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Something to think about...

gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
In this country, we are under the dark shroud of Victim Disarmament laws that include magazines not exceeding 10 rounds each, and semiautomatic rifles under extreme limitation.

I've heard people before say, "Why do you need so many bullets... it would only take me one."

Don't be too sure of that. An armed criminal with the intention of killing you is NOT like a paper target you shoot at during leizure-time. There are other things to deal with that are both stressful and random, such as cover, light conditions, the fact that you're dealing with a moving target, and an armed one that may undoubtedly shoot at you. One thing you don't want to have to do is reload during this type of situation. I would rather load up 18 9mm's and take care of business the best way I can. Better to have to many than not enough.

Something else. I've heard numerous people, including many on this board say, "A machine gun should only be used by law enforcement and military personnel." OK.... granted, a machine gun should not be used to hunt with, but now, lets give someone this situation. In 1-on-1 combat, one has to pull the trigger fast enough to hit his target before he gets himself shot. Now, let's look at the possibility of multiple armed criminals. When dealing with one, there is the chance they will run, meaning the confrontation is over. When there are several, and they know full well you are outgunned, they may instead attack. Can you pull a semiautomatic's trigger fast enough to shoot 6 people? Don't be simple. A machine gun, on the other hand, can achieve this.

Now, let's summarize this up for one more thought. You are the victim. The police are seldom there to save you, and it is not their job to protect you. When they encounter a hostile situation, they have body armor, whereby, chances are, you don't. They have hi-capacity mags in their weapons, whereby, you are not supposed to, and they can call for back-up, while you stand alone. They can call so many people to the scene of an extremely hostile situation, surrender is imminent. These two things are the only two things that make you stand out as a defense force, and they are not condoned by our local, state or federal government. I cannot empathize with these kind of victim disarmament laws. They are only subtle version of gun control in Nazi Germany, plain and simple.

Death to Tyrants!!!

Jesus Christ believed in the right to keep and bear arms, Luke 22:36.

-Gunphreak
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Comments

  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Ain't that the truth. Considering we are their employers, exactly how are we supposed to show respect for them when they continuously bite the hand that feeds them?? To me, law enforcement is essential, and should be taken care of by all that are affected. Law enforcement provided by Jack-Booted Thugs is not my idea of making the streets safer, it makes them more perilous, and your enemies are more than just typical muggers and rapists.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Jesus Christ believed in the right to keep and bear arms, Luke 22:36.

    -Gunphreak
  • Concealed_JusticeConcealed_Justice Member Posts: 30 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    It is as if our government wants us to have no defence against anything, no defence against criminals, no defence against a foreign threat such as terroists (WHAT ARE THE CHANCES OF THAT EVER HAPPENING AGAIN[:(!]) Sh|t are the cops gonna save me if some cracked out burglar breaks into my home with malicious intent? No, the cop will come after the fact and take pictures, scrape my dead as$ off the floor, cover up my raped wife and say "Poor Bastards" I mean lets get real guys, the United States of America wants its citizens to be TOTALLY dependant on them and totally helpless without them. So what are WE going to do?

    The structure is set, you never change it with a ballot poll.

    Give me my rights,
    liberty and freedom, or give me some time to stock up on ammo.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Amen to that, CJ.[:D]

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • Concealed_JusticeConcealed_Justice Member Posts: 30 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    But is there nothing that can be done? People like you and I can't stand alone against them, and its not like we can vote our problems away.

    The structure is set, you never change it with a ballot poll.

    Give me my rights,
    liberty and freedom, or give me some time to stock up on ammo.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It isn't like they are just pissing on us two. It's really only a matter of time before they do something so stupid, it gives us all a rude awakening. There are also a bunch of us here not blinded by their devilish deals who are sounding the trumpets of rational thinking and may find them to be formidable allies. It isn't over, yet. The USA Gestapo Akt has already come under fire by 13 cities and 60+ more cities are following suit in an act of non-compliance. More of them are inevitable. They are seeing these kommunistik laws for exactly what they are.... a step toward enslavement.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • Concealed_JusticeConcealed_Justice Member Posts: 30 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    THEY GOT NETWORKS AT WORK (atf/batf) keeping the sheep calm, brainwashing them, sh|t soon, they'll try and disarm us all.

