutteriz, then turned on the tape recorder, and asked me to give him some detail about my 30 weapons ive collected, over a 18 year period.
i did.
he then, told me before he left, my residence, that making a false
complaint, about a police officer is a felony., are you aware of that.

i told him yes, im aware of that.
why would i want, to make a false complaint, about a police officer.

also, before sgt.hugo gutteriz left, my residence, he and his
partner, told me i should be looking at the f.b.i, instead of the los angeles police department.

==================================

if you read the 2 post of mines, and wish to help retain the gun rights, of law abiding citizens, please contact, any of the below listed agencies, and demand a full investigation into my false arrest, false imprisonment, illegal weapons seizure, and the illegal court proceedings, taking place in superior court judge marcelita v haynes court room. 210 west temple street la california 90012

you may also want to veiw, this below website, to learn about my legal right, to own my legally california purchased assult weapons.

awbansunset.com

====================================================================



please contact any of these below agencies, via email, letters, phone calls, and inform them of the legal injustices, occuring in los angeles daily.
==================================

white house president bush
vice president d. cheny
202 456-1414

la county board of supervisors
213 974-1411

office of the city attorney
213 978-2173

cnn news media
[email protected]

california commission on judicial performance / report corrupt judge
marcelita v haynes
415 557-1200
415 557-1266 fax

public defenders office
report corrupt public defender mr. salvador salgado
213 893-2398

national rifle association
703 267-1250


office of la mayor
213 978-0600

office of the governor
916 445-9555

senator dianne feinstein
feinstein.senate.gov
phone /202 224-3841

city news service media outlet
[email protected]
310) 481-0401

policeabuse.org

awbansunset.com

copwatch.net

police watch
213 387-3325

los angeles county bar association
213 627-2727

cnn news organization
[email protected]

california division of law enforcement
916 227-3841

office of the city attorney
213 978-2173

california department of justice
916 445-9555

california fraternal order of police
president roger mayberry
707 456-0312

international association of chiefs of police
703 836-6767

bureau of alcohol tobacco and firearms
washington d.c director
mr. carl truscott www.atf.gov

office of the california governor
916 445-9555

los angeles times news media outlet
202 west 1st street
los angeles california 90012
213 237-5000
[email protected]

arizona senator john mccain
5353 north 16h street suite 105
phoenix arizona 85016

mccain.senate.gov


u.s senate majority leader
senator bill frist
509 hart senate office building
washington d.c 20510
202 224-3344
fax 202 228- 1264

senator dianne boxer
boxer.senate .gov


thanks have a great day

kevin redrick

criminal case number ba29134701

booking number 8761400

la superior court div 134 judge mark v mooney

trial date march 10 2006
==================================
my email addresses below

[email protected]

[email protected]
«134

Comments

  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    I am also unhappy that the NRA has not at least taken a few seconds to respond to you. I sent them an email complaining about that and indicated that I was speaking for three NRA members in my family. The NRA did not respond to my email either.

    Since I am known as a strong NRA supporter I felt I must be honest about this and to also mention why I will continue to support the NRA as well as other pro-gun rights groups. By so doing I am being consistant in that I have long mentioned that the NRA is starved for funds and needs more members on their membership list to try and get the necessary political clout and just is not able to help individual gun owners with their legal problems unless it is such an easy and sure win and high profile case that the money and effort spent by th NRA would provide a major payback in more secure gun rights for everyone. The Katrina Hurricane N.O. gun confiscations is one example of such an NRA action that had positive nationwide gun rights results.

    Frankly, if I encountered my own local gun problem I doubt the NRA would help me. But one would think the NRA could at least respond to emails asking for help as in the case of Kevin Redrick and the email I sent.
  • COLTCOLT Member Posts: 12,637 ******
    edited November -1
    ...dam*! that bites big time! I feel for you, and good luck...I'll shoot off a few emails, but, I have sent a LOT of emails to the nra, and have gotten only ONE "real" reply...not automated response. Politicians, news agencys, same thing...if answered, were automated...best of luck to you...and, if/when this is over, GET THE HELL OUT OF THAT HASBEEN, ANTI-GUN, GODFORSAKEN HOMO INFESTED STATE...[xx(]


    ani-texas-flag.gif
  • dsmithdsmith Member Posts: 902 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Everybody on these boards know that I think the NRA gives up too much ground. That having been said, I know that they stopped responding to my email a while back.

    I wish you well with your legal problems.
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    I am also unhappy that the NRA has not at least taken a few seconds to respond to you. I sent them an email complaining about that and indicated that I was speaking for three NRA members in my family. The NRA did not respond to my email either.


    Why bother with a few disgruntled members, they have millions more checks to collect.

    I think that the guys who run the NRA have multi million dollar homes, trucks that cost more than a house on an acre of land, Enough land to form a small nation.

    fooey on paying them people anything. [:(!]


    I really dont know what to say to help you out of a legal fight. Kentucky has owner friendly laws, be advised we also have one of the most extreme cases of border madness. Tobacco farms, Unstoppable housing market, Horse farms all contribute to the illegals here its absolutely SICKENING. Tell the judge to enforce the laws protecting us from invading nations (mexico, honduras, etc, etc...) Tell him you will take YOUR arms and move to texas to help guard the border in his name :) If he doesnt listen to that tell him to rot in hell.