    Well we need to spread the word and get some young polliticians.

    I will stand and fight for my freedom.

    But I'd reather just keep my god givin right to defend myself without having to die for it.

    I'd like to quote an INSPARATIONAL freedom fighter and a man who should be running for high office. Zack De La Rocha

    "Standing in line, beliveing he lies, bowing down to the flag, you got a bullet in your head." "Cuz all these punks got bullets in their head's, departments of police (and other agenceys) the judges, the feds!

    "DONT FREEZE WHEN ZERO HOUR COMES!" -Zack De La Rocha

    Something much be done, about vengance a badge and a gun, SO i'll rip the Mic, rip the stage, RIP THE SYSTEM. I was born to rage against them, NOW ACTION MUCT BE TAKEN, we dont need the key we'll break in.........I got no patiance now, so SICK of complacance now, so sick of, sick of, sick of.....YOU...THAT TIME HAs COM TO PAY!


    Just some lyrics that have been inspiring me for years.

    The structure is set, you never change it with a ballot poll.

    Give me my rights,
    liberty and freedom, or give me some time to stock up on ammo.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    That is why gun kontrol is used. Not for criminal control, but to disarm law abiders to pave the way for tyranny.

    Ban guns... make the streets safe for a political take over!!!

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • snake-eyessnake-eyes Member Posts: 869 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Calm down y'all and don't rage against the machine. Stock pile and live happy. WWW.CANNONFUSE.COM......


    I'm fighting the battle in California with an attorney here, tiz all we can do until the oil stops flowing.

    Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    .50BMG..... 671 grains of diplomacy.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • poppgunpoppgun Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Can someone tell me if a bb gun capable of shooting steel bb's at 1250 fps using CO2 at 1600psig ;full auto Apout 400 bb's per second be illegal????
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have never seen a pellet rifle able to fire at greater velocity than 1300 ft/sec. These ones also do not use CO2 to power them. I have seen a bb gun that hooks up to a freon can and can fire automatically at 800 rounds per minute. For environmental reasons, this is illegal. If there have been any more of these types of BB guns on the market, I have never seen them.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • poppgunpoppgun Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I know about the bb gun that uses freon , LARC M19a . This gun can be easily be modified to use Co2. Freon's pressure is about 80 psig. I have an idea on how to build a bb gun which operates on the same principle except it would use a co2 cylinder operating at a pressure of up to 1500 psig which could be regulated down to a lower pressure. At that high rate of fire and velocity I believe it could be very deadly.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    One sure way to make for a more "gun friendly enviroment" is to go out and create more peope like us gun like us who are friendly towards guns. Let me exaggerate to help make my point. If 225 million people in America owned or liked to shot guns, we would have no anti-gun problem. On the other hand, if it ever comes down to only 2 million people owning or liking to shot guns in America gun rights will be dead. So one way to fight for gun rights is to find people who have at least a small interest in learning about guns and take them out tosome fun place and introduce them to guns and shooting. Start with .22's and some targets that are fun such as bowling balls, etc. If you can't find any fun place to shoot, band together with some other local shooters and buy, build or rent a place or join some already existing shooting club and take a friend or neighbor. This is what I try to do.

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • Mr.PissyPantsMr.PissyPants Member Posts: 3,575
    edited November -1
    Good point tr fox. For the last several years I have been trying to get everyone I know involved in shooting sports. I sincerely think that if everyone did this and past on the tradition, that within another generation or two everyone would bear arms. Of course thats going to be a lot of work, but its fun [:p]

    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe."
    Luke 11:21
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Thanks Mr. Prissy Pants, and I can't thank you enough for the Luke 11:21 bible quote. I have read the bible looking for quotes that would justify the common man having the right to weapons but until now I only had the Luke 22:36 where Jesus COMMANDS his followers to arm themselves with a sword. And of course at the time a sword was the ultimate self defense weapon in that it could be carried and even concealed and was not used for hunting or sport but for self defense. I truly think there is enough in the bible that we could claim a religious right to own weapons. I bet that would actually fly in court when you consider that Eskimos, American Indians, witches, and prison inmates have sued the government on the basis of their religious beliefs and won special rights. If anyone is interrested in helping me find a way to make this happen e-mail me at [email protected] If anyone thinks this is a wild idea, remember that the entire Catholic Church was founded on one single sentence in the Bible. Larry