    Someone posted in another thread about these politicians, judges, legislators; They take an oath to DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION and it has become an extremely lucrative market in the interpretation of that document. My best advice would be to mortgage your house and get a good damn lawyer, it's their game and you WILL play.
  • WoundedWolfWoundedWolf Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:4 for owning 6 rifles that lapd have declared as illegal assult weapons, which are
    1 ruger mini 14
    2 fal 308 sporter rifle
    3 sar1 romanian 7.62x39
    4sar1 romanian 7.62x39
    5feg sporter 7.62x39
    6 eagle arms m15a2 cal 223 remington.

    These items can get you in BIG trouble in Cali, Kevin. I hope you have receipts of purchase for them showing that they were bought pre-AWB. The Mini-14 is probably okay if you didn't customize it, no pistol grip or collapsable stock. The FAL, Sar1, Feg, and AR-15 could get you in a deep pile of crap. I hope the LAPD didn't walk away with all your paperwork on these guns, proving you had them before the ban, otherwise your pooch is screwed.
  • kevin redrickkevin redrick Member Posts: 30 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    be advised that i had the purchase
    invoices, for all 30 firearms.
    all of my weapons are post-ban.
    lapd took the invoices, however
    i was able to get, one of the arresting detectives, who took me into custody, to mention in court
    on record, that they lapd have the invoices.

    lapd claims, that even if my weapons are post ban, i should have registered, them with the dept of justice, before 2001.
    i was never aware of this, or told his but the dealer.
    the california attorney general, who is in charge of the gun registery data base, has refused to prosecute me, for owning these weapons legally.
    its just lapd, deputy public defender salvador salgado, and judge marcelita v haynes, agenda tp prosecute me.

    i will prevail, in this false, arrest,and fabricated criminal case.

    my goal now is to, have a internal investigation launched, into the rampant corruption, that exist in the district attorneys office, public defenders office, lapd,and superior court judge marcelita v haynes court room div 33 dept 633.

    kevin redrick
    have a great day
  • COLTCOLT Member Posts: 12,637 ******
    edited November -1
    Kevin quote:lapd claims, that even if my weapons are post ban, i should have registered, them with the dept of justice, before 2001.
    i was never aware of this, or told his but the dealer.


    ...this is not meant in a negative way but, "ignorance" of the law, is NOT a viable defense...[;)]


    ani-texas-flag.gif
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    I am also unhappy that the NRA has not at least taken a few seconds to respond to you. I sent them an email complaining about that and indicated that I was speaking for three NRA members in my family. The NRA did not respond to my email either.


    Why bother with a few disgruntled members, they have millions more checks to collect.

    I think that the guys who run the NRA have multi million dollar homes, trucks that cost more than a house on an acre of land, Enough land to form a small nation.

    fooey on paying them people anything. [:(!]


    I really dont know what to say to help you out of a legal fight. Kentucky has owner friendly laws, be advised we also have one of the most extreme cases of border madness. Tobacco farms, Unstoppable housing market, Horse farms all contribute to the illegals here its absolutely SICKENING. Tell the judge to enforce the laws protecting us from invading nations (mexico, honduras, etc, etc...) Tell him you will take YOUR arms and move to texas to help guard the border in his name :) If he doesnt listen to that tell him to rot in hell.

    Someone posted in another thread about these politicians, judges, legislators; They take an oath to DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION and it has become an extremely lucrative market in the interpretation of that document. My best advice would be to mortgage your house and get a good damn lawyer, it's their game and you WILL play.


    In red above. Well, yeah and if there was more than one or two other, better and viable, national pro-gun organizations out there to turn to in place of the NRA I also would stop paying and stop supporting the NRA. In the meantime I think of the NRA and their sometimes irrating ways as you having a life threatening car accident and you are lying along side the highway soon to die of your injuries. Yet a gruff, rough, doctor stops and starts working to save your life. Heck, you might even know and dislike that particular doctor, but just as with the NRA, you should be damn glad they are there.

    BTW, if you don't pay the NRA to try and save your gun rights, just who DO/ARE you paying or supporting? In my case it is the NRA, GOA, and SAF.
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox

    BTW, if you don't pay the NRA to try and save your gun rights, just who DO/ARE you paying or supporting? In my case it is the NRA, GOA, and SAF.


    Nobody. I have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys. I pay no one to defend my godgiven right to be able to protect myself.
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    KYplumber, most of these folks live in places that ain't as gun friendly as KY is. Makes think of just how lucky we are. Not that we don't have problems, we do. But we are still A very free state.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox

    BTW, if you don't pay the NRA to try and save your gun rights, just who DO/ARE you paying or supporting? In my case it is the NRA, GOA, and SAF.


    Nobody. I have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys. I pay no one to defend my godgiven right to be able to protect myself.


    Then you are not very smart. In fact, you belong in the "dumb-*" catagory. People before you paid money, time, effort and sometimes blood just so that you could "have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys.". Aren't you at least smart enough to understand that on a daily basis there are thousands of man hours and thousands of dollars spent by the anti-gun forces trying to take away your gun rights? The ONLY reason that hasn't happened to you is, because unlike you, there are gun owners who are willing to spend a little time, money and effort working to save our gun rights. If we were all like you and just sit back and let the "other guy" do it, we would have NO gun rights at all by now.