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Gunphreak, for me there is no need to decide if owning machineguns are a good idea or not. Because I feel that if we make owning machineguns part of our claim to the right keep and bear arms, then we will lose the support of 95% of the U.S. population for ANY gun rights. Then we are truly lost. Larry

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You're probably right, but it still comes down to this. As far as I'm concerned, if it's good enough for law enforcement, it's good enough for citizens. These weapons would be very useful in the sequence of order for an armed citizenry that put the true check and balance on our fuds, and are necessary for the equipping of a well-regulated militia.

    As for loss of support, gun rights are not supposed to be voted on, so that 19 out of 20 that doesn't like it, too bad!!!

    In some states, owning them is fully legal, but at the same time, should be NO bans on their manufacture, and registration is a claim of guilt until innocence is proved.... and even then you're guilty, and completely screwed.

    Better to have more than enough than not enough.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You're probably right, but it still comes down to this. As far as I'm concerned, if it's good enough for law enforcement, it's good enough for citizens. These weapons would be very useful in the sequence of order for an armed citizenry that put the true check and balance on our fuds, and are necessary for the equipping of a well-regulated militia.

    As for loss of support, gun rights are not supposed to be voted on, so that 19 out of 20 that doesn't like it, too bad!!!

    In some states, owning them is fully legal, but at the same time, should be NO bans on their manufacture, and registration is a claim of guilt until innocence is proved.... and even then you're guilty, and completely screwed.

    Better to have more than enough than not enough.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    And here's the next thing you can ponder for a while. Registration leads to confiscation. Why? Because the fact that these things are registered is like an admission of guilt. Take this statement for example:

    Megan's laws require repeat sex offenders to report to local authorities before moving into a neighborhood and REGISTER with them upon arrival.

    Replace "Megan" with "Brady", "repeat sex offenders" with "prospective gun owners", "local authorities" with "FBI or ATF" (quite a step up from local authorities, I might add), "moving into a neighborhood" with "purchasing a firearm", and "arrival" with "purchase". This is what we get.

    Brady's laws require prospective gun owners to report to the FBI or ATF before purchasing a firearm and REGISTER with them upon purchase.

    That scheme makes all gun owners criminalized and demonized just for exercising a right. But here's the truth. They are the demons.

    You want a Megan law that works. A law that requires repeat sex offenders to check into the morgue will be a good way to start that one off.

    At the same time, you want gun legislation that works... repeal them all!!!

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    gunphreak, you and I are on the same side of the debating table and I agree with some of what you say. However, we cannot just say "screw the ones who don't agree with us" and here is why. We can go ahead and write off the extremist anti-gun people but we need the support of the great middle "undecided". If we lose all support except from the gun owners, the next step for the anti-gunners is to repeal the U.S. 2nd Amendent and then what will we have to stand on? Or the anit-gunners could ever force a case involving the 2nd admendment to the U.S. Supreme Court for a final decision that has never been tested. If the great majority of U.S.citizens become anti-gun it would so easy for the supreme court to rule against the 2nd admendment. We pro-gunners can't even let the rest of the world know we are angry about the unfair treatment of gun rights. I mean, a visibly angry man with a gun in his hand is going to make even a gunlover like me uneasy. We just have to find ways to get smarter and become a "harder target". We progun people have conceeded too much of the high ground to the anti-gunners. larry

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I fully agree with that. I guess the bottom line would be that, while all gun kontrol is unconstitutional, we obviously can't leave the decision of unconstitutionality up to the courts. We've seen where that goes. And with the enemy of the liberal media alongside that, I'm surprised the 2nd Amendment hasn't already been repealed, and the 2nd revolution hasn't already taken place.

    Hey fox, they want you to have a cell phone for defense. Call 911, and then call for a pizza and see which one gets there first.

    I don't dial 911.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • poppgunpoppgun Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Guys
    Look at what is being proposed at www.freestateproject.org and www.evote.com. Your thoughts?
  • poppgunpoppgun Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Guys
    Look at what is being proposed at www.freestateproject.org and www.evote.com. Your thoughts?
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    Roger that gunphreak. To protect your life a gun in the hand is worth more than a cop on the phone.

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • tr foxtr fox Member Posts: 13,856
    edited November -1
    popgun, thanks for that freestate web site info. When I get retired and can live anywhere (I hope) I am there. I was unable to access the evote site. Larry

    if they don't want us to have guns for self defense, what do they want us to have?
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Never trust a cop that tells you, "You can't just take the law into your hands." What he really is saying is, "You have no right to defend yourself."

    The last one that told me that, I responded, "So that means that you will be there to stop them??" He replied, "I can't guarantee it."

    Then I responded, and I can quote."Then you do what you have to do, I'll do what I have to do, and you can clean their sorry * off the kitchen when I send him to Hell."

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • Delta514Delta514 Member Posts: 440 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    People forget the metamorphosis of how Regulations start and how they End. Often as not, there is some rational behind the initial concept, but as one option is lost another presents itself. I never hear the Higherarchy talking of their own protection, nor do I hear ATF talk of giving up their weapons? Didn't the original plan for Social Security state "Your Social Security Number would not be used for Identification Purpose"? There are those that trust their Government, personally I trust Iron and Steel; they are much less pliable and are less subject to the elements.

    Ronnie G. Perkins
  • BerettafanBerettafan Member Posts: 592 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have never had a problem with people who have a personal choice not to like firearms, but I have a major problem with those people who tell us that we don't have the right to like guns(or have and bear, for that matter). I am a strong advocate of our 2nd amendment, and I will argue with anyone who says that it does not secure the individual's rights, however, by forcing our beliefs of the 2nd amendment on others, we are lowering ourselves to their level.

    I agree with everything that has been brought up so far on this discussion, and I agree that citizens have the right to the same equipment as law enforcement. We must remember that police are citizens too, and if our rights to certain firearms are taken away, their's might be next. For instance, if people like Sarah Brady had their way, the police would hear something like this, "Well, we have successfully disarmed the public (aka left them defenseless), and since you don't have to worry about being shot at, we want your guns too." then it's too late, and the entire society is in danger. We must keep on keeping on. We have the right to peacably assemble, and the right of a readress of grievances against the government. The key is to do it the right way, and keep fighting it in the legislation.

    It is also interesting to see that all of the countries that enacted registration laws are also now the countries that have illegalized and confiscated firearms from the public. That is almost unfailingly the first step to confiscation. The argument that the government needs to know who has weapons to keep them in check is erronous. According to Prof. John Lott ("More Guns, Less Crime), only one CCW permit holder has ever been brought up on firearms related charges, and he was found to be just because it was self-defense. There is no true account of that would lead us to believe that the government's regulation of firearms (Brady Bill etc.) makes us any more safe, in fact, the evidence tells the opposite of that.

    Also, there was already legislation in effect that made it illegal for the guy who shot Mrs. Brady's family to have a firearm there. While I am sorry for the Brady family, more legislation is irrelevant, and counter-productive. If that legislation had not been in effect, then it's very likely that a law-abiding citizen may have been able to effectively end that situation. They don't want you to think and know that though, because that makes you a threat to their political agendas. If we lay down, and let them continue on the road they are going, we will end up just like every other 3rd World, unarmed, defenseless, crime-ridden, no rights or liberties, dictatorial society. We need to see the systematic attempt to disarm our country, which was only able to become it's own country because of the dedication of patriots, and the arms they were able to secure.

    We must remain civil, so we keep validity, truth, and right on our side, to re-enforce our side of the debate. I am a die hard advocate of the 2nd amendment, and I will stand my that as long as I live. God bless, and pass the ammo.