    Now I will take some criticism of groups like te NRA from good gun owners who are actually in the fight along side me, but I will not listen to slackers like you.

    So go ahead and sit there all happy and content with your "God-given gun rights" but when you feel like criticizing the NRA you can Shut the poofed up!
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox

    BTW, if you don't pay the NRA to try and save your gun rights, just who DO/ARE you paying or supporting? In my case it is the NRA, GOA, and SAF.


    Nobody. I have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys. I pay no one to defend my godgiven right to be able to protect myself.


    Then you are not very smart. In fact, you belong in the "dumb-*" catagory. People before you paid money, time, effort and sometimes blood just so that you could "have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys.". Aren't you at least smart enough to understand that on a daily basis there are thousands of man hours and thousands of dollars spent by the anti-gun forces trying to take away your gun rights? The ONLY reason that hasn't happened to you is, because unlike you, there are gun owners who are willing to spend a little time, money and effort working to save our gun rights. If we were all like you and just sit back and let the "other guy" do it, we would have NO gun rights at all by now.

    Now I will take some criticism of groups like te NRA from good gun owners who are actually in the fight along side me, but I will not listen to slackers like you.

    So go ahead and sit there all happy and content with your "God-given gun rights" but when you feel like criticizing the NRA you can Shut the poofed up!


    dont question my intelligence, or tell me to shut the poofed up. Because youre dumb enough to pay for something you already own dont question me. I will spend blood, dont believe me? come poofed with me or my GOD GIVEN RIGHTS

    Its idiot son of a gripees that think money will wash a problem away...
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    trfox, I dont know what you do for a living, but right now i am in a squeeze; I am in the housing industry, which has declined 50% in the past few months (locally). The reason I do not know, maybe rising interest, maybe 20,000 illegals built 100,000 styrofoam build by number houses. Either way supply outweighs demand at the moment.

    If i threw money at everything i believed in and cared for i would be homeless, naked and starved.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox

    BTW, if you don't pay the NRA to try and save your gun rights, just who DO/ARE you paying or supporting? In my case it is the NRA, GOA, and SAF.


    Nobody. I have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys. I pay no one to defend my godgiven right to be able to protect myself.


    Then you are not very smart. In fact, you belong in the "dumb-*" catagory. People before you paid money, time, effort and sometimes blood just so that you could "have pistols, revolvers, rifles and other toys.". Aren't you at least smart enough to understand that on a daily basis there are thousands of man hours and thousands of dollars spent by the anti-gun forces trying to take away your gun rights? The ONLY reason that hasn't happened to you is, because unlike you, there are gun owners who are willing to spend a little time, money and effort working to save our gun rights. If we were all like you and just sit back and let the "other guy" do it, we would have NO gun rights at all by now.

    Now I will take some criticism of groups like te NRA from good gun owners who are actually in the fight along side me, but I will not listen to slackers like you.

    So go ahead and sit there all happy and content with your "God-given gun rights" but when you feel like criticizing the NRA you can Shut the poofed up!


    dont question my intelligence, or tell me to shut the poofed up. Because youre dumb enough to pay for something you already own dont question me. I will spend blood, dont believe me? come poofed with me or my GOD GIVEN RIGHTS

    Its idiot son of a gripees that think money will wash a problem away...


    You show your ignorance by acting like it is ONLY about money. It is about money only to the extent that the pro-gun people have to have and intelligently spend money to counter the huge sums spent by the anti-gun crowd. The same anti-gun crowd that is constantly working to take away your "God given gun rights". In addition to "money" it is also about millions of gun owners working together to pass good gun rights laws; or to defeat bad laws. Or gun owners spending the time, MONEY and effort to get pro-gun rights people elected; or to get anti-gun rights people thrown out of office. And the ONLY way you yourself can even THINK about being an effective part of this pro-gun rights battle is if you sign up with at least one of the few pro-gun rights organizations that for years have been STARVING due to lack of membership and lack of dues with which to carry on the pro-gun rights battle.

    BTW, how much can you tell me about the AWB? What it is, where it came from and where and why it went someplace. I truthfully doubt you have even a clue about the huge gun rights battle that was fought over the AWB. Fought by good and honest gun owners who weren't too lazy and cheap to put something on the table to help with the fight. I'm sure you were too busy enjoying your "God-given gun rights" to help with that battle.

    And I'm not gonna be the one to come after your guns, you idiot. I'm a gun owner just like youself and as long you are nothing more than cheap, lazy and a free rider (I.E. not crazy or a violent criminal, etc) I want you TO KEEP YOUR GUNS as I want to keep mine.
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Now TR, me and you going to have to disagree on this. I am going to be blatantly honest with you. THe nra don't give A fark about you, me, or our gun rights. THey continue to compromise away our rights, and will continue to do so. SO when you go tellin A free citizen as those of us here in KY are that we are members of the dumbazz crowd for not supporting an arginazation that compromise our rights away, you got some real problems. If more folks would take up the attitude such as we have here, that being come * our guns if you think you can take them, there would be no gun laws. It's the kind like you that are willing to crawl, and beg for the rights which are yours that are members of the dumbazz crowd, or should we say cowardly crowd. Witch ever shoe fits, were it.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by KYfatboy
    Now TR, me and you going to have to disagree on this. I am going to be blatantly honest with you. THe nra don't give A fark about you, me, or our gun rights. THey continue to compromise away our rights, and will continue to do so. SO when you go tellin A free citizen as those of us here in KY are that we are members of the dumbazz crowd for not supporting an arginazation that compromise our rights away, you got some real problems. If more folks would take up the attitude such as we have here, that being come * our guns if you think you can take them, there would be no gun laws. It's the kind like you that are willing to crawl, and beg for the rights which are yours that are members of the dumbazz crowd, or should we say cowardly crowd. Witch ever shoe fits, were it.


    Good points made by you. However, I NEVER say that anyone has to or should belong to the NRA. But I do say that they need to belong to at least ONE of the few good national gun rights groups. If no one belonged to or supported the NRA, GOA, SAF, CCRKBA, JPFO, etc. then NONE of us would still have any gun rights. Yeah, if you live out in the hills and have your guns hidden away, you might still have your "guns" but you would not have the right to own them. And the first time the law hears about your guns, the guns are gone and you are in prison.

    And in the case of a gun owner who is proud of his gun ownership, yet has apparently by his own admission, never done even one damn thing to try and save those guns rights, well, he doesn't have the right to criticize the NRA or criticize anybody else. Nor has he earned the right to even own his guns.

    When legislators in N.Y. city, and Washington, D.C. and N.J. and now the handgun ban in S.F., CA were passing their laws banning guns COMPLETELY they didn't give one damn about anyone's "God-given rights". All they cared about was what they could get away with and still keep their cushy government job. And if we pro-gun people don't start working harder, that gun ban now in a few cities will someday be nationwide.

    If you aren't worried about gun rights for yourself, at least think about your childen and grandchildren.
  • wurtzingerwurtzinger Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Kevin,

    This is one of the many reasons I don't live in California or belong to the NRA any more. The Second Amendment only prohibits the federal government from infringing on the right to keep and bear arms. The states can ban any type of weapon they choose. Leave California, if they will let you.

    As for the NRA, I was a member for over 10 years and seriously considered becoming a lifetime member. Then they sold out on the machine gun ban and tried to tell their members that it was a defeat for gun control because it reduced the paperwork for people who sold ammunition.

    Let me say that again, The NRA supported banning an entire class of firearms because it reduced the paperwork for people who sold ammunition. Does that sound like a victory for the right to keep and bear arms?

    They not only sold out their members, they lied to us and insulted our intelligence. At that point, it became obvious to me that they were an organization of lobbyist for the firearms industry and that their individual members were nothing but useful idiots. Unfortunately, as Lincoln said, you can fool some of the people all of the time.
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox Nor has he earned the right to even own his guns.


    god help us all...
  • HighballHighball Member Posts: 15,755
    edited November -1
    When the British marched to Lexington to confiscate the arms of the Colonists...The Colonists resisted.

    Were that to happen today...and nobody resisted...WE DAMN ALL DESERVE TO LOSE ALL THE GUNS.Plus this illusion of freedom people diddy-bop around pretending about......

    Once again, Tr...the guns remain because the Elitists still realize that a total ban WOULD start a shooting war..and they are not quite ready for that. The NRA funnels information to the Elitists..keeping them appraised of exactly what the 'gun owners' of America will accept today, in the way of controls...without kicking up too much of a fuss....They do this covertly..or overtly..by relaying how much pressure is being raised by this or that gun control law....

    The final outcome of this is to totally destroy freedom in America...by delaying the inevitable until there are none left smart enough to resist. The fed-gov propaganda camps take the kids away from weak parents...and train slaves.
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Let me just say, if anyone wants my guns, or my money, molon labe.[}:)]
  • WoundedWolfWoundedWolf Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:lapd claims, that even if my weapons are post ban, i should have registered, them with the dept of justice, before 2001.
    i was never aware of this, or told his but the dealer.
    the california attorney general, who is in charge of the gun registery data base, has refused to prosecute me, for owning these weapons legally.
    its just lapd, deputy public defender salvador salgado, and judge marcelita v haynes, agenda tp prosecute me.

    I prefer to keep this topic about helping Kevin. Perhaps I am naive, or just understand that he is living in a human cesspool (ehem, AIMSML_MSSML take note), but I believe that he is telling the truth.

    Kevin, do not take these charges lightly, even if the DOJ is not prosecuting. You are fighting your battle in the heart of the beast. It sounds like you have stirred up a hornets nest and I doubt they will retreat without tasting some more of your blood. Perhaps it is time to call that CRPA lawyer. Even if they ask for money, try to just ask for 20 minutes pro bono over the phone to explain your case. Perhaps if you can be very concise and articulate then at the very least they may choose to look into your case further.

    Lastly, be prepared to do the time. Get your house in order. I hope you have friends or family that you can rely upon. I am curious how you are getting along. Do you still live in your apartment? How are you getting by without work?

    If you need help then there are people out there. You just need to ask.

    Good luck to you, my friend.