    "No free man will be debarred the use of arms." Thomas Jefferson
  • Delta514Delta514 Member Posts: 440 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    WOULD IT COME AS A GREAT SUPRISE? A "National Federation of America". The merging of Mexico and the United States, possibly Canada at a later date? The Constitution of These United States would be renderd Null and Void. Do you think it can't happen? Do you think this Senario hasn't already occured to some in High Office (or on the Board of Directors)? What would it take to bring this off? How about 20 million Spanish Americans that would vote vs 30 million Americans that would not vote, another 10 million that believe it would all be for the better of the Economy, and 20 million Liberals that seem to have no thought process at all.
    Can you not hear their argument? "Patroling the border cost, we could eliminate the NIS alltogether, we would have Mexican Oil at our disposal, we could better control Drugs coming into the country". Let the SPIN DOCTORS get together and most Americans can be sold the concept with little or no effort.
    Does anyone recall the United States Senators having shares in the National Fruit Company? Sending the CIA too bomb Costa Rica with old prop planes painted with Honduras markings? (of course we stepped in to save the day). Is anyone aware of the "Social Security" our Elected Leaders, elected to vote for themselves? Want to know why it would be so convienant to disarm the American People (in the guise of doing us a service)? Why was 58,000 dead in Vietnam (where are the MIAS?) a "Not So Big Deal", while one Press Secretary shot is? Who supported the Shah of Iran against the Iranian People, then inturn supported the Iraqis against the Iranians, and now would support the Iranians against the Iraqis? Wasn't it the same Government that supported Noriega at Panama, that supported Marcos in the Phillipines, the same country that supported Bin Laden in Afganistan? In my HUMBLE OPINION: The Patriot American had better wake up and smell the coffee. Have YOU done all within your power to lift and support your country, to rectify wrongs, or is the Super Bowl higher on your priorty list? This Country is in Dire need of a rebirth and under the same Constitution that gave it birth in the first place. Keep playing under the Illusion of Freedom until you can no longer maintain the Illusion.

    Ronnie G. Perkins
  • BerettafanBerettafan Member Posts: 592 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I agree Delta, we do need to return to the funamentals that our country started with.

    I found that one of the best ways to properly educate people on this issue is really to take them out, teach them the responsibility of firearms, then let them shoot. I completely support the 2nd, and I am a CC Permit holder. I have several students at my college, as well as some staff who have asked me, after many debates with them, how to shoot. Many of them had bought into the PC bullcrap from the media about how guns are bad, and how we need to get rid of them. After sharing some facts with them, and establishing the truth, they eagerly want to learn how to shoot. While a couple of them only want to learn for target practice, many of them want to learn for the purpose of self-defense. It seems to me that everyone that I have talked to about this issue has come to agree with me that not only are guns NOT INHERENTLY bad, but that they have and do play a large positive role in our society.
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hey Ronnie,

    Of course that is a good argument, and I would fully be behind you on that. When are we as a populace going to learn???

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • Delta514Delta514 Member Posts: 440 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    GUNNY: Seems every generation of Humanity has to re-learn what they should have already known. Every generation thinks it is smarter than the proceeding generation. Perhaps we should be teaching Psychology and Philosophy, instead of Sex Education (Ergo: the Great Potential of Homosexuality, or The Reproductive System) by the age of 8.
    Humanity goes backward as fast as it goes forward, for every lesson learned, there appears to be something Important and Basic forgotten. The Basic Human Physique hasn't changed since man crawled out of the cave. SQUARE 1 = Only the strong survive (and being prepared doesn't seem to hurt either).
    This is not the first time in History when the Higharchy attempts to disarm the "People", and in the guise of doing them a favor. Greed and the Want of Power has little to do with Religion (yet these Mongers are the first to put on the cloak of religion)while the Enforcers will state "We are only doing our job". Trust; I am not preaching Disention, if anything I would teach History, Metamorphosis, and Apathy. Wasn't it Adolf Hitler that said "Lucky the Goverment when it's People don't pay attention"?
    The right (and obligation)to protect oneself and it's own, belongs to every living organizm on Plant Earth, why should Hard Working , Honest men and women not be afforded the same consideration as the lowest life form in the Universe? Let the Gullible lay down and roll over, as for me: "Give me Liberty or Give me Death".