    -Wolf
  • codenamepaulcodenamepaul Member Posts: 2,931
    edited November -1
    Gotta pipe in here. First for you TR-Long time member of NRA. Supporter of ILA. GOAL member-5 years (since moving to MA)

    TR your belief in the effect of the NRA is unfounded. LaPierre makes how much per year? They do little more than slow the march to tyranny and are little impediment to that. To believe that they have done as much as you give them credit for is little more than foolish. However,I still support them. Why? My reasoning is this and this alone:
    If you come for my stuff, I will fire upon you. I supported my end of the soft conflict until I see there is no longer a soft conflict to have. Don't say you weren't warned, that I did not "compromise", or am being unreasonable. All this was tried and still the anti crowd would not stop. Now you come to me,on my terms and turf, to take what is mine. In collusion with the government, you (the anti's) will have sent, perhaps, good men to die over something you believe in. Have not the guts yourself to face my wrath, but sent minions for me to pile in your way.

    Got it?
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by codenamepaul
    Gotta pipe in here. First for you TR-Long time member of NRA. Supporter of ILA. GOAL member-5 years (since moving to MA)

    TR your belief in the effect of the NRA is unfounded. LaPierre makes how much per year?

    They do little more than slow the march to tyranny and are little impediment to that. To believe that they have done as much as you give them credit for is little more than foolish. However,I still support them. Why? My reasoning is this and this alone:
    If you come for my stuff, I will fire upon you. I supported my end of the soft conflict until I see there is no longer a soft conflict to have. Don't say you weren't warned, that I did not "compromise", or am being unreasonable. All this was tried and still the anti crowd would not stop. Now you come to me,on my terms and turf, to take what is mine. In collusion with the government, you (the anti's) will have sent, perhaps, good men to die over something you believe in. Have not the guts yourself to face my wrath, but sent minions for me to pile in your way.

    Got it?


    In red above. Well, how much DOES he make? His salary seems to bother you and I doubt either of us knows exactly how much he makes. Beside, how much SHOULD he make? Surely enough to keep him on the job. And I would chose an organization that only "slows the march towards tyranny" as compared to NO organization and NOTHING so as to at least slow the march towards tyranny. Besides, if even half of America's gun owners were willing to spend a little time, money and effort in an ORGANIZED effort to fight for our rights, we would have such strength that there would be no problems for us such as we have now.

    I've already mentioned that the NRA is not perfect. But just as living in an isolated village and having only one physician, if you need serious help, you are probably going to be grateful for the good that physician can/does do for you. We gun owners are kinda in that type situation. There are only a small number of national gun right organizations in America fighting for our rights. The fact that we still have gun rights in most places tells me that SOMEBODY has been putting up a pretty good fight. Just as with having car and home insurance, I will contine to cover my bases by supporting the NRA, GOA and SAF as well as taking my own actions.

    Besides, without doing months of research I chose to believe the NRA does more good than harm. Just one small fact to backup my belief is that about 4 million people seem to agree with me each year by being members of the NRA. Now I now people can be fooled. But if the NRA was truly worthless, I truly don't believe that many people could be fooled enough to continue their support each year.

    And as long as you are helping with the "soft war" fight, I have nothing but agreement with your stated attitude, as I understand it. Anyone helping with the soft war, whether they believe in what they are doing or not, deserves the right to plan or have any other opinions they care to have. At least in my book.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by KYfatboy
    Let me just say, if anyone wants my guns, or my money, molon labe.[}:)]


    Well, you are willing to resist unconstituional actions taken against you and that is good. But everone should know by now that it is smarter to offer organized resistance and try to avoid the sitution whereas you have to fight for your rights with a gun at your front door while your family hides in the bedroom. And with the outcome possibly not to your likeing.

    And one very important way to fight that fight is to join up with your fellow gun owners and pool your time, money and political clout and try to make sure that you never have to fight it out at your front door.

    BTW, KYplumber is a gun owner/lover as am I. To a degree that kinda makes us cousins. Although I don't agree with him sitting back enjoying his gun rights without helping with the fight to keep those rights, as he learns more about how the world works he might change his attitude for the better.

    At least I can relate to his present attitude as it kinda matches mine when I was a young man.

    Call this regret for me being so harsh on him or whatever.
  • codenamepaulcodenamepaul Member Posts: 2,931
    edited November -1
    Glad to see no hard feelings were taken, as none were meant. As I said I am a longtime (at least 15 years)member of the NRA and regularly send funds to the ILA-couple hundred a year at least. Not to mention GOAL. Likely the most effective gun rights org in America. Working in Indian country to boot. Much good has been done here in MA in the 5 years I've been here.

    My point about LaPierre is this-I don't know or really care what he makes, likely several million a year. This, in my opinion, would put him into the "elite" end of things. I see there being little difference who you work for. The mindset remains and the result the same.

    My point still stands tho', if I make an effort on the soft side, no one can deny or say my use of the hard side was unjustified when that day comes
  • Rack OpsRack Ops Member Posts: 18,597 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It wasn't so very long ago that we were looking for a court case to push "up the ladder" to the SCOUS. Have we found it?

    Contact a promineant pro-2nd ammendment lawyer, let him look over your case. If the facts of this case are what you say, you can count on me to send some cash for your legal defense.
  • WoundedWolfWoundedWolf Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:But everone should know by now that it is smarter to offer organized resistance and try to avoid the sitution whereas you have to fight for your rights with a gun at your front door while your family hides in the bedroom. And with the outcome possibly not to your likeing.

    So true, so true...
  • amsptcdsamsptcds Member Posts: 679
    edited November -1
    What the hell did you do to piss those people off for them to come after you like that?
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    Originally posted by KYfatboy

    BTW, KYplumber is a gun owner/lover as am I. To a degree that kinda makes us cousins. Although I don't agree with him sitting back enjoying his gun rights without helping with the fight to keep those rights, as he learns more about how the world works he might change his attitude for the better.

    At least I can relate to his present attitude as it kinda matches mine when I was a young man.

    Call this regret for me being so harsh on him or whatever.


    I live in Kentucky; all i need to do to further my right to own a weapon is go buy 1. We have NEXT TO NILL for gun laws here.

    GOD BLESS KENTUCKY after fletcher leaves or dies :)
    he's such a puke... so is the mayor of lexington
    these 2 people are why i think public hangings should be reinstated...
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    +1 Got to add any politican from louisville as well.quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    Originally posted by KYfatboy

    BTW, KYplumber is a gun owner/lover as am I. To a degree that kinda makes us cousins. Although I don't agree with him sitting back enjoying his gun rights without helping with the fight to keep those rights, as he learns more about how the world works he might change his attitude for the better.

    At least I can relate to his present attitude as it kinda matches mine when I was a young man.

    Call this regret for me being so harsh on him or whatever.


    I live in Kentucky; all i need to do to further my right to own a weapon is go buy 1. We have NEXT TO NILL for gun laws here.

    GOD BLESS KENTUCKY after fletcher leaves or dies :)
    he's such a puke... so is the mayor of lexington
    these 2 people are why i think public hangings should be reinstated...
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    Even if i thought the NRA was of help, I couldnt afford to pay them.
    There are many MANY MANY MANY organizations to help us, all you have to do is send money, they take that money go sit in DC and buy whoever they can. I do not support this, these lobbyist people are buying and selling America; The dubai ports deal just put an exclamation point on this fact. The fact is WE AMERICANS DONT LIKE IT AT ALL. We are being forced into a deal head first by an administration who MUST cover their politicalAZZ, as to not look racist? To the very people whom we have evidence have aided these civilian killing a****le's 'terrorist' IM NOT TERRORIZED BY THESE PUKES let that be known! I love my country and do not fear these camelback peoples rage. I know most here would agree with me, for the simple fact is this is our country we are free we own guns and we dare ya.

    Anyways, throwing money at problems doesnt solve it! Look at the kids in this country they have better damn toys than i do! and they still scream at thier parents and crap like that. Backbones are not sold separately; They are endowed to you by your creator.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    Originally posted by KYfatboy

    BTW, KYplumber is a gun owner/lover as am I. To a degree that kinda makes us cousins. Although I don't agree with him sitting back enjoying his gun rights without helping with the fight to keep those rights, as he learns more about how the world works he might change his attitude for the better.

    At least I can relate to his present attitude as it kinda matches mine when I was a young man.

    Call this regret for me being so harsh on him or whatever.


    I live in Kentucky; all i need to do to further my right to own a weapon is go buy 1. We have NEXT TO NILL for gun laws here.

    GOD BLESS KENTUCKY after fletcher leaves or dies :)
    he's such a puke... so is the mayor of lexington
    these 2 people are why i think public hangings should be reinstated...


    Well, truly I am happy that you live somewhere that has good gun rights. But did you notice the 10 year so-called FEDERAL (this include you living in KY) assault weapons ban? It would still be preventing you from buying and/or owning a tremendous amount of guns and accessories simply because of the way they look. Not trying to be a smart *, but I do wonder how you missed that 10 year ban. And do you know what made it disappear? Would you like to know?

    I'm sincerely not wishing you KY people bad luck, but it looks like when the time comes that you start losing your gun rights, organizations like the NRA, GOA, SAF, etc. will probably hear you knocking loudly on their door. Then maybe we can all work together and put a stop to the steady lose of gun rights.

    Until then, and no offense intended, at least on a national gun law level, you are a free rider.
  • KYfatboyKYfatboy Member Posts: 859 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well the 10 year federal ban sucked, it did. I was not prevented from buying any type of gun though. During the 10 year ban, I bought 3 ar15s, several hi cap mags for them as well as 5 different AK's and countless hi cap mags. I never bought A pistol with less than A 13 round clip, execpt for my 1911's. The guns we buy at the flea markets, we got plenty of guns in KY to go around. Plenty of ammo to. Don't get me wrong TR, I do think the NRA plays A vital role, but I myself cannot support an organazation that compromises our rights away, and then calls it A victory.
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    quote:Originally posted by kyplumber
    quote:Originally posted by tr fox
    Originally posted by KYfatboy

    BTW, KYplumber is a gun owner/lover as am I. To a degree that kinda makes us cousins. Although I don't agree with him sitting back enjoying his gun rights without helping with the fight to keep those rights, as he learns more about how the world works he might change his attitude for the better.

    At least I can relate to his present attitude as it kinda matches mine when I was a young man.

    Call this regret for me being so harsh on him or whatever.