    Ronnie G. Perkins
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Tell me about it Ronnie. I find the more I am around people, the more the nooses to which they are led around by gets tighter and tighter. Hard to imagine all the people who will become the drones of the new world order. The number is frightening.

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • Delta514Delta514 Member Posts: 440 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Gentlemen: Forcing our beliefs on others is not an option. When King George forced his belief's on us, did we not inturn force our opinions on him? Does not the ATF operate with FORCE? Please do not underestimate Force. I know Diplomacy sounds more Civilized, but to rely on Diplomacy alone is a fools game. Ask any History Professor about Diplomacy vs Power. Ask the English about the French, the French about the Germans, the Germans about the Romans, the Romans about the Carthagenians. Ask The Charles Martel about the Moors, ask the American Indian about the White Mans diplomacy. Ask the Zulu about the English, the Aztec about the Spanish, the Russians about Napoleon, the Irish about the English, the English about the Romans. Ask the Russians about American Diplomacy during the Planned Invasion of Cuba. Ask Castro about his request for help from the USA (not forth coming) why and why not. Ask the Mafia about Diplomacy. Ask Randy Weaver about Ruby Ridge. Diplomacy is usually a stall tactic prior to attack, as we are now using Diplomacy in prepration to attack Iraq. Tora, Tora, Tora.

    Ronnie G. Perkins
  • rusty1rusty1 Member Posts: 292 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Somewere there has to be a limit if we all had machine guns there would be alot of by standers hit.and next you would cannons and rockets.I don't believe that the government want to disarm us but they do want us controlled that is what govern means.we must have LAW. and i do like high caps mags and you can still get them its all about MONEY they cost more.IF THIS COUNTRY WAS EVER INVADED BY ANOTHER ARMY AND WE WERE THE LAST LINE OF DEFENSE IT WOULD BE THE BEST RESISTANCE EVER BECAUSE EVERBODY AND THEIR GRANNY WOULD BE SHOOTING.one thing about it we don't quit and we will all fight to the in. and have you noticed they have been talking about taking our gun since the 70s an all it did was to drive up the price of guns and do you remember having to sign for ammo THANKS NRA that would just open up the black market the government learned that prohibition don't work they found that out in the 20s we all must stand together and work for change.

    rusty1
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hey Rusty. You actually believe the government is there to control us??? You must have succumbed to the indoctrination process in school. Let's see where it has taken us. Before 1934, when machine guns were legal, they posed a small threat to people, because those who owned them weren't stupid with them. So, why then were they banned and restricted at that point? Simple. The feds, under FDR, were afraid of the people at large rising up against their desires, their 16th Amendment, their oppressive laws, both the ones on the books and the ones yet to come, and thus the process of control came to be, just like something right out of the Kommunist Manifesto. Through a process of dividing the nation, dumbing it down, and finally removing the Christian roots from it in 1963 (Engel v. Vitale, I believe it was) For my support of these things, I will site the following causes since 1940 and tell you what has happened. Literacy is down, SAT scores down 80 points, unwed mothers spikes upward, divorce skyrockets, STD's spikes heavily upward, violent crime rises to the highest percentage it has ever been in the country EVER, teenage sex rises steadily, abortions rise steadily.... anyone want to take a guess as to when this all began??? If you guessed 1963, pat yourself on the back. Before then, everything listed was extremely low.

    You want gun control that works? Limiting manufacture only hurts businesses, and banning stuff makes things unbearable for those same countries. Making a million restrictions only creates criminals out of people not inclined nor determined to commit crimes. There is only one way. Repeal it all and leave the prospect of responsibilities to the owners. Thus, if you cannot show responsibility, the new prospect of justice will confront you, possibly at the price of death.

    Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than all my guns combined (0)

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • rusty1rusty1 Member Posts: 292 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    GUNPHREAK I know that our the government controls us and so will SADDAM SOON and it sounds like some of us or out of control BUT NOT YOU gunphreak you just sound mad and fed up. but handing out machine guns is not the answer the point i am trying to make is yes we still have problems but if we appointed you KING we would still have problems i don't know the answers. please i am not trying to make anyone mad but i do feel that we must have LAWS and yes OUR GOVERNMENT WANT US ARMED but not so well as to bear arm against it.if they wanted our guns they could have gotten them by now in the 60s their was not as many pistol packers till someone mention that hand guns would be outlawed and only outlaws would have guns .that only boosted sales because people who didn't like guns went and got thim and since then everone has gone gun crazy.and if you must have a fully automatic you can get a class III PERMIT and if you want high cap mag do like i do go to gun brokers and bidd and gunphreak i do agree with a lot of what you are saying just not all that is what makes is america i can say what i feel and i love it. A WELL TRAINED ARMY IS A DANGEROUS THING IN TIMES OF PEACE

    HAVE A NICE DAY AND MAY GOD BLESS US ALL

    rusty1
  • Delta514Delta514 Member Posts: 440 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    GUNNY: It is obvious Rusty is aware of Government Control (or attempt at control)(remember when the youth of France stated: "Better Red than Dead"?) I don't think Cowards gave us the Constitution, I also do not think Cowards will help us keep it. Life is so precious (we must maintain NINTINDO TIME while on the Big Blue Marble)? Shows something about PRIORITES, odd how secondary Freedom is when you and generations before you have languished under it.
    When the CHIT hits the SHAN, watch the Liberals cry FOUL, (for how much good that will do). Next! they will ahcome knocking at who's door? Like the "Three Little Pigs". I personally refuse to build my future or my family's future from Straw. Time and the Study of History, plus Psycology, has taught lessons that (for some Stoopid Reason) must be re-learned? Rusty is merely Laboring under a Mis-conception, not very well studdied and very objective, (but means well). As my Ol Momma used to say: "The path to hell is paved with good intentions", I would add; "Action speaks louder than words". I will leave Rusty with this quote and one I adhere to, "I am as desirious of being a good Citizen as I am of being Bad Subject".

    Ronnie G. Perkins
  • gunphreakgunphreak Member Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Rusty... first of all, I am NOT a monarchist. I'm not an anarchist. I am a Constitutionalist. Is I were president, the country as you know it would be completely different. I can assure you this.. if it were not a provision of the Constitution, it would be taken under consideration as an add-on. If it were arbitrary, it would be STRUCK DOWN AS UNCONSTITUTIONAL. That would mean NO GUN CONTROL, no Separation of Church and State twistings (the way it was intended, not this sick version of what it has become), no soldiers abroad (fend for yourselves) Our troops would be used to secure our boarders, no 16th Amendment, no Campaign Finance reform, no Homeland Security Department, no government indoctrination in schools, no ATF or other infringements to the 4th Amendment, Roe v. Wade overturned (All have the right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, as prescribed by the Constitution and the pertaining amendments) politicians would be removed from office for going against the Constitution (empty out the Senate and House, you think), no sovereign surrendering treaties, such as NAFTA, no handouts abroad and NO BIG BROTHER.

    Why should I have to pay and register to own Class III things? That is clearly violations of the 2nd and 4th Amendments. I should neither have to pay for things and pay premium prices due to availability because they cannot be produced anymore. That is just plain BS.

    But as if I thought I heard something intelligent, it seemed to come completely by accident. The Government wants us to be armed (wrong), but not so armed we pose a threat to them. Of course they don't want us to be able to do anything about their oppressive rule. The 2nd Amendment was put in place as a check and balance for the people to hold the government in check when they step out of line more than anything else. The Constitution was created by people who distrusted big government. Has it become obvious as to why, yet???

    Death to Tyrants!!!

    Those who would offer any interpretation that would relegate Amendment II to "relic" status of a bygone era are blatantly stating that the remainder of the Bill of Rights isn't worth a damn, either.

    Luke 22:36.
  • rusty1rusty1 Member Posts: 292 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    MY APOLOGY TO YOU GUNHREAK I TOTALLY MISUNDERSTOOD YOU WE DO HAVE TO MUCH GOVERNMENT.

    rusty1
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