    I live in Kentucky; all i need to do to further my right to own a weapon is go buy 1. We have NEXT TO NILL for gun laws here.

    GOD BLESS KENTUCKY after fletcher leaves or dies :)
    he's such a puke... so is the mayor of lexington
    these 2 people are why i think public hangings should be reinstated...


    Well, truly I am happy that you live somewhere that has good gun rights. But did you notice the 10 year so-called FEDERAL (this include you living in KY) assault weapons ban? It would still be preventing you from buying and/or owning a tremendous amount of guns and accessories simply because of the way they look. Not trying to be a smart *, but I do wonder how you missed that 10 year ban. And do you know what made it disappear? Would you like to know?

    I'm sincerely not wishing you KY people bad luck, but it looks like when the time comes that you start losing your gun rights, organizations like the NRA, GOA, SAF, etc. will probably hear you knocking loudly on their door. Then maybe we can all work together and put a stop to the steady lose of gun rights.

    Until then, and no offense intended, at least on a national gun law level, you are a free rider.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Thanks for the explanation. We disagree, as with KYPlumber, but one way or another it will work out.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Being an NRA member, myself, I think the NRA should help Kevin. This would be an excellent time to have the Ka Viktim Disarmament Edikt declared unconstitutional, and we could conceivably do it, too!!

    Notice that South Dakota is getting a law in the works outlawing abortion on a wide scale. This is basically picking a fight, hoping it ends up is Supreme Court where it will probably upend Roe Vs. Wade, and make murdering unborns a crime, as it should have been all along. Now would be an excellent opportunity to start destroying gun kontrol in the courts.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    KYFatboy, I had a moment to think about this and I probably shouldn't miss a chance to post this reply. This is in regards to your stated ability to continue buying, owning (and maybe selling)items covered by the so-called AWB during the 10 year period the AWB was in effect. There is a subtle nuance you, and probably NUMEROUS others, seem to miss. In 1994 a very powerful group of anti-gun US senators and representatives put together the very restrictive and falsely labeled "assault weapons ban". As you may know, that AWB prohibited numerous types of guns and accessories. And anti-gun President Bill Clinton of course signed that bill into law.

    Now, just as a side note, generally speaking the law was a lie, was worthless, and did little or nothing to provide any extra safety or security to the American public. Reason being that the AWB banned something that 99.9% of American gun owners are ALREADY banned from owning; and that is a TRUE assault weapon. A TRUE assault firearm will fire more than one shot with a single pull of the trigger and arre used exclusively by police and military. I myself have owned guns for almost 50 years and yet I have NEVER been legally allowed to buy ANY firearm that will fire more than one bullet with only one pull of the trigger.

    Now there were also some accessories that were also banned, and I could make a pretty good story here and show just how stupid, ridiculous and worthless, for trying to provide more safety to the general public, that part of the AWB actually was. But that would take up a lot of space and this looks like it is going to be longer than I wanted. But just one small example. The AWB banned bayonet lugs on all "assault rifles". Now just when and where before the AWB went into effect had there been any crime problems with criminals using bayonets in the USA? That one example shows the typical naive, ignorant left-wing, liberal thinking. The AWB was a "solution" for a "problem" that didn't "exist". Anyway, moving on.

    I believe that I remember what happened. If anyone has hard facts that says otherwise, please chime in. During the fight over trying to pass the AWB, our side saw that it clearly could not be stopped from passing into law. The anti-gun people were just too strong in the US Senate, House and Clinton. So our side did the next best thing and COMPROMISED in at least two ways.

    One way. We got the proponents to agree to a 10 year "sunset clause" in which unless, after 10 years, both sides of congress passed either a temporary or even a permanent extension of the AWB, the ban would AUTOMATICALLY expire in 10 years. Which it did and that "compromise by our side" is the ONLY reason we no long suffer and struggle under the AWB. So for those of you who foam at the mouth every time the word "compromise" is mentioned or suggested, in such a case as I have just describe I'll take such a compromise each and every time . The "compromise" I just mentioned is the ONLY reason we no longer have the AWB.

    And here is another "compromise" I'll bet you will be happy that it happened. In 1994 the AWB gun banners wanted to get ALL items they considered to be "assault weapons and accesssories out of the hands of EVERY citizen. Now, the AWB did pass, yet you tell me that you gunners in KY continued to buy, sell, trade, keep and use the items that were "banned" by the AWB. Well, I sure you did as did I here in KS. But we were ONLY able to do this because of yet ANOTHER
    "compromise". That compromise was the "grandfather clause" inserted at the insistance of our side ONLY after our side cleary saw that passage of the AWB could NOT be stopped. Kinda like you flying a small airplane, all engines fail and you see yu CANNOT avoid a crash landing. Sure you could be hard-headed about your situation and say to your self "I'm going to glide this plane clear back to the airport". And of course you will probably just crash and die by gliding into a bunch of trees, a mountain, ground, etc. So, instead you "compromise" by looking for and choosing the closest place that looks to you might be good for a reasonable soft landing.

    And this second "compromise" was that any of the so-called and outlawed assault weapons and accessories, if made BEFORE the bank went into effect, could still legally be bought, sold, owned and used (except in states that had their own laws against it).

    All of what I have described above could not have been accomplished if all gun owners sat around doing nothing but clinging to their guns and claiming they could do so becasue of their "God-given rights". Instead it took millions of gun owners banding together and pooling their time, money, effort and political clout. And again, no offense intended (for now [:D]), but any gun owner who does not help with such efforts is a "free rider".

    Sometimes it is ignorant to refuse to "compromise".
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by gunphreak
    Being an NRA member, myself, I think the NRA should help Kevin. This would be an excellent time to have the Ka Viktim Disarmament Edikt declared unconstitutional, and we could conceivably do it, too!!

    Notice that South Dakota is getting a law in the works outlawing abortion on a wide scale. This is basically picking a fight, hoping it ends up is Supreme Court where it will probably upend Roe Vs. Wade, and make murdering unborns a crime, as it should have been all along. Now would be an excellent opportunity to start destroying gun kontrol in the courts.


    I agree and I made an effort to get the NRA to help by sending them an e-mail and mentioning that I represented three NRA members just in my own household. Got no reply.

    But I will continue to support the NRA for reasons too long to list here. One reason is that if I desperately need to get to work every day and must ride the bus (too poor not to, license suspended, etc) and there is only one bus that is availiable for me to ride, you will see me riding that bus. Even if I don't like that bus driver.

    Now I know there is more than one "bus" (NRA,GOA, SAF, etc) but we gunners don't have enough buses or bus lines (need more NRA's, GOA's, SAF's, etc) and we can't afford to lose even one.
  • kyplumberkyplumber Member Posts: 11,111
    edited November -1
    TR:

    you are glossing over the fact that i cant afford the NRA GOA ABC. etc
    So does that mean that my rights shouldnt be afforded me because i cant afford to pay for them?

    Perhaps the NRA is a good thing, but i dont have the money. If an organization really cared and wanted to be all inclusive would they charge money? or would they let people who believed in thier cause just put thier name on the roster?

    At one time i believe our graceful govt tried to tax voting to keep blacks from voting, so whats the difference to tax me for something i believe in ?

    You keep insinuating that im lazy, or stupid neither of which are true! If i was filthy rich off the backs of the working American via all my illegal workforce i'd send the NRA $20 for each man on this board that wanted me to. Im not rich, in fact im poor so i will send them nothing.

    I cant afford to buy my rights, and on top of that didnt hundreds of thousands of Americans die to SECURE these freedoms? Should we have to line some politicians pocket via a lobby group (NRA) to purchase trickle down freedom?

    The 'african-american' people rallied a million strong, those of us who think we have been robbed of our country by money greed and corruption better come at least 50x's that strong or its over.

    I wonder what good a civil war would do for our country? The dividing issue mainly being, we want our country back! No more will you be taxed 4 times in a row on that dollar bill. No more will you have to buy permits for something you are licensed to do. No more will you pay a federal income tax that has long outlived its purpose. No more will you have support a failing educational system. No more will the govt steal your money for your "future". No more will you pay for someone who is just too lazy to carry thier own weight. No more will you feed convicted pedophiles, or heartless killers. No more will you pay for shotty govt contractors half assing a job and triple charging the people. No more illegal 'cigarettes' in your own business. No more trillion dollar federal budgets, or billion dollar state budgets. No more buying and selling of our saftey and livelihood. No more buying and selling corrupt officials, any official caught profiting off the backs of the people will be hanged in town square. No more FREE HANDOUTS! this is America! Land of the free home of the brave! If you are hungry learn to plant corn, tend cattle no need for an EBT card! whos side would my neighor would be on, I wonder whos side my dad would be on? Whos side would you be on TR?


    Hitting on a point i made earlier about taxed 4 times; Say i grossed 700$ last week I seen roughly 480$ Say I took that 480 bought a pop and was taxed on that pop, not fair! Say i took my net earnings and went and bought a vehicle which would be taxed! also in the state of Kentucky your vehicle is taxed every year accoring to its value marked by the state. When I sell that vehicle it will be taxed again. Say i own 30 acres that will be taxed too.... all with money that was taxed before i even seen it...

    I could just puke....
    I should quit work have 11 kids and just sit at home and soak up the state and federal money that would be 'owed' me
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Thanks for taking the time to read my post and reply. But you gotta admit if you can afford even one gun and ammo, or if you can afford a computer and internet service, you can afford to send $25.00 each year to help the NRA. Or if you don't like the NRA, you can join up with the Gun Owners of America for only $20.00. Or if you can't afford that you can become a member of the Second Amendment Foundation for about as low as you want to go (5$, 10$??).

    Even if you don't agree with helping to prop up at least one pro-gun organization because you don't believe they do any good, you should still go ahead and send in your 5 or 10 dollars to the SAF just on the chance that they ARE doing some good. After all, most of us still have federal gun rights left and that can't/doesn't/won't/never will happen by accident or all by itself.

    Com'on. Skip that McDonalds supersized #1 meal tomorrow and join the SAF. You'll be glad you did [;)]
  • codenamepaulcodenamepaul Member Posts: 2,931
    edited November -1
    KYplumber- In light of your current situation, I offer at my expense, a one year NRA membership and 25 dollar gift to the NRA-ILA (that'll get you a pocketknife)send me the info via e-mail.

    Paul
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